How would Bruce Lee have fared in the UFC?

[A_C_Slater]

[Luzion]

Are you talking about if he was still alive today, or if he fought in the UFC at his physically most fit period of his life?

[The Truth]

Bruce lee would have gotten his face kicked in and its not close. He had little ground game, and his stand game wouldn't be enough to overcome what he lacked on the ground. Not to mention the good thai boxers and western boxers would smashs his face standing up.

1 argument for bruce lee... He was an amazing athlete, and a hard worker. If he was alive today, we could argue that he would have been a ju jitzu expert and worked on heavy mui thai game. Then he could have been among the top. However, using the style he used in his day, he stands no chance.

This is coming from my personal experience of 3 years background in NHB combat.

[Blarg]

[ QUOTE ]
Bruce lee would have gotten his face kicked in and its not close. He had little ground game, and his stand game wouldn't be enough to overcome what he lacked on the ground. Not to mention the good thai boxers and western boxers would smashs his face standing up.

1 argument for bruce lee... He was an amazing athlete, and a hard worker. If he was alive today, we could argue that he would have been a ju jitzu expert and worked on heavy mui thai game. Then he could have been among the top. However, using the style he used in his day, he stands no chance.

This is coming from my personal experience of 3 years background in NHB combat.

[/ QUOTE ]

Which is equivalent to zero knowledge of what you are talking about.

Muay thai fighters have been beaten. Ask Benny Urquidez. They're good, and have my immense respect, but not superhuman.

Jiu-jitsu fighters have been beaten. That's how Karate, from Okinawa, somehow eventually became commonly thought of as a Japanese art. Gichin Funakoshi came over to Japan and took on all Japanese comers, and was so successful Karate dwarfed jiu-jitsu in Japan and spread elsewhere rapidly.

You have really no knowledge whatsoever of Lee's stand-up game; you really shouldn't have said a thing in that regard. Hands were Bruce's specialty and the main focus of his concentration. Saying he would be out-boxed by the calibre of boxers in today's cage matches is absurd. One of Bruce's first students was a 220 lb. undefeated golden gloves boxer, and Bruce cut through him like butter when practically still a child, at 18. That boxer later became one of Bruce's first assistant instructors, after having a George Foreman-like realization that the skills he had built his whole sense of self around were useless when confronted by a skinny little guy who in America had a stature more like a boy's than a man's. Bruce wasn't a forms guy; he sparred constantly, almost always against people much bigger than he was, and dominated. With his hands. He was classically trained in a very close-range hands-oriented style, and broadened his training methods from there.

Bruce's stand-up game was outstanding. American Kempo founder Ed Parker said he was "one in a billion." There aren't that many billions around.

His major weakness was in ground work. He simply hadn't trained in it to anywhere near the extent he trained his hands, or even his legs. Given time, he undoubtedly would have developed a good ground game. He was certainly pursuing it long before it became popular among strikers. Whether he would be exceptional at it is anyone's guess, but considering his exceptional athleticism and enormous drive, it's very unlikely he wouldn't have eventually gotten pretty good at it.

But believe it or not, all fights do not go to the ground, and the ground is not always the smartest place to take them.

Bruce didn't have the size to absorb blows easily. That doesn't mean he would lose in a stand-up fight. And it certainly doesn't mean he would be forced to the ground.

He wasn't superman, but his strengths were as real as his weaknesses, and far more remarkable.

[The Truth]

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[ QUOTE ]
Bruce lee would have gotten his face kicked in and its not close. He had little ground game, and his stand game wouldn't be enough to overcome what he lacked on the ground. Not to mention the good thai boxers and western boxers would smashs his face standing up.

1 argument for bruce lee... He was an amazing athlete, and a hard worker. If he was alive today, we could argue that he would have been a ju jitzu expert and worked on heavy mui thai game. Then he could have been among the top. However, using the style he used in his day, he stands no chance.

This is coming from my personal experience of 3 years background in NHB combat.

[/ QUOTE ]

Which is equivalent to zero knowledge of what you are talking about.

Muay thai fighters have been beaten. Ask Benny Urquidez. They're good, and have my immense respect, but not superhuman.

Jiu-jitsu fighters have been beaten. That's how Karate, from Okinawa, somehow eventually became commonly thought of as a Japanese art. Gichin Funakoshi came over to Japan and took on all Japanese comers, and was so successful Karate dwarfed jiu-jitsu in Japan and spread elsewhere rapidly.

You have really no knowledge whatsoever of Lee's stand-up game; you really shouldn't have said a thing in that regard. Hands were Bruce's specialty and the main focus of his concentration. Saying he would be out-boxed by the calibre of boxers in today's cage matches is absurd. One of Bruce's first students was a 220 lb. undefeated golden gloves boxer, and Bruce cut through him like butter when practically still a child, at 18. That boxer later became one of Bruce's first assistant instructors, after having a George Foreman-like realization that the skills he had built his whole sense of self around were useless when confronted by a skinny little guy who in America had a stature more like a boy's than a man's. Bruce wasn't a forms guy; he sparred constantly, almost always against people much bigger than he was, and dominated. With his hands. He was classically trained in a very close-range hands-oriented style, and broadened his training methods from there.

Bruce's stand-up game was outstanding. American Kempo founder Ed Parker said he was "one in a billion." There aren't that many billions around.

His weaknesses were in ground work. He simply hadn't trained in it to anywhere near the extent he trained his hands, or even his legs. Given time, he undoubtedly would have developed a good ground game. He was certainly pursuing it long before it became popular among strikers. Whether he would be exceptional at it is anyone's guess, but considering his exceptional athleticism and enormous drive, it's very unlikely he wouldn't have eventually gotten pretty good at it.

But believe it or not, all fights do not go to the ground, and the ground is not always the smartest place to take them.

Seriously, Bruce's weaknesses were primarily that he didn't have the size to absorb blows easily, and that his groundwork wasn't up to the level of his standing game. That doesn't mean he wouldn't have improved his ground game in time -- with his orientation and ego, doing so would have been pretty much a certainty -- his ego alone would have demanded it. That doesn't mean he would be forced to the ground in a fight. And it certainly doesn't mean he would lose in a standard stand-up fight.

He wasn't superman, but his strengths were as real as his weaknesses, and far more remarkable.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not positive, but I think you said karate (I pray you were at least talking about Kempo Karate) was somehow better than ju jitzu for hand to hand combat, which is not only untrue, it is simply stupid.

The gracie family had an open challenge to the world for many many years and remained undefeated until just the last 10 years.
Ground game is of extreme importance. You will NOT succeed as a NHB fighter without fairly strong ground game. This includes take downs and defence (wrestling or judo) and at least a competence in submission wrestling or ju jitzu.

As far as bruce lee's stand up game, his style was jeet kune do. How many jeet kune do fighters excel in modern NHB combat?

thats right.

As far as my experience in NHB, It has shown me how the greatest fighters in the world today train. Chuck Lidell, the guys out of the lions den (shamrock etc.), Bas Ruten out at beverly hills ju jitzu. Most of these major gyms share a similar training regimen.

This is because it works.

What does this consist off?

Ju jitzu, muy thai and western boxing. Include some wrestling take down techniques and some judo stuff.

I never said thai fighters were invencible, I said the style is important to train, it is a strong mix of western boxing with deadly knees and elbows. I personally strive to do well and muy thai, but I am much stronger in western boxing.

As far as stand up vs ground game. Watch Grace dominate the old UFC's before everybody starting picking up ground game. It was sick.

[Blarg]

It's history, not theory. You're way too caught up in theory. If you don't even know the most elementary history of karate, then you are very ignorant when it comes to martial arts.

Holding NHB tournaments as the measure of anything but NHB tournaments is a big mistake.

The idea that you have any idea who the greatest fighters in the world are is a pretty wild one indeed.

[Luzion]

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I'm not positive, but I think you said karate (I pray you were at least talking about Kempo Karate) was somehow better than ju jitzu for hand to hand combat, which is not only untrue, it is simply stupid.

[/ QUOTE ]

No, he is pointing out that the father of modern karate popularized Karate over Jujitsu in Japan.

[ QUOTE ]
The gracie family had an open challenge to the world for many many years and remained undefeated until just the last 10 years.
Ground game is of extreme importance. You will NOT succeed as a NHB fighter without fairly strong ground game. This includes take downs and defence (wrestling or judo) and at least a competence in submission wrestling or ju jitzu.

[/ QUOTE ]

You DO realize that Jujitsu is a general term. Brazilian Jujitsu is just ONE specific style of jujitsu, and is unique because it emphasizes ground game. I wouldnt be surprised if you didnt even know what traditional Jujitsu is like, since you spelled jujitsu incorrectly over and over.

You clearly showed your ignorance when you assumed brazilian jujitsu speaks for all styles of jujitsu.

[ QUOTE ]
As far as bruce lee's stand up game, his style was jeet kune do. How many jeet kune do fighters excel in modern NHB combat?

[/ QUOTE ]

You are pretty retarded. Jeet Kune Do is NOT a system. Its how Bruce Lee interpreted combat in general. For him, it combined western boxing, various kicking styles, wing chun close quarter trapping, and even ground work. He has plenty of examples in his book with notes and examples of western boxing techniques, jujitsu techniques, aikido takedowns, wrestling takedowns, muay thai kicks, savate kicks, etc etc etc. You could say its well rounded and adaptive. How can you even argue with that? You are pretty ignorant.


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As far as my experience in NHB, It has shown me how the greatest fighters in the world today train. Chuck Lidell, the guys out of the lions den (shamrock etc.), Bas Ruten out at beverly hills ju jitzu. Most of these major gyms share a similar training regimen.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you mean they place great emphasis on physical well being, quick movements, and well rounded ness in fighting styles/abilities? Do they take punching skills, kicking abilities, and grappling seriously? Are they always looking to improve themselves and find an edge in combat? Sounds like some revolutionary ideas Bruce Lee came up with 30-40 years ago! WOW!

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Ju jitzu, muy thai and western boxing. Include some wrestling take down techniques and some judo stuff.

[/ QUOTE ]

Uhhh.. I hope you DO know that Judo is simply a derivative of Jujitsu; its Jujitsu watered down... So why mention it twice? Because you simply dont even know what you are talking about.

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I never said thai fighters were invencible, I said the style is important to train, it is a strong mix of western boxing with deadly knees and elbows. I personally strive to do well and muy thai, but I am much stronger in western boxing.

[/ QUOTE ]

Bruce Lee gave props to Muay Thai.

[JoshuaD]

If the UFC is done by weight classes I think Bruce Lee would own his division.

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
If the UFC is done by weight classes I think Bruce Lee would own his division.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yea. The 112 lb and under would be all his.

[Rev. Good Will]

BL in his prime would have pwned all. He was the one who first said fighters should crosstrain different styles