QQ against raise and reraise

silkyslim · #1 09-13-2005, 01:44 PM

Villian is 42/16/2 and goes to showdown about half the time. Original pf raiser is 28/16. We arent supposed to fold QQ to a 3-bet, so i think pf is std. Flop 3 bettor leads, i have to raise i think. what to do after 3-bet? need to see a showdown??

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (7 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is Button with Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG raises, MP1 3-bets, 2 folds, Hero caps, 2 folds, UTG calls, MP1 calls.

Flop: (13.50 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
UTG checks, MP1 bets, Hero raises, UTG folds, MP1 3-bets, Hero calls.

Turn: (9.75 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
MP1 bets, Hero ........

poboys · #2 09-13-2005, 01:47 PM

I'd take the WA/WB line here. Call if bet into, or bet if checked to (for both the turn and the river).

silkyslim · #3 09-13-2005, 01:54 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I'd take the WA/WB line here. Call if bet into, or bet if checked to (for both the turn and the river).

[/ QUOTE ]
can you explain why, what do u put villian on. its hard with his stats, but plz try

#4 09-13-2005, 01:57 PM

I think he has a PP higher that 8's. So it would be very read dependent, for example how aggressively had he been playing his PP before. Or he has a set of 2's or something gay like ace8, but I think higher PP is more likely. I think I'm just calling down.

brettbrettr · #5 09-13-2005, 01:58 PM

If I call the flop its to raise the turn. I'd prob cap the flop and call down if he keeps betting though.

molawn2mo · #6 09-13-2005, 01:58 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I'd take the WA/WB line here. Call if bet into, or bet if checked to (for both the turn and the river).

[/ QUOTE ]

This seems to passive to me.

I like hero not capping the flop because i want villain in the lead on the turn so that i can raise a non A or K turn, calling a 3 bet and calling or betting the river.

ErrantNight · #7 09-13-2005, 02:00 PM

don't call that 3-bet if his turn bet will scare you, you know it's coming.

be inclined to cap the flop and re-evaluate the turn. just so no part of your plan involves folding...

poboys · #8 09-13-2005, 02:02 PM

[ QUOTE ]
can you explain why, what do u put villian on. its hard with his stats, but plz try

[/ QUOTE ]

He could have anything from AK/AQ (or worse-not sure what his three betting standards are), any pocket pair that's an overpair or has made a set. I think that's the narrowest range I'd put him on (more likely it's far wider considering your read).

He's shown nothing but aggression--if you are ahead, you don't want him to fold, and want him to keep firing at you. If you are behind then you are getting to showdown as cheaply as possibly, and you are certainly not folding.

silkyslim · #9 09-13-2005, 02:02 PM

what if this was a TAG instead of this guy? and what am i beating that he would play like this?

SeaEagle · #10 09-13-2005, 02:09 PM

[ QUOTE ]
can you explain why, what do u put villian on. its hard with his stats, but plz try

[/ QUOTE ]
Even if you say villian would play a wide range of hands, with this flop there's three groups of hands:
1) Hands he's bluffing with. With a completely drawless flop there's a lot of PF 3-betting hands that fit this category. I don't know if villain would 3-bet something like two overs on this flop but it's not unheard of. You don't want to raise him off of these hands.
2) Hands he's beating you with. Bigger pairs or something with an 8. Of course you don't want to raise these hands.
3) Non-bluffing hands that you're beating. This is the only group you want to raise and it's a pretty limited group - something with a 2 (unlikely to be 3-bet PF even by this guy). JJ, TT, 99. Maybe smaller pairs less than an 8.

All in all, there aren't very many hands out that you want to be raising in this situation. Unless you're willing to raise and fold to a 3-bet (which costs the same as calling to a SD) I think calling down is the best approach with this board.