JJ vs bad LAG

#1 10-08-2005, 12:49 AM

Opponent is new to the table but he's played 60% of his hands and raising a fair amount. Did I put too much money into this pot, or is this just right?

grrr, keep forgetting stacks. Lag has me covered with $220 vs $200.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em (NL$200) (6 handed) link

Preflop: Hero is Button with J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls $2.00, 1 folds, Hero raises to $12.00, 2 folds, UTG calls $10.00.

Flop: ($27.00) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG bets $20.00, Hero calls $20.00.

Turn: ($67.00) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $40.00, UTG calls $40.00.

River: ($147.00) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero checks.

mayesie · #2 10-08-2005, 01:05 AM

I think I'd raise the flop to 60.00, trying to take it right here. If he calls or pushes, I'm done putting anymore money into the pot. It turns out you ended up putting 60.00 in the pot anyhow.

No, I don't think you put too much in!

#3 10-08-2005, 01:26 AM

What about possibly giving up our chances of hitting the gutshot? Not to mention if he is betting he has few outs or has us drawing to 2-6.

#4 10-08-2005, 01:33 AM

I think your flop bet was fine but i believe a check behind on the turn, i dont know what he would have here that he would callyour $40 bet with, without having your hand beat. Check turn and and fold to strong river bet, no sense losing half your stack over this hand.

mayesie · #5 10-08-2005, 01:39 AM

[ QUOTE ]
What about possibly giving up our chances of hitting the gutshot? Not to mention if he is betting he has few outs or has us drawing to 2-6.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, if he merely calls your flop raise, you'll get to see the turn card w/ no worries. If he re-raises all-in, I'm laying it down. That being said, I'm checking the turn behind him if he checks. If my flop raise doesn't get rid of him, I'm hoping to get to the river for free.

#6 10-08-2005, 01:48 AM

Do you see what I'm getting at though? In your example you pay $60 and may have to fold it, the line I took allows me to see the turn and river and show the hand down for the same price. I may give worse hands a chance to draw a little more cheaply, but I get to show my hand down and get a chance to suckout on hands I'm behind to.

Do you think charging a little more on the flop is worth more than the above?

amoeba · #7 10-08-2005, 02:41 AM

there is the value of possibly having him fold a Q but utg limps that call a raise likely has a big enough kicker to not fold or a kicker that gives him a straight draw.

mayesie · #8 10-08-2005, 05:09 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Do you see what I'm getting at though? In your example you pay $60 and may have to fold it, the line I took allows me to see the turn and river and show the hand down for the same price. I may give worse hands a chance to draw a little more cheaply, but I get to show my hand down and get a chance to suckout on hands I'm behind to.

Do you think charging a little more on the flop is worth more than the above?

[/ QUOTE ]

You were fortunate in getting to see the river cheaply this time. However, what's your line going to be when the turn card didn't help you (highly likely) & the Villain continues to bet? Is he still betting his draw, or is he value betting? You've put yourself into a situation where you still don't know where you stand. By raising the flop, you settle the issue right there & then (a good thing w/ a marginal hand on a dangerous board).

Yes, charging more on the flop is worth more than trying for a cheap showdown that's not likely to happen.