So, Ross Perot Was Right

[Utah]

I just saw on the news a new Nafta study that shows 500,000 high wage U.S. manufacturing jobs were lost because of Nafta. When the U.S. offical asked what exactly was the benefit of Nafta he gave some total b.s. statement about Mexico now having more political parties....wtf?

I am not trying to make a point about trade. I just thought it was funny that Ross Perot was made out to be an idiot for his "giant sucking" rant when it turned out he was dead on.

[brad]

yep. nafta/gatt gutted US.

and that police brutality against protesters in miami recently?

gonna be a free trade zone from alaska to chile.

oh my.

[sam h]

NAFTA has generally probably been good for the US economy. If we are losing manufacturing jobs, its not because of NAFTA, its because of general global integration and the progress other countries have made into the manufacturing sector.

Not sure what study you're quoting about the 500,000 jobs but here is a typical dumb quote from a story I read today about NAFTA's 10th anniversary.

[ QUOTE ]
America has lost between 530,000 and 750,000 jobs as a result of NAFTA, said Kevin Gallagher, an economist at Tufts University's Global Development and Environment Institute, but they only went to Mexico temporarily. As Mexico's salaries increased — and job skills didn't — those lower-skilled jobs then traveled to China.

[/ QUOTE ]

Umm, then the jobs would obviously have gone to China eventually. What is NAFTA like the gateway drug of manufacturing loss? Isn't this guy supposed to be an economist?

By the way, it may be b.s. to argue that NAFTA was good for us because it helped Mexican democracy. But the theory that the liberalization of the economy played a significant role in bringing down one-party rule in Mexico is pretty much accepted in the academic community.

[Ray Zee]

what is good for us is the merchandise that we can get from those countries cheaper than we make it here. sure many jobs go but the consumer gets to hopefully pay less for some stuff. if its your job that left then a person thinks its bad. but when you buy a new television set for 200 bucks or something like that you are reaping the rewards of free trade.
short term it probably hurts, long term those countries will prosper and do more for our economy than hurt it.

[bernie]

how tough was it to point at a river and say 'hey, that's running water!'

of those 500,000 jobs, how many other jobs/industries were created to offset those losses? quite a few. remember the internet boom?

though you wouldnt see that up here in the pacific northwest where the job market sucks. other jobs should eventually be created to make up for the jobs that leave or become obsolete. it's a matter of people adjusting to the change and reinventing themselves a little. which can be much easier said than done.

ross perot was a weasily, paranoid little prick. however, he did have one of the most honest running mates that i've seen. even though he was well out of his league. especially in his VP debate. it was refreshing to see someone like that up there. not that he wouldve been good, but he was str8forward and honest with what he thought.

b

[Gamblor]

It mildly shocks me that the same people who whine and moan about equal rights are now raising hellfire about Pedro, who had been living on 3 grains of rice per week, and a steady diet of dirt. Post-Nafta, he gets a whole ham sandwich. His kids can finally get medicine for their Emphysema from living in Mexico City, and they discover this new thing called the automobile.

Wait a minute, American families' economic interests are more important?

Excellent, now let's talk about Bush's foreign policy.

[Utah]

I suspect you may be right and the issues are very complex. That is why I was trying to avoid a comment on Nafta itself and I only wanted to point out that Perot was correct even though people treated him like a kook. I will admit that I voted for him.

However, even if you are correct, the American people would never have accepted that as an acceptable outcome. Imagine Slick Willie saying, "Well Nafta is going to kill 500,000 high paying U.S. manufacturing jobs. But dang girl, we are going to have some killer cheap T.V.s and DVD players."

[adios]

There are job shortages in other US industries like health care for instance. Perhaps those that lost their manufacturing jobs can be re-educated and re-trained to work in those industries where labor is in demand. Capitalism, at least the US form of capitalism, can be and is rough.

[Ray Zee]

the issues get really complex and beyond anyones sure assesment. so what has to happen is to try out these things and see what works. certainly for politions they have to worry about the help me now votes. most dont care about what the future looks like, all they want is instant help. for some i cant blame them.