2+2 Hand... Good 3-bet on turn?

[B Dids]

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (9 handed)

Preflop: Dids is SB with Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
<font color="666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="666666">5 folds</font>, <font color="CC3333">Dids raises</font>, <font color="666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: (5 SB) 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 2/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 2/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">Dids bets</font>, UTG+1 calls.

Turn: (3.50 BB) T/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">Dids bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">UTG+1 raises</font>, <font color="CC3333">Dids 3-bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">UTG+1 caps</font>, Dids calls.

River: (11.50 BB) 6/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
Dids checks, UTG+1 checks.

Final Pot: 11.50 BB

Results in white below: <font color="white">
Dids shows Qd Qs (two pair, queens and twos).
UTG+1 shows Ts Ac (two pair, tens and twos).
Outcome: Dids wins 11.50 BB. </font>

[Shalara]

I like it. I would play it the same way, including checking the river /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[easypete]

This hand looks vaguely familiar.

I thought you were trying to steal my pf limp.

You played this good... you 3-bet the turn, you should have bet the river. I was trying to push you off your hand (or hoping you had AK or AQ). So much for TPTK. If the hearts or the 2's helped me, I would have raised on the flop. 6 isn't a scare card.

[sfer]

That UTG limp is atrocious.

[chief444]

Easypete,

Why on earth would you limp pf from EP with that hand at a tight/aggressive table?

Fold, raise, limp...would be my preferred plays, in that order.

[tardigrade]

You know ... I like it. I probably would have just called it, but I like it. Sometimes you just have to show your opponents some "heart," and you did. I'm glad to see you held up. Hopefully he won't mess around with you as much next time around.

[Peter Harris]

nice. i play that way too; you'd see AT played like this, no reason to suspect the flush first.

well played.

[easypete]

[ QUOTE ]
That UTG limp is atrocious.

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed.

No excuses... I was shocked that CDC folded UTG (was trying to isolate him all night with just about any ace). I was in shock at the time of my limp. I was expecting to raise here. I can't be held responsible for my actions while in shock.

Also, I've been working on table psychology (a little easier on this table since the players notice things like this). 2 orbits earlier, in the same position, I limped w/ AA. I was trying to see how the table reacted to me limping again. Normally, I fold this on most tables this early. /images/graemlins/cool.gif

[chief444]

[ QUOTE ]
2 orbits earlier, in the same position, I limped w/ AA. I was trying to see how the table reacted to me limping again.

[/ QUOTE ]
Does it really matter how they react? In other words is there any reaction that would turn ATo into a +EV hand from UTG+1 against solid opponents? The only one I can think of is if they really put you on AA or KK and fold a better hand but I think this is very unlikely (as seen by the way the hand played out).

If limping with AA lets you limp in with some other drawing type hands or smaller pocket pairs later with less chance of a raise then fine but ATo is not something I play from this position even against poor opponents.

[B Dids]

You saved yourself a bet with the limp, because the only hands I thought you'd limp with would be AA, KK, or Axs, all of which beat me (assuming your suit is hearts).

[chief444]

[ QUOTE ]
Turn: (3.50 BB) T /images/graemlins/heart.gif (2 players)
Dids bets, UTG+1 raises, Dids 3-bets, UTG+1 caps, Dids calls.


[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You saved yourself a bet with the limp, because the only hands I thought you'd limp with would be AA, KK, or Axs, all of which beat me (assuming your suit is hearts).

[/ QUOTE ]
/images/graemlins/confused.gif /images/graemlins/confused.gif /images/graemlins/confused.gif /images/graemlins/confused.gif /images/graemlins/confused.gif
This 2+2 table must be even crazier than I thought. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[B Dids]

It's weird. Without the cap I wouldn't have put him on a flush, which is why I checked the river.

Putting people on hands here is hard, 'cause there's a TON of deception.

[chief444]

I guess what I don't understand is if you were fairly sure he had you beat on the turn why did you 3-bet? I like the river check but would just call down if I felt I was probably beat on the turn. I don't really see how 3-betting the turn and checking the river saved him a bet.

[B Dids]

I didn't think I was probably beat until he capped the turn. The initial bets could be a bluff after he knows I've got an overpair on him, the cap was what told me he was serious about the flush.

[chief444]

[ QUOTE ]
I didn't think I was probably beat until he capped the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]
I understand.

[ QUOTE ]
The initial bets could be a bluff after he knows I've got an overpair on him, the cap was what told me he was serious about the flush.

[/ QUOTE ]
You would think so anyway. /images/graemlins/blush.gif

[easypete]

[ QUOTE ]
I didn't think I was probably beat until he capped the turn. The initial bets could be a bluff after he knows I've got an overpair on him, the cap was what told me he was serious about the flush.

[/ QUOTE ]

The turn betting (as bad as it may have been) was for TPTK. I had no indication that you weren't on just overcards (at the time, just the pf raise .... AK? AQ? AJ? KQ?) I really didn't put you on an overpair (It's nice that you had QQ the hand before, for some reason i rationalized an overpair out of the equation because of that).

And yes, before I get comments on that.... I know that cards don't have memory.