How do you advise my son? Long

My son started a regular home game with some colleagues from work a while back, a game that he sensibly nurtures to death. Last weekend he was hosting so I hung around to watch how he plays.


The lineup was typical: a loudmouth, a bully, a nervous-nellie type, a jock-leader type, an ass-kisser and a superviser. And my son, who taught them the basics of the game. He's the guy they look to when a fair decision must be made over a hand. He also passes them the ranking of hands once one of them gets confused with what beats a straight.


So the game proceeds, dealers choice $5 maximum bet with four raises.


I'm proud of my son's game selection skills. These guys really stink.


After a couple of hours someone deals Omaha/8. First position opens for $5 and all call to my son who pops it $5 more. Call.


The flop is AQ3 no diamonds. My boy's holding 5d4d3h2s. From here on in each betting round was capped. No folding in this game by God! The turn was 4c. The river was a 5.


As he had done everytime somebody dealt O/8 my boy said, "Just put your cards face up on the table. Don't screw up by misreading your hands." His tone suggested he had said this many, many times before. He showed his hand and announced "Nut low, baby straight for high." Somebody asked, "How do you reckon?" My son did the A2345 thing, pointing at the combo that worked. Disgusted sighs as cards went into the muck and my boy started dragging in a pretty nice pot.


The bully suddenly said, "Hey, you had a higher straight," to the jock-leader type. "You had a 76, right?" The jock said, "Damn, Jesus. That's right. How could I miss it!"


The bully looked at my son and said, "I saw it, give him half the pot."


My son said, "I didn't see it. He mucked his hand before I was finished explaining my hand."


The bully said, "You think we're lying?" My son said, "No, not at all. But the rules are that if you muck your hand, the hand is dead. That's why I always tell everybody to show their hands down."


"Just give him what you f**king owe him," said the bully who was a big loser that night and was also a bit drunk. All eyes were glued on this unfolding drama.


My son gave the nearsighted moron going for a 76 low half the pot. And struggled not to steam for the rest of the evening.


I gave him my own advice later on but the night is still eating at him.


So what would you tell my son? Appreciate any and all comments. Good luck to you all. LTL

i would explain casino rules (maybe a printout for everyone) (one player to a hand, cards speak, show one show all, showdown order if everybody checks on end, etc.) and have everyone agree to abide by them and then totally stick to it.


then if anybody tried to get out of it i would just repeatedly argue that these are the rules, you (we all) agreed to it, etc.


i dont think it would be that hard to do.


brad

LTL,


The smartest kid on the block doesn't need reminding of it. Your son is the leader and no doubt his (stuck) opponents sometimes tire of following. Maybe it's time for him to relax some during the game, and see how well things run themselves without his constant aid. Or maybe this hand would have been a good time to give some air at the first sign of conflict. Or maybe the balance of power is way off, in your son's favor, and maybe he should wield it more carefully. Or maybe I'm not picturing the scene right at all and maybe I should shush now.


Tommy

from home game experience...


i am the only one with significant casino poker time under their belt in our game (which doesn't happen very often). nobody really gives a $hi+ about what proper casino procedure is. we all love to argue points way beyond their death. this can make it QUITE frustrating at times to get a ruling. my opponents are really bad at poker, and don't see all the nuances of the game well enough to have ANY concept of fair rulings in about 75% of the time. unfortunately, this doesn't matter to who actually makes the decision. somebody will usually give in finally, and a precedent will be set. i refuse to play by any rules that don't have a precedent in our game, or exist in casinos.


in your situation, i would have to judge the severity of the issue. if the game could break up over such an incident, i'd give up half the pot THIS TIME, and THIS TIME ONLY!!


if the game is in no danger of breaking up over such a conflict, then i explain that if we allow the pot to be split based on the word of a 3rd player, this opens the game to all SORTS of cheating and collusion opportunities. obviously we can't have anything the makes cheating easier, so no dice on the half pot. id have scooped it all already, so I would probably say something like "im not splitting it, but ill buy you a beer next time we're at the bar." this is good-natured and can go a long way to easing the tension in the game.

My home game experience is in accord with baggins'. If you aren't playing in a group that is largely cardroom-experienced, cardroom rules seem weird and arbitrary to the players. (I can drive people nuts when I automatically say "string!" when some amateur says "I call the nickel ... and I raise a quarter!")


Long Term Loser's son did everything right ... including splitting the pot. Good feeling matters in a good home game.


One way to explain the more arcane rules of poker is through storytelling. Sometime *after* the tough decision is made (one way or another) the experienced player can tell some story -- it helps if it's a funny one instead of a horror story -- about what that particular rule is about. Storytelling is entertaining; it conveys the sense that poker has tradition and history as well as just rules; and it educates, telling *why* the rules are there.


("Sorry, son, read the rules. Only one Wild Cat is good in an evening.")

Why get hyper-technical? You aren't in a casino.


Keeping the fish coming back is more important than half of one pot. If the easy money isn't having fun, they aren't going to play.

I agree. He is playing against fish which gives him a long term edge. Why risk the breakup of a regular game where he is the best player for a few $$? Just consider it a small investment with potentially larger returns. I follow this policy of not being strict in my private games and it has paid off quite a bit.

Thanks to all who responded. I printed out each and every one of the six reponses and gave them to my son, telling him these guys know what they're speaking about.


He was, being 22-years-old, of course mortified his old man was telling tales of his woes out of school but I did see him reading through them later on and even noted he folded them up neatly and stuck them in shirt pocket so I'm guessing they'll be reread again. Many thanks again to you all and best of luck. LTL