Players that are 70% V$IP and win - what do you do?

[Wada]

Ok.... got three hands that just made me go on tilt and I have no idea how to deal with it. Quick example, guy plays 72s and catches his back door flush. He called all my raises when I flopped two pair. Same guy has 63o and makes his 6 high straight while I have the 5 high straight. Same guy calls my preflop raises with Q2o while Im holding AKo. He catches a 2 on the flop and wins.

This was at Party on .50/1 tables.

Are there any types of strategies or things to look for when playing against someone that plays EVERYTHING? (Im serious he literally played everything. His V$IP was %74 and his PF% was 3.4 - for 31 hands.) Now I know 31 hands is small but you can still some what get an idea if the person is LAG,TAG, LP, or TP. Or is this someone that you have to sit and be patient with and sooner or later you will knock down his stack?

Should I put this guy on the buddy list and follow him around?

[thirddan]

31 hand is a very small sample like you said, but i imagine with the hands you mentioned that his VPIP is probalby extremely high all the time...put him on your buddy list and follow him around...if you play a tight/aggressive solid game against him you will beat him, just remember not to bluff him and make thinner value bets against him...

[Wada]

To add to this - When I find players like this end up beating me with their lucky hands the following happens:

1) They leave the table, I could hope that I get lucky and find them in the future even with the search/buddy function. Sometimes you never see the player again.

2) This is what really gets to me - they end up losing the money they won from me to other players at the table.

Any thoughts or suggestions?

[Chiefs Fan]

just remember it like this, some other clown will come in to your next game and lose money he won from someone else on bad suckouts to you. we all suffer bad beats, its part of the game, play your cards strong when you make hands and get out when you dont. bad beats aren't quite as upsetting to me anymore, i'm getting used to it.

[ctv1116]

If I put every Party 0.5/1 who played like that on my buddy list, I'd have 10,000 buddies.

[sucka]

There is absolutely no way that ANY player can continuously see anywhere near 70% of the flops be a winning player.

I once witnessed a player in a live game who played EVERY flop win or split 10 pots in a row. The guy rushed for 40 minutes winning at least 1 of every 4 pots and was up 5 or so racks in relatively low limit game.

I sat at that table for a long time, as did he.

He gave it all back - and then some...

They all do. Just remember that.

[Webster]

Many times you will see a player come in that plays 70% and lose - what you do not see is that this guy won a bunch at another table and the players THERE are saying he is lucky.

It really does even out in the long run. If you look at your PT stats after a large number of hands and do some number crunching you will see a bunch of big time winners in the 70% range - HOWEVER - you will see the other 90% are losers.

The 10% winners you will probebly never see again because they lost it all at another table.

You can follow the guy but I bet you he is now playing tournaments where he can play for 45 minuts for a buck.

When you are in a situation with one of those guys - just go with the flow. DO NOT TAKE HIS PLAY PERSONALLY. It's the only way he knows how and he is getting lucky AND it is only re-enforcing his already bad play.

Personally I WANT him to win a ton - maybe not from me but I like seeing those guys win.

[Wada]

Thanks for all the reassuring replies. For a while there I was becoming callous to all the bad beats. I was on an upswing and doing alot better. Ended up reading a post by Ed Miller (...crushing low limits - folding too much) and tried to tweak my playing a little to what he said in his post. Got a little screwd up with the change but got back on track. Then here comes Mr. 70%V$IP and makes me go on tilt. Then of course I see him lose his money to the rest of the table and not to me.

But you all had good points - thanks again.

[RED_RAIN]

31 hands usually isn't enough. Also look at if he's down or up overall and his SD win rate. It could be he got a string of good cards as was actually just playing the cards. I usually want at least 75 hands if not more to really see a player's true colors, just watch a orbit or two and if he continues to call this much with your new session on him, more than likely he's pretty lose. As stated before, don't bluff him, preflop raise him with lower standards to isolate him, and make sure you play aggressive when you hit your hands hard.

[Wada]

"Also look at if he's down or up overall and his SD win rate."

31 hands; V$IP = 74.19; W$WSF% = 36; Amount Won = $37; BB/100 Hands = 119.35; WSD% = 56; W$SD% = 50; PFR% = 3.23


I agree that 30 hands is small and that 75 is a nice number of hands. But sometimes, and usually, it is only about 30 to 50 hands before the person leaves the table. Sometimes it can be as low as 20 hands. But its the only number that I can go off of. Would be nice if they sat longer at the table, which it has happened to me. Ive got some that are 100 to 140 hands.


I do not think his V$IP was high due to getting good cards after good cards. He played 63o and Q2o. That was just a few hands that I rememebered of the top of my head. I watched him alot and he seriously played everything.

I will have to search for him and see what he does on the next session...it would be interesting to find out.

[donkeyradish]

[ QUOTE ]
Personally I WANT him to win a ton - maybe not from me but I like seeing those guys win.

[/ QUOTE ]

Absolutely! The more they win, the more they stick around. Once they bust out the table action is often dead.

[RED_RAIN]

His stats seem to show either

Getting good cards since the pretty high showdown rate and win rate at showdown usually. Good thing you noticed he's playing some weird stuff, so you can just count as he's getting lucky, thus play accordingly.

[Wada]

[ QUOTE ]
Getting good cards since the pretty high showdown rate and win rate at showdown usually.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ive noticed some say that when you have a high WSD% that you are not folding enough - I take this as a calling station.

-BB/100 plus high WSD% = Not folding enough or not folding sooner...going too far with losing hands...etc. Right?

You've brought up a good point. If someone has a low V$IP like 18% along with a high WSD%, it would seem they are tight (real specific to playing premium hands) AND actually really getting good cards.

What exactly does W$SD and WSD% mean?

[RED_RAIN]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Getting good cards since the pretty high showdown rate and win rate at showdown usually.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ive noticed some say that when you have a high WSD% that you are not folding enough - I take this as a calling station.

[/ QUOTE ]

True

[ QUOTE ]


-BB/100 plus high WSD% = Not folding enough or not folding sooner...going too far with losing hands...etc. Right?


[/ QUOTE ]

True they sorta go hand in hand. If you have a huge showdown % that means you are always making to the river, and if your BB/100 is negative you are showing down with weak hands

[ QUOTE ]


You've brought up a good point. If someone has a low V$IP like 18% along with a high WSD%, it would seem they are tight (real specific to playing premium hands) AND actually really getting good cards.


[/ QUOTE ]

True they can be pushed off pots. These people usually bet out into a preflop raiser and bet out on the flop with top pair.

[ QUOTE ]

What exactly does W$SD and WSD% mean?

[/ QUOTE ]

W$SD = won money at showdown
WSD% = went to showdown percent wise

[Dov]

If you are on tilt, quit the game. Nothing else will help you.

Play solid poker against someone who plays every hand.

You will win, in the end.