A Sad Day for America, President Reagan has died

[GWB]

President Ronald Reagan has died. (http://www.suntimes.com/special_sections/reagan/stories/reaganillinois05.html)


http://i.a.cnn.net/cnn/2004/ALLPOLITICS/06/05/reagan.obit/vert.reagan.1990.ap.jpg

[jdl22]

The saddest thing about this is that today is not the sad day. Due to his disease he has been gone for quite some time. My grandfather had a similarly dehabilitating disease and it is quite sad to see someone you love go through that.

I didn't really care for his politics but Reagan certainly is one of the best speakers to live in the White House. Lines of his from debates and speeches will forever be repeated.

[UTGunner]

[ QUOTE ]
The saddest thing about this is that today is not the sad day. Due to his disease he has been gone for quite some time. My grandfather had a similarly dehabilitating disease and it is quite sad to see someone you love go through that.


[/ QUOTE ]
At 93 years old and with his disease, it is not a terrible tragedy. Nonetheless, his supporters have a right to "celebrate" his life, and I am sure that they will in the days leading up to the funeral.

I'm sure they will wait until Bush is back from Europe. Soon we will have a photo of Ford, Carter, Bush I, Clinton, and Bush II at the funeral.

[Ray Zee]

i liked the guy he had moxy for sure. but using astrology to make decisions in the white house is something else.

[andyfox]

I think it was Nancy who consulted the astrologer. Reagan usually consulted Lew Wasserman.

[Cyrus]

What matters, if anything does, is how we choose to live our lives. I, personally, refuse, to bow humbly my head and acknowledge as noble a life lived just because "someone died". Criticism is not to be suspended because the subject passed away. (Perhaps more respect is due, especially at the time of dying, but this is not the same thing as absolving. Death seems, strangely, to act as purgatory to some people's minds, especially to some of the diceased person's oponents.)

"Reagan certainly is [sic /images/graemlins/smirk.gif] one of the best speakers to live in the White House."

For a better understanding of Reagan's carney tricks and conman techniques in his speeches, qualities that allowed him to be rightly called the Teflon President, one would be advised to look up the related chapter in Dr Oliver Sachs "The Man Who Mistook His Wife For A Hat". Revealing and devastating; it will blush the cheeks of those who were gipped them but can still be objective about those times. Or self-critical.

[jdl22]

Sorry what's wrong with "Reagan certainly is?" Should it be Reagan is certainly?

I was born in 1980 so I was 9 when he left office. What I'm referring to are the various clips and repeated lines they always show during debates and such. Perhaps he didn't come up with it himself but it is quite good. We can certainly agree that he was better than the current president.

BTW my sister and Reagan shared their birthday, February 6.

[MMMMMM]

"We can certainly agree that he was better than the current president."

Hard to say, really, with both being so good.

Kennedy, Reagan, and GWB: the only Presidents in the last 50 years that truly stood up against the mortal enemies of America.

[jdl22]

Read my post more carefully. I was referring only to speaking ability. No matter your overall opinion thinking that Bush is anywhere near the speaker that (insert name of any US president from the last 50 years) was is an interesting opinion.

edit: just wanted to add that it is also an interesting opinion that Iraq posed some sort of mortal threat or was our mortal enemy. There are not many countries that support the kind of terrorism that poses a threat to the country's existence or have the weapons capability to do so on their own. Iraq was certainly not in this group.

[GWB]

I didn't see MMMMMM specify only Iraq in his statement. Facing our mortal enemies usually includes a whole alliance of enemies. This included both European and Central American (and many other) communists in Reagan's time, and terrorists and terrorist supporters around the world including Iraq currently.

Despite the way the media treats it, Iraq has never been a stand alone issue in our war against America's enemies.

W

[Cyrus]

You wrote "Reagan is..." and I thought it should be pointed out that he no longer is anything. We are allowed to talk about the dear dead departed in the present tense, of course, as far as I know, but I was pointing out the subtle ways that the Teflon President is still very much alive in our minds.

/images/graemlins/cool.gif

And for all those easily duped by the Gipper's "greatness" : His regime started a downard spiral in environmental husbandry in America that will outlast any of his other "achievements". Spare a thought for the great pioneer James Watts.

[Cyrus]

"Facing our mortal enemies usually includes a whole alliance of enemies. This included both European and Central American (and many other) communists in Reagan's time, and terrorists and terrorist supporters around the world including Iraq currently."

From East to West, and from North to South, looks like no one is safe from the United States' appetite.

/images/graemlins/cool.gif

What a seriously warped mind! Perhaps the fresh air in the French Atlantic coast will rattle some of your brain cells back to life, although I hold not my breath! Toujours con you will be, Mr President.

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
"We can certainly agree that he was better than the current president."

Hard to say, really, with both being so good.



[/ QUOTE ]

That's funny. I'd put GWB slightly better than Carter and on a par with LBJ. Despite some gripes, I liked Ronald a lot.

[MMMMMM]

Ronald Reagan was correct in calling the USSR an "evil empire", and GWB was correct in referring to North Korea, Iran and Syria an "axis of evil".

You seem to possess the perspective that most of the world is a passing fair if troubled place. For some parts, and for certain individuals, that is true; but the remainder of the world is actually a fairly foul place--which naturally hates freedom, and anything which may threaten their local tyrannies or entrenched and backwards ideologies.

It should not be surprising that much of the world hates us for our freedoms and success (nor should it be surprising that Europe grows increasingly envious, whilst remaining mired in more socialistic ways which impede growth, progress and overall prosperity).

[andyfox]

Almost every Republican who came into contact with Reagan while he was president was shocked by how ignorant the man was and how disinterested he was in policy: Bob Dole, Colin Powell, and Henry Kissinger, to name just three. I've posted here before on exactly what they said.
He was also dishonest, as his testimony before the grand jury investigating the blanket waiver he gave his bosses at MCA, and the Irangate affair indicate. His decision to announce liberal senator Richard Schweiker as his running mate, in order to try to get Pennsylvania's votes at the 1976 Republican convention, shows that his lifelong goal was simply to advance himself; his so-called principles were simply knee-jerk ignorance.

[MMMMMM]

I liked Reagan, too. GWB however has been facing more knotty problems. At least with the USSR, the threat was pretty well defined and the opponent was rational.

[MMMMMM]

A more "educated" man would never have put it to the Soviets so bluntly, nor pressured them so effectively with Star Wars. Reagan was just perfect for the time.

Also, the world is full of educated fools who cannot tell right from wrong or good from evil, and who think everything is relative.

[Gamblor]

it will blush the cheeks of those who were gipped

For someone who claims to be such a noble proponent of equality and libertarianism it's only mildly shocking you would use a slur like "gipped" (and not even spell it correctly - gypped).

Gypsies everywhere are bowing their heads in shame for you.

It's only mildly surprising, because after all, when it comes to "equality" and "down with racism" discussions with you and Chris and nicky... well, He doth protest too much methinks

[MMMMMM]

[ QUOTE ]
"it will blush the cheeks of those who were gipped"

For someone who claims to be such a noble proponent of equality and libertarianism it's only mildly shocking you would use a slur like "gipped" (and not even spell it correctly - gypped).

Gypsies everywhere are bowing their heads in shame for you.

[/ QUOTE ]

But wasn't Ronald Reagan's nickname The Gipper? ;-)

[Cyrus]

"... "gipped" (and not even spell it correctly - gypped)."

Spelling intentional - as a nod to the Gipper.

"Gypsies everywhere are bowing their heads in shame for you."

Thanks for the heads up.

/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[jdl22]

My point is that going after Iraq shows that Bush does NOT understand who our mortal enemies are.

If we have mortal enemies they are certainly islamist terrorists and those that support them not the enemy of these groups.

[Cyrus]

"A more "educated" man would never have put it to the Soviets so bluntly, nor pressured them so effectively with Star Wars. Reagan was just perfect for the time."

Brilliant quotation marks around the word "educated".

I quite like your insinuation that Reagan was an idiot savant!

[Gamblor]

But wasn't Ronald Reagan's nickname The Gipper? ;-)

I stand corrected.

[Gamblor]

Some people point out corrections with class (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Number=734185&page=0&view=co llapsed&sb=5&o=14&vc=1).

Others, well, do their own thing.

[GWB]

[ QUOTE ]
Almost every Republican who came into contact with Reagan while he was president was shocked by how ignorant the man was and how disinterested he was in policy: Bob Dole, Colin Powell, and Henry Kissinger, to name just three. I've posted here before on exactly what they said.


[/ QUOTE ]
Just about every Republican (and I do not jest here) who comes in contact with me on the other hand is impressed with my focus, interest, and understanding in many policy areas. Read the many books and first person accounts. Shouldn't this change your opinion of me?

FWIW I recommend Karen Hughes' book "10 Minutes from Normal" as an example.

Also, Reagan was hardly an idiot either, he certainly had a better handle on what to do for the country than Carter did.

W

[MMMMMM]

Reagan saw things more clearly than some who were more educated or knowledgeable.

[GWB]

Reagan to Be Honored With State Funeral (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=519&e=1&u=/ap/20040606/ap_on_re_us/ronald_reagan)

Funny how when a president died during Clinton's first term, he didn't have the basic respect to have a State Funeral for him.

W

[Al_Capone_Junior]

Shame on you andy for your amero-bashing! you must be from IRAQ! Who cares if you threw in a measure of TRUTH (we in the USA! USA! don't care much for THAT), the bottom line is that every dead AMERICAN president becomes a SUPER-HERO the day they die! Filled with purity, goodness, and a master of their domain during their time! Truth be damned! /images/graemlins/grin.gif

AndyFox. Amero-basher. Let's get 'em Vern! Kill! Kill! Kill! /images/graemlins/grin.gif

USA! USA! USA! /images/graemlins/grin.gif

al

[andyfox]

The idea that Regan won the Cold War is a fallacy. It as the inefficiency of the Soviet system, and the stupidity of their leaders, especially since the outbreak of the Cold War, that caused the demise.

If we want to attribute our toughness on them as leading to their ridiculous levels of spending on armaments, then let's give credit where credit is due, namely, those administrations prior to Reagan's that prosecuted the Cold War in its critical early stages. The Soviet Union was an evil but dying empire by the time Reagan became president.

Reagan may have spoken bluntly, but its was the prior administrations that acted bluntly and forcefully.

[andyfox]

One expects others in one's own party to be complimentary. Note how, for example, no Democrat, not even one, could bring himself to vote for any article of impeachment against Bill Clinton. Senator Byrd even admitted that while some of Clinton's act may well be impeachable offenses, we're not going to vote against our guy.

When, on the other hand, those in one's own party claim that their president was an ignoramus, one must take such an assessment much more seriously than when the opposition party say it, or when one's own party is sycophantic.

[andyfox]

Wasn't that the guy who resigned in disgrace?

Sickeningly, Clinton spoke about Mr. Nixon as if he were the greatest man in history at his funeral.

[MMMMMM]

I do not say Reagan "won" the Cold War. However what he did helped to put additional pressure on the Soviets. Also, more leaders should be so bold as to call despicable and pernicious regimes "evil".

[andyfox]

I hand't realize the astrologer had such an impact on the Reagan White House. From Don Regans' book:

"Although I had never met this seer -- Mrs. Reagan passed along her prognostications to me after conferring with her on the telephone -- she had become such a factor in my work, and in the highest affairs of the nation, that at one point I kept a color-coded calendar on my desk (numerals highlighted in green ink for "good" days, red for "bad" days, yellow for "iffy" days) as an aid to remembering when it was propitious to move the president of the United States from one place to another, or schedule him to speak in public, or commence negotiations with a foreign power."

Yikes!