Three 20-40 hands

here are some hands where i want advice as to whether i was over aggressive with my hand. In hands 2. and 3. i was not sure where i was, whether behind or actually with the best hand. Comments on the preflop calls also appreciated.


1. I am in the BB with 6c7s. 7 handed game. 3 limpers, sb calls and I get a free play. Flop Ad 5s 8h. It is checked to a tight old man in the cutoff who bets. button and sb fold. I check raise. early player folds. cutoff calls. turn 2c. I bet and am called. river 2s. I am pretty certain that he will call but bet out anyway, he calls with the words "you win" as he makes to muck his cards. I turn over and he shows A J.


2. I am in mid position with KsJh. one limper, i limp. button calls. sb folds. Flop Kd 9c 6s. bb checks, limper bets out, I raise, all fold and limper calls. Turn 6c. limper checks, i bet, he checkraises me. Limper is average, typical player. I reraise with the intention of folding if he raises again and checking down the river if he calls and checks the river. he calls, the river is a T and we check it down. he turns over 6d7d.


3. I am in the bb with KdJs. 2 limpers to the sb (the same player in 2. above) who raises. I call as do 2 limpers. Flop Kh 6d 3d. SB bets out, i raise, limpers fold, sb reraises I call. Turn 9d. sb bets out, I raise, he calls. river blank. he checks, i check and he shows AhAs.

1. Not too much to say about the first hand. You played the hand well except, maybe. the desperation river bluff. You seemed to have intimidated the tight old man into a calling mode despite the fact that he flopped top pair and had a decent kicker. My experience is that very few players will fold Aces even if their kicker is a 2. It's hard to put the old man on anything but Aces since he called your raise and turn bet. Obviously, you can't win without bluffing but I just wouldn't do it when I've put someone on Aces. They won't fold.


2. It's hard to put the limper on trip 6s but I wouldn't reraise on the turn since your already playing heads up and aren't sure where you are. I'd be more concerned that he's got AKo or KQo since he bet the flop. Calling the re-raise and the river seems better than re-raising with an intent to fold to a 4-bet. Calling will cost you exactly the same as the 3bet/fold strategy with the benefit of being guaranteed a showdown.


3. The only play I don't like here is the raise on the turn. When someone raises pre-flop and the 3-bets a King high flop from such an early position, I'm suspicious of a very powerful hand. In this case, AA, KK, and AK would be possible hands I'd put him on. Again, your heads up and not sure where you are so calling someone who is representing so much strength is reasonable.


As far as your pre-flop play goes:


1. Free plays in the big blind are good.

2. Limping in middle position is fine with KJo.

3. There are many warnings about playing KJo in early position BUT there is little risk of being reraised behind you and you do have position on the raiser. Because of these two factors, I think this call is good.


Losing twice with KJo- perhaps all those warnings about this hand are correct.

1. If the cutoff is indeed a "tight old man", there is almost nothing he can have besides an ace when he bets that flop. Since the odds of any player folding top pair (especially aces) to a single check raise on the flop are basically zero, I would just call here to improve the pot odds on my draw. If you are going to take a shot at stealing the pot (which I would not try except against the most squeaky tight of players, given this situation), you should try the check raise on the turn instead. In either case, if I get called on the turn, that is the last of my money that is going in the pot unless I improve.


2. Against average players, A check raise on the turn after you have shown strength by raising on the flop means a big hand. I would fold the turn after I got raised here. If this were a better player, you would not be able to lay down so easily, since he might be playing at you with a pair and a flush draw.


3. I hate this call before the flop, especially against a "typical" player. A raise from the blind against 3 limpers means a big hand for all but the most maniacal players, and KJo is about the worst possible hand to play against a premium hand in a multiway flop. You correctly raise the flop after you make top pair, which should knock out the other players and let you know where you are at, which we find out is second (as expected) after he reraises. I would call the reraise on the flop only for the 13:1 odds to make a jack or king, but fold on the turn after I miss and have only 5 outs at best.

1. I am in the BB with 6c7s. 7 handed game. 3 limpers, sb calls and I get a free play. Flop Ad 5s 8h. It is checked to a tight old man in the cutoff who bets. button and sb fold. I check raise. early player folds. cutoff calls. turn 2c. I bet and am called. river 2s. I am pretty certain that he will call but bet out anyway, he calls with the words "you win" as he makes to muck his cards. I turn over and he shows A J.


I don't like it. Betting out of the flop would be ok but I think I would play this one like a wuss (check-call x 2 then check-fold).


2. I am in mid position with KsJh. one limper, i limp. button calls. sb folds. Flop Kd 9c 6s. bb checks, limper bets out, I raise, all fold and limper calls. Turn 6c. limper checks, i bet, he checkraises me. Limper is average, typical player. I reraise with the intention of folding if he raises again and checking down the river if he calls and checks the river. he calls, the river is a T and we check it down. he turns over 6d7d.


Fold on the turn, unless the guy is a maniac. A check-raise on the turn pretty reliably means top pair/decent kicker is beaten and often drawing dead. When was the last time you were check-raised on the turn by an "average, typical player" who could not beat top pair (or two pair when there's a pair on board), mediocre kicker?


3. I am in the bb with KdJs. 2 limpers to the sb (the same player in 2. above) who raises. I call as do 2 limpers. Flop Kh 6d 3d. SB bets out, i raise, limpers fold, sb reraises I call. Turn 9d. sb bets out, I raise, he calls. river blank. he checks, i check and he shows AhAs.


This one is tougher but I could make a case for a range of cheaper plays. I would only play this hand fast like you did against a reliably over-aggressive SB. You put in a lot of dough against a guy who showed great strength.

On the third hand, he picked up a flush draw on the turn, which made his quagmire even worse.

You're right, I missed the flush draw. Given that, he has an easy call on the turn, and then an easy fold on the river.

Hand one: Why check-raise a tight old man on the flop? Why reduce your pot odds on a come hand? You can certainly build an

arguement for leading on the flop and slowing down on the turn

when the tight old man calls. Maybe he will even give you a free card.


Hand two: Fold! What can you beat? KT or a bluff are the only

hands you can beat. Unless the player is a maniac I would fold

when I am checkraised.


Hand three: Fold BTF. You will have the worst possible position

throughout the hand with trap cards. You need to catch the flop

perfectly to be able to continue on the flop.


Bruce

1. I have noticed two things about TOMs. The first is that they love to play hands containing an ace. The second is that they are suspicious about overly agressive young rascals like your self. I guess the semi-bluff on the turn was an OK play just to re-enforce your image in their mind. the river bet was a bit hopeless. You will make your money back when you have AK vs. his AJ.


2. against most players you have a pretty easy fold when you get check raised. you lost 2 big bets.


3. UGH! there is just about no way I would ever call a raise from the small blind with K-Jo in a full table ring game. K-J, and K-Q suck in this situation and are definitely trap hands.

1. I am in the BB with 6c7s.... I check raise.... early player folds.


I believe you were overly aggressive on all three hands. Check-raising is overrated in general. Doing it on the flop is fine when you have a hand you want to protect, but as a semibluff it's a disaster. If there are enough opponents to make it an odds-on investment, fine. But there are two major reasons to semibluff: to get free cards and get the opponent to fold. Here you get neither, nor do you have any hope of either unless you check the turn (checking the turn in this situation can work against some opponents).


2. I am in mid position with KsJh. one limper, i limp. button calls. sb folds. Flop Kd 9c 6s. bb checks, limper bets out, I raise, all fold and limper calls. Turn 6c. limper checks, i bet, he checkraises me.


I know my game is shot when I start calling too much preflop and when I call checkraises on the turn without a serious hand or an odds-on draw. Most of the time you should just give it up unless you know the guy checkraise bluffs a lot. Most average players in loose California games don't do it because they get called all the time.


3. I am in the bb with KdJs. 2 limpers to the sb (the same player in 2. above) who raises. I call.


John Goodman in The Big Lebowski: "You are entering a world of pain."