Value Bet?

[Schneids]

Hand One
Fantastic 10/20 table. Can't access my email so I get to type this out by hand /images/graemlins/smile.gif

UTG (clueless) limps, I am UTG+1 and raise with KsTs. Folded to SB who 3-bets. In a past hand the SB (chooky) 3-bet my UTG raise from the button with QJo. So, him 3-betting me from the blinds doesn't necessarily mean that much. 3 to the flop for 3-bets.

** Dealing Flop ** [ 5h, Kc, As ]
Chooky bets, Clueless calls, I raise, both call.

** Dealing Turn ** [ 7s ]
Checked to me, I bet, only Chooky calls.

** Dealing River ** [ 2c ]
Checked to me. I bet, right?


Hand Two
Terrific 10/20 table. Not good players involved in hand. Dumb aggression common.

UTG raises, I 3-bet with JsJc, CO poster cold calls, button cold calls, UTG calls.

** Dealing Flop ** [ 3d, Th, 9h ]
UTG bets, I raise, button cold calls, UTG calls.

** Dealing Turn ** [ 4c ]
UTG bets, I raise, button cold calls, UTG calls.

** Dealing River ** [ Td ]
UTG checks, I should check, right?

[Ulysses]

I would bet both times, since they both have 88.

[Nick B.]

I would check both hands on the river, but I am pretty passive on the river, so take it for what it is worth.

I think if you had a better K in the first hand, then I might think about betting it (probably not though).

[Schneids]

[ QUOTE ]
I would bet both times, since they both have 88.

[/ QUOTE ]

I respectfully ask what are you smoking? 88 is pretty exact. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Ulysses]

I dunno. They just felt like 88. Obviously, if I were at the table, I'd be able to give you a more precise read.

[Packerfan1]

You obviously missed the whole pattern map discussion. /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

[stripsqueez]

[ QUOTE ]
I would bet both times, since they both have 88.

[/ QUOTE ]

i noticed yesterday they all had 77 - i wonder if this is whimsy or a line in the value betting sand ?

i dont like the first one much - is he really going to call with 88 ? - the second one seems fairly auto to me

stripsqueez - chickenhawk

[Schneids]

[ QUOTE ]

i noticed yesterday they all had 77 - i wonder if this is whimsy or a line in the value betting sand ?

i dont like the first one much - is he really going to call with 88 ? - the second one seems fairly auto to me


[/ QUOTE ]
I went with your thoughts Strip, and now am second guessing them.

I checked the first one and saw QJ. I think this type of player will call with 88.

Second one I bet, got raised by the button, UTG folded, and I made a dumbo buffoon call to see KT. I personally think theree's less value in a bet here because the guy behind me is going to be on a ten or flush draw almost always, and by checking I still give him the option to bluff his missed draw, while rarely having to see a showdown for two bets. I wasn't particularly concerned about UTG's hand.

[Ulysses]

The first one is a clear bet IMO because he will usually have a small pair and he will always call w/ it.

The second one I screwed up. I for some reason thought button had folded on the turn. I check for the reasons you stated.

[fyodor]

I've been playing in too many passive 5/10 tables. Hand 1 what I see over and over is the Chooky guy 3 betting PF AQ, leading with the AKx flop and then just calling me the rest of the way afraid I have AK but he doesn't want to fold.

At an aggressive table you can be pretty certain the line he took indicates a smaller pair because if he had an Ace worth 3 betting PF he would be raising again later.

Hand 2 I check because anyone I beat would probably fold anyhow.