10-20 hand

here's a hand i played today in a moderately loose, moderately aggressive 10-20 game:


i have AQh in the cutoff. 2 people limp to me and i raise. both blind calls as do the limpers.


the flop is T65, the 5 is a heart. everyone checks to me and i bet. both blinds call, the other two fold.


the turn is a the 7 of hearts. they check to me and i bet. the SB (a guy who plays a LOT of hands, but plays very aggressively after the flop) checkraises and the BB (a certified loose goose) goes all in for $60 making it 3 BBs.


now what should i do?


thanks in advance for your intelligent answers.

I assume that when you write AQh, you have AhQh. What could SB call your preflop raise with, and check-raise the turn? I think you really have to fear a set here (if he's a decent player), since he probably wouldnt call a raise with 98s, 65s (or would he?). Then he most likely has TT, 66 or 55 IMO, therefore giving you respectively 7, 7 and 6 outs. Since SB will probably cap with a set (giving you 3:14.5), I think you have to fold here. But if your description of SB however implies that he could have a greater range of hands than I assumed (which is probably the case), so could call raises with 98s and 65s, and is capable of check-raising turn as semi bluff (with hand like JhTh, Th9h etc), then I think you have an automatic call.


Regards

This is an easy call. There is no way that SB will lay it down for a raise, so you will have to improve to win. No reason to put more money in the pot now.


I wanted to comment on the notion that you might fold here. Your odds of hitting a flush are 37:9 against (i.e. around 4:1 against). Even if someone has a set (which is possible but by no means certain), you have seven outs to the nuts (that is, your odds againt improving to the nuts are 39:7, or approximately 5.6:1). Right now, the pot is laying 12.5:2 (6.25:1). Sure, there is a chance SB will reraise. However, you will fold on the river if you don't improve, and if you do improve you can anticipate picking up at least one additional bet from SB. Thus, if you were *sure* SB was going to reraise, the pot would be laying 14.5:3 [two additional bets from SB and one additional bet from you]. These odds of 4.8:1 almost justify the call even if you were sure there was a set out there. You cannot make this kind of close laydown.

Mike:


I think once you have a go at the flop with a bet into 4 other players and get called in 2 places, I think taking the free card on the turn is the correct play. Although you have the flush draw and overcards, a bet at this point will not get rid of the 2 best hands out of the 4 that started. Someone surely has a pair and with the 2 touching cards a straight draw is possible. I'm usually all for keeping our right hand in motion in a shorthanded field but remember you started with 4 opponents and are playing against the best 2 hands. The upside of my arguement is you're not betting the other guys hand for him if he is ahead. The downside is you give your hand away and players will bluff on the river.


As far the actual play of the hand, the check-raise on the turn looks like a protected bet to me so I think you are against more than just a pair of 10's here so your clean outs are just the hearts. I may be a little concerned about the all-in raise which could mean hearts and reduce you outs. A quick calculation of the pot odds looks like about 6-1 on your call of the additional $40 (less if a reraise). I think you have an easy call here even if less than 9 outs are alive.


Regards, Dale Duguid

"Thus, if you were *sure* SB was going to reraise, the pot would be laying 14.5:3 [two additional bets from SB and one additional bet from you]. These odds of 4.8:1 almost justify the call even if you were sure there was a set out there."


No..if you're sure SB is going to re-raise and you're sure against a set you have 6 or 7 outs. 1:4.8 is NOT enough for a 7 (and 6) outer. Your implied odds are there if you hit your clean outs, but you probably have to pay off if he makes his full and you your flush, so I dont think you have to take that into account.


"You cannot make this kind of close laydown."


I dont understand this comment. A close decision indicates to make it isnt much wrong either way. So that you CANNOT make a close laydown makes no sense to me.


Regards

"easy call" was the phrase i was pleased to read because a call was what i made pretty quickly. i thought twice about it later and thought i had better post here.


no heart came on the river and the sb checked to me and i checked behind. bb takes it down with the nut straight and sb and i mucked.


i can appreciate what ikke says about a set reducing my outs, that thought occured to me this morning. these opponents could have played this way without a set very easily. it was clear to both the sb and i that when the bb capped all in he definitely had the nut straight. the sb could actually have had as little as AT, he played very aggressively and raised on the turn a lot. knowing that he plays this way my bet on the turn was indeed quite foolish (as Gerald pointed out)--a free river for me was definitely in order.


there's an interesting side note about this 10-20 (it's the one at hollywood park in L.A.). the rake is only $5 per half hour which is about the lowest in the whole city. i sometimes play 9-18 at hustler and commerce as well and the rake there is $4 on the button. my results are good in both places, but as my hours in my little record book increase i have noticed that i ma beating the 10-20 for 3 times what i do the 9-18 -- i think paying $10-$14 less per hour has a lot to do with it!

Mike1:


I've played in all the games you have mentioned including 15-30 at Hollywood Park. The 10-20 game at Hollywood seems to be frequented by regulars and in my opinion is a very loose game which may attribute to your increased win rate. It really depends on the # of hours you have logged at all the games. The 9-18 at the Commerce (played 3 times) varied from session to ssesion with some decent players who are on bankroll restrictions (I liked the food at the Commerce). IMO, the games at all levels were quite juicy at Hollywood Park and am glad my buddy Adam introduced me to poker there. I plan to get back about 3 times a year for my week to 10 day sessions with Adam.


Good Luck, Dale Duguid