Too passive on the rivers here? [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

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jacki

05-20-2004, 01:53 PM

I was on the phone with a friend and was only half paying attention. I made some calls here that I'm concerned are a bit too loose/passive. What say you?

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (8 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: HERO is BB with A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, MP1 folds, MP2 raises, CO folds, Button folds, SB folds, HERO 3-bets, UTG+1 calls, MP2 caps, HERO calls, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: (12.50 SB) T/images/graemlins/club.gif, 3/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif (3 players) 
HERO checks, UTG+1 checks, MP2 bets, HERO calls, UTG+1 raises, MP2 calls, HERO calls.

Turn: (9.25 BB) 5/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (3 players) 
HERO checks, UTG+1 bets, MP2 calls, HERO calls.

River: (12.25 BB) K/images/graemlins/club.gif (3 players) 
HERO checks (I'm not going for a check-raise here. I'm totally lost, to be honest with you), UTG+1 checks, MP2 checks.

Final Pot: 12.25 BB

Results in white below: 
HERO shows Ad Kh (one pair, kings).
UTG+1 shows Js Ts (one pair, tens).
MP2 shows 6c 6h (one pair, sixes).
Outcome: HERO wins 12.25 BB. 

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: HERO is BB with K/images/graemlins/heart.gif, T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, CO folds, Button folds, SB completes, HERO checks.

Flop: (4 SB) Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, T/images/graemlins/club.gif, 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif (4 players) 
SB checks, HERO bets, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, SB folds.

Turn: (3.50 BB) 6/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (3 players) 
HERO bets, MP2 calls, MP3 calls.

River: (6.50 BB) 8/images/graemlins/club.gif (3 players) 
HERO checks, MP2 bets, MP3 folds, HERO calls. Is this OK?

Final Pot: 8.50 BB

Results in white below: 
HERO shows Kh Td (two pair, tens and eights).
MP2 shows 3h 3c (two pair, eights and threes).
Outcome: HERO wins 8.50 BB.

sublime

05-20-2004, 01:58 PM

Hand 1:

I fold to the flop C/R

You could very well be drawing dead here, and if your not your up against a flush draw/set and likely b-way PP.

EDIT: cap with 66? /images/graemlins/confused.gif

NickyG

05-20-2004, 02:50 PM

Hand 1: Assuming it's a typical game, I would have folded after the check-raise on the flop. The play by UTG +1 screams set to me. Plus MP2 could have a big pair. Since you played this to the river, a check-call is fine IMO. Granted, this worked out for you this time, but 80-90% of the times, this play will be -EV. Why can't I find opponents that cap with 66????

Hand 2:
At the river the pot is giving you slightly better than 7-1 odds so IMO it's worth a call. What I might have done differently is check-raise the flop and bet out the turn if a seemingly harmless card doesn't fall. At least then, you get a better idea of where you're at.

Aces McGee

05-20-2004, 03:07 PM

In hand 1, it doesn't make sense to me to call all those bets if you're going to play passively when you hit your hand.

-McGee

jacki

05-20-2004, 03:27 PM

[ QUOTE ]
In hand 1, it doesn't make sense to me to call all those bets if you're going to play passively when you hit your hand.

-McGee

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, this was what bothered me the most about this hand.
Another poster said the check-raise screams set. I think it also can mean an early position limper protecting his top pair, or even a flush draw -- in this case, both.

I probably fold to that check-raise if the pot was 6-10 SBs, but it's 17 SBs when it gets back to me. I think the flop call is OK, and then the turn gives me 4 more potential outs.