Calling a raise to spike trips?

[Ben]

What rules do you guys use for determining if you'll call a raise if you're only hope to win is spiking trips?

I've heard the 5-10 rule, do most people agree with that?

I play on Party with 50bb stacks...should I not be calling raises with my low PPs?

-Ben

[Prevaricator]

What is the 5-10 rule. I call based on the odds I am getting based on the likelihood he will commit his stack if I do catch a set. Its 8.5:1 you spike trips, so you need him to call a value bet of approximately 8 times whatever he bet preflop in order for it to be worthwhile. If the guy has less than 8x his bet left in his stack, or you have less than 8x his bet in your stack, you aren't getting good enough odds. If you think the raiser has high cards, you also have the ability to steal the pot on rag flops, but you have to be careful.

BTW, do you play live games at UMass Amherst, I've never seen you before.

[Ben]

Nah. I don't play live much.

[Richie Rich]

The 5-10 theorem is the most widely accepted "rule of thumb" as to whether or not it's worth calling a PF raise. And for the most part, I agree.

However, with the low buy-ins at PP, I prefer to call a PF raise in hopes to spike a set when I've accumulated a few chips...not when I'm already down and trying to get play catch up.

btw- people don't play pocket pairs to spike trips... You either spike a set (you hold 88 and an 8 falls on the flop), or you catch trips (you hold K8 and the flop comes 8 Q 8). Make sense?

[jake_22]

What exactly is the 5/10 rule ?

[Sundevils21]

[ QUOTE ]
I call based on the odds I am getting based on the likelihood he will commit his stack if I do catch a set. Its 8.5:1 you spike trips, so you need him to call a value bet of approximately 8 times whatever he bet preflop in order for it to be worthwhile.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think you are right that it is 8.5:1 against hiting a set, but I think the odds of FLOPPING a set are 10:1, is that correct? If so you need to be able to get 10x's the size of the bet, unless of couse you're planning to call a bet on the flop and turn unimproved. Am I right on this one?

[schwza]

You can call a raise with a hand like 44 or 67s if the raise is for 5% or less of opponent's stack (or yours if it's smaller) and you shouldn't call for 10% of the smaller stack. In between, you could go either way depending on situation.

What I want to know is what is what's the difference between spiking and catching?

[Richie Rich]

You either "spike a set" or "catch trips"...but you can't "spike trips"...scroll up to my original post in this thread to see an example.

[jdl22]

I usually go 5-10.

I always thought spiking indicated hitting on the turn or river given that the odds of doing so are so bad. Of course people use catch on the river as well so I'm not sure.

[Richie Rich]

The odds of spiking a set on the flop are 8.5:1...not 10:1. However, there are many times when a spiked set loses to flushes & straights.

So to make the general rule of thumb a little more "realistic" and easier to remember, you should be getting about 10:1 odds in order to call someone's PF raise if you're holding a pocket pair and hope to spike a set on the flop.

[sniperd]

My understanding of trips is when the board is paired, (you have AK and AA5 comes out), and a set is when you have the pair in your hand.

[schwza]

[ QUOTE ]
The odds of spiking a set on the flop are 8.5:1...not 10:1.

[/ QUOTE ]

The odds of improving from a pocket pair to a set or better is 7.5:1 or 1/8.5. I'm almost sure this includes situations where 3 of a kind flops, giving you a FH. See http://www.pokerupdate.com/pokerodds.htm for a bunch of good odds.

[Richie Rich]

I stand corrected...thx