99 against the big stacks

[Che]

$30+3 Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t300 (9 handed)

UTG+1 (t2184)
MP1 (t9262)
MP2 (t6307)
Hero (t6831)
CO (t4980)
Button (t4837)
SB (t10614)
BB (t9969)
UTG (t450)

~190 of 900+ left. Avg. stack around 5000.

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.

UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 folds,

<font color="CC3333">Hero raises to t900</font>, CO folds, Button folds,

SB calls t750, BB calls t600.

Flop: (t2700) 2/images/graemlins/club.gif, 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 6/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(3 players) </font>
SB checks, <font color="CC3333">BB bets t500</font>.

What's the play? Why?

[ZootMurph]

It's one of three things:

1) It's a complete bluff.
2) It's a semi bluff... he has 2 clubs, a straight draw, or a 6 or 7 with a decent kicker.
3) He has a set.

I would put half my remaining chips into the pot at this point... making it 3k to go. The reason is you want to make it not worthwhile for him to draw to something. Chances that he has a set are slim. In fact, some might go all in here, but I don't think whether you put all your chips in, or half, his decision will be affected. So, if he will call a T2500 raise, he'd call the all in too, in my opinion. Therefore, you leave yourself an out and still throw down an imposing bet while you are ahead.

By the way, I'm guessing it is A7 or flush draw, and you are still ahead. Making it 3k to go will make him call 2500 to win 3200... bad pot odds to draw to 5 outs (A7) or 9 outs (flush draw).

[DougBrennan]

Play? Push

Why? 'Cause I don't know how the hell else to play it. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

But seriously folks. As I started reading your post and saw that the BB was 300, my first thought was that at this stage I would play 99 pretty hard pre-flop, 3xBB, maybe even 4 or 5xBB. I'd be happy taking down the blinds, and looking for one caller at most.

So then two larger stacks both call. Yuck. But now the pot is 2700, you're down to 5700 and can only make one more significant bet. On the plus side, you've got the overpair. So I would push here, hoping to eliminate straight and flush draws and overcards, and be willing to take my chances on a set or higher pair.

I don't know if that's the best play, but it is how I'd approach it. The idea of check-calling just gives me the heebie-jeebies and at least by pushing (as the original aggressor) there's a chance you win the pot uncontested. I doubt that you'd chase off a better hand, but I would be willing to risk it here.

Doug

Added with edit. I completely missed the fact that you were bet into post-flop. I still think I'd push. I don't like a call much here, for the same straight-flush-overcard reasons, and I personally can't see folding this hand with the overpair. If the BB is tricky enough to make this small bet with a set or big pair, well I'd just make a note on him, lick my wounds and move on.

[Che]

Zoot (and others, of course /images/graemlins/wink.gif)-

If you bet half your stack and are called, what is your plan when the turn is:

1) A /images/graemlins/club.gif
2) some other /images/graemlins/club.gif
3) some other A
4) a non-club K or Q
5) a blank

Assume the opponent checks to you on the turn.

Thanks in advance,
Che

[DougBrennan]

I think there is one more good reason for going all-in as opposed to betting half your stack. It completely eliminates the chance that the opponent thinks he can take you out of the hand. In other words,pushing says to your opponent "You're going to have to have better cards than I do, because I can't go anywhere now."

I know that I am occassionally dissuaded from playing a hand just by the knowledge that an all-in has eliminated any possibility of getting tricky of bluffing someone off a pot.

Doug

[Jason Strasser]

This is a push. Doug seems right on to things, you really want to win this pot uncontested. On PP, I see a lot of big stacks calling raises like this, then opening up hoping to push you off overcards. I would almost rule out a set, but that's just Jason the "you are not smart enough to pull that on me" Strasser thinking.

But sometimes I am wrong. =)

One final thought, if you bet half your stack, instead of push. The big stack may call with overcards, and then decide to fold if you push. (Especially fishy agressive ones) You do not want that. Another reason to push.

[SossMan]

[ QUOTE ]
Zoot (and others, of course )-

If you bet half your stack and are called, what is your plan when the turn is:

1) A
2) some other
3) some other A
4) a non-club K or Q
5) a blank

Assume the opponent checks to you on the turn.

Thanks in advance,
Che


[/ QUOTE ]

I would go ahead and sh!t my pants.

[gmunny]

Did you have a read on how the BB plays and what kind of hand he would play? Is he loose or tight? Is he a good player or lucky? Would he call your pre-flop raise with 66 and small bet/slow play on the flop? Without a read on how the BB plays I would either re-raise $1.5k(and fold if he pops it back) or fold. I would probably re-raise thinking he would be on a nut flush draw, if he calls then you have a decision if a club doesnt come up. Since you have average stack, I don't think I would risk busting out over this hand, though. Just my .02. G$

[BettnTibetn]

the play is really simple here....reraise i unit on top. for all you know he just hit a top pair, by re-raising you might get him out of the pot. Or at least indiacte the type of hand he has.

[Che]

I decided to go with ZootMurph's approach (roughly) and bet 2500 into the pot of 3200. To my great surprise, the SB called and the BB folded when it was only 2000 more to see an 8200 chip pot when he had put 500 in just moments earlier. /images/graemlins/confused.gif /images/graemlins/confused.gif

The turn was A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif making the board 2/images/graemlins/club.gif 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif 6/images/graemlins/club.gif A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.

SB checked to me and I fell on my sword (I mean I pushed in my remaining chips) and he quickly called and showed A /images/graemlins/heart.gif K /images/graemlins/spade.gif. No miracle on the river and I'm out.

I'm not proud of it, but that's what happened.

BTW I'm still interested in the answers to the questions I asked ZootMurph if anyone would like to take a shot at them:

[ QUOTE ]
If you bet half your stack and are called, what is your plan when the turn is:

1) A /images/graemlins/club.gif
2) some other /images/graemlins/club.gif
3) some other A
4) a non-club K or Q
5) a blank

Assume the opponent checks to you on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

Note: There are 8200 chips in the pot when it is checked to you on the turn. You have 3431 left. Average stack is a few chips under 5000. 190 left, 100 paid.

Thanks,
Che

[banditbdl]

Push, you can't just call or make a minimum type raise and let them stay in with potential overcars. A pot size bet is then 50% of your stack so I think all-in is the way to go.

[MVicuna]

Hi,

my play? I raise a reasonable amount say, 1500-2000. Nobody knows how big my over pair is and I want to see if they are just trying to push me off a hand with just a draw.

That bet of 500 into an 1800 pot into the PreFlop raiser is begging you to fold or reraise all-in so they can break you.

If they call, I'm only calling, folding if any of the draws hit and they make a bet that will drop me to less then 10x the BB. If they called my flop raise just to push me off my hand I'm out classed anyways so sneaking into the money or "all-in video poker" when I get short stacked is my best hope.

If they called just trying to hit over cards there is a decent chance they are loose enough they'd call you anyways applying the fish logic that made them call your raise on the flop.

MarkV.

[MVicuna]

Hi,

Only the weak-tightest of players folds for 3000 more into a 12k pot when they happily called 2500 only Getting around 1:2 on their money calling 1:4 is something they can't pass up.

So your only play on the turn is check or fold if #1,#2,#3 regardless of what falls. Assuming a reasonable opponent, they said their hand is strong enough that they can call getting 1:2. So they wont ever fold to your bet on the turn getting 1:4 on their money.

I say this a lot when people post hands, but dont assume your opponents are muppets unless they prove it, repeatedly. So someone who calls when you pot commit yourself is calling your bet on the turn so why make it. You should try to get to showdown quickly and cheaply and not bet the turn and then call the river bet because you may have just induced a bluff.

Seeing what they turned up, they were not thinking, just gambling. I wouldnt doubt if they were %100% sure you had KQ or KJ so their hand was good regardless of what fell.

MarkV.