I turned into a calling station for this hand $6-$12 @ the Borgata

[Mike Gallo]

I had this hand Friday afternoon at a typical $6-$12 game at the Borgata.

I have played with the main villian in this hand many times. I know his tendencies pretty well, however I do not know if he knows my tendencies. On the hand.

4 limpers to me and I call from the button with 88. The blinds both call and the flop comes

2 /images/graemlins/spade.gif 10 /images/graemlins/heart.gif 7 /images/graemlins/club.gif

Checked to me and I bet everyone folds to the villian who raises. Everyone folds to me and I call. He sat UTG + 1. He entered the pot first. I have never seen this player limp reraise or play tricky preflop.

Turn 3 /images/graemlins/heart.gif 2 /images/graemlins/spade.gif 10 /images/graemlins/heart.gif 7 /images/graemlins/club.gif

He bet I called.

River 3 /images/graemlins/spade.gif3 /images/graemlins/heart.gif 2 /images/graemlins/spade.gif 10 /images/graemlins/heart.gif 7 /images/graemlins/club.gif

He bet I called. What did he have? Thoughts and results to follow.

[bunky9590]

He had JT. EVERYBODY dwn there plays that garbage early on out of position., lol

Of course if he's one of the stone cold morons, he had A7s

[Mike Gallo]

[ QUOTE ]
He had JT. EVERYBODY dwn there plays that garbage early on out of position., lol

Of course if he's one of the stone cold morons, he had A7s

[/ QUOTE ]

No soup for you /images/graemlins/grin.gif Try again.

[Randy Burgess]

I hate these guessing games but I'll try. My assumptions: 1) You are not an idiot, and 2) you called all the way rather than raising at any point because you felt you likely had him beat but not with such certainty that you could risk a reraise. This leaves aside any notion you might be setting him up for a future play.

It's possible he had either a straight draw with 98s or gutshot draw with something like J9s, but only if he thought it was an exceptionally loose-passive table and if he likes to play headup situations aggressively.

What about overcards with a backdoor draw? It couldn't be a hand with big overcards because he would have raised preflop. That leaves something like QJs, possibly hearts, meaning his river bet was his only chance to win the pot since he whiffed.

I'm sure I'm wrong about both the above. I'm somewhat interested in a melancholy way to find out the answer.

[Ralph Wiggum]

Well I'm not sure about his PF starting conditions, so I'll assume that he's got some sense of what to play. But I'll also assume that he's a little looser than he should be. He could be check/raising with what? Overpairs are possible. 98 is the only realistic draw that I see. He could have a set (TT, 77, 22). Also, the only other hand I see as being possible is AT (KT, QT, JT, T9 also). 2 pair is unlikely.

You say he's not tricky PF, so I'll throwout the overpairs. The C/R on the flop has me doubting that it's a set, b/c people like to slowplay that til more expensive streets. The bet on the turn doesn't mean he's not betting a draw, as he could have picked up an additional flush draw. So I think 98s is still possible. Him betting the river has to make me believe he's got ATs, with just a slight possibility of bluffing with 98. I think you're beat, but I wish you luck (retroactively).

Ralph's 0.02

[sthief09]

He had A /images/graemlins/heart.gif7 /images/graemlins/heart.gif?

Depending on the person, I might've 3-bet the flop. If he's the type to bet out top pair, like many, then you can be "sure" he doesn't have a T. If he's the type to suspect that the button will be just about anything if checked to, then there's a good chance he has overcards or a small pair. With 3 people to act behind him, it's tough to tell if he would've bet top pair. Personally, if I was holding a hand like AT or JT I would've bet out in this spot.

Now that I think of it, 3-betting the flop accomplishes just about nothing. If you're ahead, you're only chasing him out with 5 or 6 outs (at the most) on the turn, which isn't something you want, and if you're behind, you'll lose more money.

I think it's likely he had a pair with an overcard kicker on the flop, and you realized this, so you called down to get the most from him. What would you have done if an A fell on the turn or river?

[tripdad]

77

cheers!

[Joe Tall]

He hand 9 /images/graemlins/heart.gif8 /images/graemlins/heart.gif and you win.

Peace,
Joe Tall

[Mike Gallo]

Josh,

I knew I considered you an up and coming poster for a reason. Very close.

[Mike Gallo]

A bit about the villain for this hand. He views me as a tight player who can laydown a hand. To me I interpreted his check raise as a vunerable hand. I did not put him on anyhand that had a 10. He would have bet with a 10 and hoped that someone would raise him. What hands could he have? I decided to call down the rest of the way to see.

Poster Sthief09 came the closest. The villian had A /images/graemlins/heart.gif2 /images/graemlins/heart.gif

I will post more thoughts as I get some more responses.

[Mike Gallo]

My assumptions: 1) You are not an idiot, and 2) you called all the way rather than raising at any point because you felt you likely had him beat but not with such certainty that you could risk a reraise. This leaves aside any notion you might be setting him up for a future play

I figured if I raised he might fold and continue on with the bluff, or he could have limped with a hand like Jacks and hoped I had a 10.

I'm sure I'm wrong about both the above.

You came pretty close /images/graemlins/tongue.gif He had a piece of the flop with a back door draw.

[Mike Gallo]

Also, the only other hand I see as being possible is AT (KT, QT, JT, T9 also). 2 pair is unlikely.

I think he attempted to represent A 10.

The C/R on the flop has me doubting that it's a set, b/c people like to slowplay that til more expensive streets

I thought the same thing. Thats why I decided to call down. He might not have a set, but he could because I would expect him to play slow.

I think you're beat, but I wish you luck (retroactively).

I posted a winner this time.

[Mike Gallo]

He had JT. EVERYBODY dwn there plays that garbage early on out of position.,


I just got the joke. If he had a hand like J 10, he would have bet out I think.

[tpir90036]

i don't see anything wrong with calling this down. you aren't going to get a better hand to fold and if he is betting a draw you make the most money by not letting him off the hook with a raise. does this line of thinking make sense or am i weak-tight as well?

[Mike Gallo]

[ QUOTE ]
i don't see anything wrong with calling this down. you aren't going to get a better hand to fold and if he is betting a draw you make the most money by not letting him off the hook with a raise. does this line of thinking make sense or am i weak-tight as well.

[/ QUOTE ]

I like this line of play, hence why I chose it.

Sometimes calling makes more money then raising. I found this hand a good example of when such a time exists.