set of kings

[morgant]

first hand at the table, posted in mid posistion, sorta scary flop for this seeming monster?????



Hand #1507154-2170 at Stuyvesant (No Limit Hold'em)
Powered by UltimateBet
Started at 02/May/04 04:55:34

morgant is at seat 0 with $400.
Bacon Meld is at seat 1 with $337.
MESTIRSOB is at seat 2 with $481.
jumpybongo is at seat 3 with $366.50.
rchap is at seat 4 with $905.50.
EmeraldAxe is at seat 5 with $350.
davgar is at seat 6 with $112.
rowdyrowden is at seat 7 with $473.50.
lake of fire is at seat 8 with $351.50.
KingsnAces is at seat 9 with $703.
The button is at seat 3.

rchap posts the small blind of $2.
EmeraldAxe posts the big blind of $4.
morgant posts out of turn for $4.

morgant: Ks Kd
Bacon Meld: -- --
MESTIRSOB: -- --
jumpybongo: -- --
rchap: -- --
EmeraldAxe: -- --
davgar: -- --
rowdyrowden: -- --
lake of fire: -- --
KingsnAces: -- --

Pre-flop:

davgar folds. rowdyrowden calls. lake of fire
folds. KingsnAces raises to $8. morgant calls.
Bacon Meld folds. MESTIRSOB folds. jumpybongo
folds. rchap folds. EmeraldAxe calls. rowdyrowden
calls.

Flop (board: Td Kh Ad):

EmeraldAxe checks. rowdyrowden bets $10. KingsnAces
raises to $64.

[morgant]

okay so the lack of replies indicates the distaste for my not reraising preflop????

[SlyAK]

Not fond of just calling the PF min-raise, I would make it 20 or so anyway.

Post flop as you know there are exactly two hands that you are behind. QJ, and AA. You have solid outs against QJ, only about a 2:1 dog, and are drawing to the case King against AA. But can you put anyone on AA???

My guess is that you are ahead here. I would guess that KingnAces has flopped 2 pair or a set of 10's and is trying to protect his hand from a gutshot draw, flush draw etc. The other player could have any ace, a flush draw or worse. A re-raise is definitely in order here. If someone does have 2 pair or better they will probably call. No one can put you on a set of Kings here since you didnt re-raise preflop.

The pot is getting semi-decent so if you take it down that's ok. If you do happen to be behind so be it, unless I had a superb read on the players I would take my chance here any day.

Sly

[morgant]

i reraised around $200, kings set me in?

[Thythe]

Not like I know anything, but I still wouldn't put him on AA. Even on the chance he had it, there's so much in the pot that you really can't fold at this point. I would even say that QJs is more likely than AA, but like the above poster said, you've got outs on that and should be fine to call.

[Huskiez]

[ QUOTE ]
okay so the lack of replies indicates the distaste for my not reraising preflop????

[/ QUOTE ]

I think a raise preflop is in order. You have position on the raiser, and often a minraise from my experience online either means a hand that an opponent wants to see a flop for cheaply, or AA where they are begging for a reraise so they can reraise that. I think reraising it preflop will allow you then to confidently fold preflop if he reraises large. The only reason I might just call is for deception.

Given that you did not do that and we are at a flop, playing this hand really sucks. The pot is now around 100. You have around 390 left, with raiser having you covered. I think I personally let this one go. That might be extremely weak tight, but that min raise preflop followed by the decent raise on the flop screams AA, TT, QJ, or AK. You're drawing practically dead to one hand, drawing slim to another, and favorite to the other two. I think it could be difficult getting all your money in when you are the favorite. I get out cheap, muttering to myself why I didn't raise preflop.

By the way, this is because you're playing at Ultimate Bet, where I hear the players are very tight. If this is Party, I pot reraise it, getting ready to push on the turn.

[Huskiez]

[ QUOTE ]
Not like I know anything, but I still wouldn't put him on AA. Even on the chance he had it, there's so much in the pot that you really can't fold at this point. I would even say that QJs is more likely than AA, but like the above poster said, you've got outs on that and should be fine to call.

[/ QUOTE ]

The pot is slightly more than 100. He has 392 left. I don't think he is pot committed. I also don't want to be putting my entire stack against QJ even if I do have outs against it. However if there are quite a few hands other than QJ and AA that you think your opponent will play with you, then I think you can do battle with your KK and raise it up.

[Thythe]

[ QUOTE ]
i reraised around $200, kings set me in?

[/ QUOTE ]

Since he reraised $200 the pot has grown to $300 or so with him only having something slightly less than $200 to call with. I think you win this hand way better than 50% of the time and say go for it.

[DcifrThs]

[DcifrThs]

this flop isn't scary given the action. the only hands you fear are AA and QJ. with AA being MUCH more likely from the raiser given the action.

i'd say you're going pretty damn near the felt here since AK, AT TT are all possible and QJ just doesn't seem very likely from either the raiser pf, who raised to $8 or the $8 cold caller. i think they wouldn't do that with qj.

i don't necessarily like your cold call preflop. id take it to $15 preflop and see what happens. if he moves you in you have an easy fold and don't need to worry.

given your action and the flop i'd make it $100 to go after he raises to $64. maybe $125. you have a real monster here...only 2 hands beat you one of which is VERY unlikely and the other of which he's just going to have to show you
-Barron

[Malone Brown]

I would definately call, mostly due to the fact that I've played with kings alot and know he's probably the wildest NL player I've ever seen, he would make this move with any ace.

[morgant]

my sentiments exactly malone, i felt pretty decent about getting my money in now and hoping not to get outdrawn. so i did, all of it. turns out he had qj and i got no help.....

[morgant]

offend whom? all the info in the history is easily attainable by anyone who cares enough to find it.

[luckycharms]

Ok, so you got a good card on the flop... unfortunately the board was littered with things that coulda beat you. You coulda solved this with a reraise preflop. You wanna isolate with KK anyways. Reraise! Don't be greedy trying to get other limpers! 20% of the time an ace will fall on the flop with no help to you.... and that's assuming that one is already out. What then? Somewhat of an anomaly, but still. You have 2nd to the nuts... reraise! That's what I'd do about 80% of the time, anyways