Honesty on this site..

[BeerMoney]

How many of you are skeptical of the results that some people post on this site?

These are the things that I am skeptical of.

A lot of the claims that people are making about BB/hr.
What happened to that dude who said he could make $100k in 100 days? And ThrillFactor?

I also think some people even lie about the advice they give sometime. Crap like, "ya, I fold KQs out of the big blind if its raised. There's a good chance you're dominated, blah blah blah."

With the distribution of the hands I'm given at Party Poker, if I were to play the way some people on here say they do, I would never play a hand.

I think people lie about their poker skills the way they lie about their golf games. Everybody wants to be good, but only a few really are.

[Mike Gallo]

I think people lie about their poker skills the way they lie about their golf games. Everybody wants to be good, but only a few really are.

I completely agree. Thats why I admit I do not play well so I do not have to lie.

Welcome aboard.

Very cutting edge post. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[M2d]

[ QUOTE ]
What happened to that dude who said he could make $100k in 100 days?

[/ QUOTE ]
If this is what I remember, it was Ulysses's joke responding to similar threads about smaller sums in other time periods.
As to the [ QUOTE ]
"ya, I fold KQs out of the big blind if its raised. There's a good chance you're dominated, blah blah blah."


[/ QUOTE ] stuff, I believe it because I've seen those posters (who can flat out play poker) do it all the time.

Perhaps everyone isn't telling the truth, but I'm pretty certain that most of what gets posted here is close. Think about how many poker players there are in the world. How many of those are willing to spend the time reading, etc. to improve? This board is one resource, so participation here is an indication of a willingness to do more than pray for good cards. I think the percentage of winning and/or good players here on the board is much higher than in real life simply because of this.

[Max2]

I am sckepical of the posters here. Most spend an unual amount of time of trying to make $ by bumming bonuses. I have never even considered a bonus as a ligitimate effort to make $. The worse is on the "Internet" site. Those folks simply try to make cute messages. All fluff, no substance.

[Ulysses]

The $100k in 100 days was a real post. I believe you were thinking of my $200k in 7 days. I failed at that one.

[Mike Gallo]

I believe you were thinking of my $200k in 7 days. I failed at that one.

You played under duress /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[scrub]

[ QUOTE ]
What happened to that dude who said he could make $100k in 100 days?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm positive that that guy is legit. I used to watch him play NLHE on Paradise last spring/summer, and he was one of the strongest players I have ever seen.

I'm pretty skeptical about Mike's claims not to be very good, though... /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Bottom line is, why should you care if someone posts inflated numbers about their results? I know the advice of many posters on this forum has greatly helped my game. Knowing exactly how many BB/hr they make down to 3 decimal places wouldn't change the quality of their advice one way or the other.

scrub

[namknils]

Lol, I was just looking at the few hands I played against ThrillFactor in my pokertracker the other day. I haven't seen him around here or on party in a long time. I don't think he got the results he was expecting.

[Ulysses]

I believe most of what I read wrt win rates. Some of the posters I know, others I've seen play. However, of all the rates that get posted, many are unsustainable for the people posting them. The variance in these online games is HUGE and it's very easy for people to have results that are wildly different than their medium/long-term expectation. There are some really expert players here making a ton of money, but there are also some people who have had really nice hot streaks.

[CrackerZack]

Most of the site is either full of [censored] or taking small runs and posting their inflated rates. But what do I know? I'm the only losing player on 2+2.

[prairieboy]

Most posters probably believe what they write is true, but many are mistaken.

For example: Misinterpreting a 4+BB/100 Hands over 1000 hands to mean that they have a long-term 4+BB/100 win rate.

When they write "fold KQs in the BB to a raise", they usually mean, "I wish that I hadn't called that raise with KQs, and I'm never going to do it again...".

Unlike golf where there is solid, undeniable evidence that you suck, poker offers ample opportunities for self delusion. e.g. catching a hot run of cards that even a monkey could play profitably, "they sucked out on me again", "I can only beat good players", "I hate AA because they always lose" etc.

AND, over time here you'll notice that when a player is winning, they like to read and post here a lot. When they're losing, they disappear. Thus, much of the commentary, results & advice you see here is self-selecting.

Take note of who is giving what advice, it won't be long before you realize who the real giants on this site are and seek out their posts.

[Mike Gallo]

AND, over time here you'll notice that when a player is winning, they like to read and post here a lot. When they're losing, they disappear. Thus, much of the commentary, results & advice you see here is self-selecting.

I often notice this myself.

[MaxPower]

[ QUOTE ]
AND, over time here you'll notice that when a player is winning, they like to read and post here a lot. When they're losing, they disappear. Thus, much of the commentary, results & advice you see here is self-selecting.

I often notice this myself.

[/ QUOTE ]

I've noticed this as well. I tend to post here a lot when I am losing. It is easy to slip in to bad habits when you are losing and posting here helps avoid that.

I try not to lie about my ability. I know that the main reason I have had success at poker is that I try to play in games where my competition is absolutely terrible (not that hard to do). I make plenty of mistakes, but fortunately my opponents make many times more.

I try to learn and improve my game every day. The more I learn, the more terrible players I see:)

[M.B.E.]

I don't get it. You've made all of two posts on this site, and you decide to level nebulous allegations of dishonesty? If you don't think the information you obtain here is reliable, just don't visit this site.

[sfer]

I agree 100% with everything you wrote. I'm lying right now.

[M2d]

Sorry, I was on vacation on that one with a mission to polish off 200 beers in 200 hours. I failed, too, but not for lack of trying.

[M2d]

I've never said that I play well. any positive results I've had only come from my opponents playing horrendously.
I've also never posted or uttered a truer statement.

[offTopic]

[ QUOTE ]

How many of you are skeptical of the results that some people post on this site?

...

I think people lie about their poker skills the way they lie about their golf games. Everybody wants to be good, but only a few really are.

[/ QUOTE ]

If it makes you feel any better, I, while +$ for over three years, have an hourly earn slightly in excess of your average Indonesian Nike factory worker.

Also, while I have broken 90 several times, I haven't yet this year (coming up on 10 rounds now) and it's driving me fookin' crazy!* /images/graemlins/crazy.gif

* - three separate occasions already, I've needed to par the 18th to finish with 89 - I play the ball down and always putt out - and I made at least a double-bogey each time. /images/graemlins/mad.gif

[J.A.Sucker]

You play good, my friend. I have always been impressed when I have played with you, and I'm not easily impressed.

[M2d]

don't fool yourself. it's the signal to noise ratio. I leave a lot of bets on the table (especially against cute girls and rich guys who may become investors in later ventures I dream up), but, in the bay area, we can get away with stuff like that and still win money.

[eggzz]

I never lie about my golf game. I have a 17.6 handicap, but I play more like a 14. Wait, isn't that embellishing? Sort of, since your handicap in golf takes into consideration the difficulty of the golf courses you play. There are similarities to ones' handicap in poker.

If you make positive xBB per hour, but play mainly in soft games, you could very likely be a negative xBB per hour player in a higher limit game. (the goal is finding these soft games on a consistent basis)

I can play my local golf courses and shoot 84-88 all the time. But get my on Firestone, and I'll be lucky to break a hundred. But you know what? My handicap will not go up or down.

So there can be an extremely high variance to how successful you are in poker, depending upon how easy or difficult your course is.

I also never fold KQs to a raise in the BB.

Thats why I'm here.

[Ray Zee]

its an accepted fact that all the posters on this forum are a bunch of liars and braggards. no big deal as the truthful ones all are on the other topics forum.

[JohnShaft]

[ QUOTE ]
I also think some people even lie about the advice they give sometime. Crap like, "ya, I fold KQs out of the big blind if its raised. There's a good chance you're dominated, blah blah blah."

With the distribution of the hands I'm given at Party Poker, if I were to play the way some people on here say they do, I would never play a hand.


[/ QUOTE ]

Strange statement. If you're implying some people talk a super-tight game but you don't think they're capable of always playing that way, I completely disagree. Don't underestimate the power of discipline in some people.

You can have a very good player, but even that doesn't mean they necessarily have to have rock solid discipline, or super tight preflop play.
A lot of people prone to looseness assume that everyone gets bored at some times and starts lowering their starting standards. When, with some, this just isn't true. They can play that way ALL of the time. And without much of a struggle.

If you don't mean this then I really don't see what you are getting at.
[Note I'm not talking about making bad folds. Bad folds are bad, whether you are a Zen master of discipline or not.]

[Schmed]

I see that too. That's why I like to post hands that I lose.

I think people go through phases as well. I play a lot of hands but 99% of them are ABC.

Bottom line is the more you post and think about your game the better you will become regardless of why you made those posts.

[Schmed]

Why set your sights so low??

[andyfox]

Whereas I always tell the truth.

[M2d]

it was my unemployed period, and there aren't any cardrooms in hawaii

[Schmed]

You need to go for at least 2 bb's/hr.....that's two big ass beers per hour....isn't that what they are talking about when they talk about BB/Hr????

[J_V]

[ QUOTE ]
but there are also some people who have had really nice hot streaks.

[/ QUOTE ]


yeah, like that [censored] fish astro, playing 21% of his hands

SHeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeesh /images/graemlins/smile.gif.

[Garbonzo]

[ QUOTE ]

How many of you are skeptical of the results that some people post on this site?

These are the things that I am skeptical of.

A lot of the claims that people are making about BB/hr.
What happened to that dude who said he could make $100k in 100 days? And ThrillFactor?

I also think some people even lie about the advice they give sometime. Crap like, "ya, I fold KQs out of the big blind if its raised. There's a good chance you're dominated, blah blah blah."

With the distribution of the hands I'm given at Party Poker, if I were to play the way some people on here say they do, I would never play a hand.

I think people lie about their poker skills the way they lie about their golf games. Everybody wants to be good, but only a few really are.

[/ QUOTE ]

I would think you should size people up here the same as you would at the poker table. Some are tight, some are loose, some are bluffers, some play the "nuts". If you can't get a feel for who has knowledge here and who doesn't, then you might have similar problems at the tables.

I have been reading here about a month. I have zero concern for who is lying and who is telling the truth. I can pick out 10 posters with a wealth of knowledge, and regardless of their BB/hour I will pay attention to what is written.

Regards.

[OrangeHeat]

It's ok. Your not the only break even/losing player reading these boards that can't believe people actually make money from poker.

It's no excuse for categorizing everyone as liars.

Orange

[BeerMoney]

I see people make money all the time. Its not unbelievable. I just think some people are full of BS. I guess you can't understand that.

[snakehead]

I am sometimes skeptical of the win rates I read about on these pages. it's hard for me to believe that low-limit online players make as much or more than I do. as of right now, my overall win rate is about 1.25 bb per hour, and in my best game it is just under 2 bb per hour. and for the life of me, I can't sustain a winning record online. maybe I don't try hard enough, or maybe my game depends on looking my opponent in the eye, I don't know which.

as for KQs in the bb, I would never throw it away for one raise, and I don't know of any high limit pros who would. you're already half in, fer cryin out loud.

but what really pisses me off is people like andy fox who take money out of the cardroom when they really don't need it.

[Joe Tall]

What happened to that dude who said he could make $100k in 100 days?

He is still very much here.

I also think some people even lie about the advice they give sometime. Crap like, "ya, I fold KQs out of the big blind if its raised. There's a good chance you're dominated, blah blah blah."

Just because you never fold KQs to any raise does not mean that other players here do when it is warranted. Sometimes you shold fold KQs and sometimes you should 3-bet, other times you call. Deciding the correct action to choose, given a situation, is the difference between losing and winning players.

if I were to play the way some people on here say they do, I would never play a hand.

Most losing and begining players play too many hands. This is their first fundamental mistake.

Everybody wants to be good, but only a few really are.

This is true.

Stop concerning yourself about others win rates and concern yourself with your own. Read and respond to the stategy posts in the Micro/Small Stake/Mid-High/No-limit Pot Limit forums. Work diligently on your game, read and dicuss things constantly.

Hopefully then you will not be as frustrated.

Welcome to the forum,
Joe Tall

[ResidentParanoid]

The first step to taking advantage of this forum is listening to the advice of others and then critically evaluating it. Seems like you have taken the first step.

[J.A.Sucker]

I agree with everything that you say. I also know that you're the best player who posts on this board who isn't named Zee.

I had a lot of problems online for awhile and couldn't really win, either. There were a multitude of reasons, but many of them had to deal with those bets on the turn that you just "know" what to do with in real life that you just don't feel out correctly online. Also, I had a hard time focusing, which is likely doubly true for you, since you play stakes about 2X what I do. I also had a hard time controlling my emotions online, which ironically is my strongest ability in the cardroom. Finally, people just play strangley as hell on the internet. They are truly terrible, but different than any people that I have ever come across. You have to make some strange plays, indeed. All I can say is that I have only been to Bay 101 once in the past month, and I'm having one of my most profitiable months playing poker ever, playing mainly shorthanded 15-30 games (3 players usually). It's unbelievable how much money I have made since I've made some adjustments, but you should stay out of my games, Mr. Man.

[mike l.]

"but what really pisses me off is people like andy fox who take money out of the cardroom when they really don't need it."

never fear, ive heard he's really loosened up lately. and i recently played in a game with him where he played virtually any 4 cards. there was some high stakes snob who was too busy playing 500-1000 in timbuktu or something to show up and see for himself...

[fluff]

"How many of you are skeptical of the results that some people post on this site?

These are the things that I am skeptical of."

You know what your results are, why care what someone else says they make?

"I also think some people even lie about the advice they give sometime. Crap like, "ya, I fold KQs out of the big blind if its raised. There's a good chance you're dominated, blah blah blah."

While there is no shortage of bad advice, I doubt a lot (if any) of it is intentional. Some people don't know better, are eager beavers and try to be helpful, but are wrong anyway. As your poker game progresses you'll know what is what.

"With the distribution of the hands I'm given at Party Poker, if I were to play the way some people on here say they do, I would never play a hand."

Just incidentally, how many hands (as a percentage) do you play? And at what limits?

"I think people lie about their poker skills the way they lie about their golf games. Everybody wants to be good, but only a few really are."

Maybe. But what I'm certain about is that most people who truly are interested in learning and are diligently reading the more "poker oriented" forums such as "small-stakes", "micro-limit" can become (if not already are) +EV.

[Duke]

[ QUOTE ]
it's hard for me to believe that low-limit online players make as much or more than I do.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's a whole different game. Really. I know people who can't seem to really win online at Party, and that's the easiest site to win on. And some of these guys are high limit players near your caliber.

It's all about playing a ton of hands, and value betting like mad. There is no poker to be played online... it's a completely different thing. And it's boring. But a realistic hourly rate for a 5-10 player playing 4 games at once will be about a hundred an hour. I'd be skeptical of more than that.

~D

[JimRivett]

Andy and I had lunch yesterday, I kept looking over my shoulder for you, we contemplated having a $250 lunch.

And yes, Andy cleaned up at the tables - again.

Jim

[Al_Capone_Junior]

Many people who post on these forums DO lie. People will always say things to make themselves look better than they really are. BB/hour is probably one of the biggest areas of falsehoods. Posting unrealistic supposed win rates only hurts their credibility with those smart enough to realize the reality of poker life tho.

However, there are many really good posters who don't lie, don't give stupid advice, etc. If you can recognise the difference between the good and the bad, and filter it accordingly, then you're probably on your way to really learning from these forums.

al

[glen]

"It's all about playing a ton of hands, and value betting like mad. There is no poker to be played online... it's a completely different thing."

Are we not exagerrating here? /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[snakehead]

[ QUOTE ]
I also know that you're the best player who posts on this board who isn't named Zee.


[/ QUOTE ]

not even close. I just play higher than most of the posters here. what I am good at is game selection. I look for the most profitable games and make the most of them.

as for online, I am ahead in the games, but not by enough to make it worthwhile to spend any more time in them. I did win a seat in the wsop online though, so I guess it's good for something.

[snakehead]

I messaged you with my phone number and asked when and where, which you failed to respond to. those are key elements if you intend to invite me somewhere.

not that I would have showed up.

[snakehead]

[ QUOTE ]
And yes, Andy cleaned up at the tables - again

[/ QUOTE ]

yes, and now he's getting too big for his britches. yesterday, he was leaving by way of my table as he usually does on the way to his parking place at the front door to the casino, and I yelled at him. he pretended not to see or hear me and just kept walking.

[skp]

5-10. 4 games. $100 per hour?

Hmmm

That's 2.5 big bets per hour per game. Even the best of players have a tough time making 2 bigs per hour in one game. And I have to think that when you play 4 games at once, your hourly rate in each game has to suffer as you are sure to have less of a read on your opponents.

I have no reason to doubt that you may have earned this type of rate to date (if that is in fact what you are saying)but I would chalk that up to running extremely good. I doubt that anyone can maintain it over the long run.

[CrackerZack]

online you get 65-70 hands an hour. That's about double what you'll see live so its not actually that unreasonable. I was a non-believer but a number of well-respected posters and IRC channel peeps are claiming to hold a 3 BB/100 rate with some pretty significant data. Even with that its closer to 2 BBs/hr/table so you may be right, but it seems quite possible to get close.

[J.R.]

"Even the best of players have a tough time making 2 bigs per hour in one game."

I think this is true for middle limit live B&M games, but when you consider the relative softness of many online 5-10 games and the greater number of hands one is dealt per hour as opposed to live play, 2.5/big bets/hour, while still a very large number, becomes much more plausible.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
That's 2.5 big bets per hour per game. Even the best of players have a tough time making 2 bigs per hour in one game.

[/ QUOTE ]

Note that online full games deal about 65 hands/hr. 6-max games I play often deal 100+/hr, depending on how many people in them.

[ QUOTE ]
And I have to think that when you play 4 games at once, your hourly rate in each game has to suffer

[/ QUOTE ]

That's what I thought as well, but I very quickly moved from 1 game to 4 games online. Others play 6 to 8 successfully. One huge factor here is player notes. I have simple notes (maniac, only raises w/ nuts, always semi-bluffs, etc.) for many of the regular players in my games. More serious online players have much more detailed notes that include playing stats (% flops seen, % raises, etc.) that give them way more info than they would ever have live. With hand histories, you can go see what all your opponents play and every called river hand is available to you. Way more data than you get live.

[ QUOTE ]
I would chalk that up to running extremely good. I doubt that anyone can maintain it over the long run.

[/ QUOTE ]

A number of top players are making over 2bb/hr per table playing 3 or more tables online at limits up to 15/30. This is over tens of thousands of hands, often the equivalent of 1000+ hours in B&M.

Here's the thing. B&M 15-30/20-40, I made about 1.5BB/hr over a sample size of > 1000 hrs. I figure I averaged somewhere between 30-35 hands/hr w/ a $3/drop or $7/hr charge and $1 jackpot. Plus $1/hand tip. And waitress tips, etc.

Online, I have a max rake of $3/hand, often $1 or $2. No tips. And instead of 30-35 hands per hour, I get almost 350-400 hands/hr. The opponents live and online are of similar caliber. Is it any surprise I make a lot more online than live?

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
I am sometimes skeptical of the win rates I read about on these pages. it's hard for me to believe that low-limit online players make as much or more than I do.

[/ QUOTE ]

Making a ton online is all about multi-tabling. Some people have a knack for that, others don't. I have no problem multi-tabling and see 400 hands/hr online. 400 hands/hr.

My only problem w/ online is that I find it boring as all hell and can only play an hour or two max at a time. In fact, I didn't play for the last two weeks because I got so tired of it - having only played 15 total hours the first two weeks of the month.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
5-10. 4 games. $100 per hour?

[/ QUOTE ]

BTW, I played about 40,000 hands of 5-10 online w/ a win rate of well over $100/hr playing 3 games for most of that period, 4 games for some if it. On average I got a little over 300 hands/hr.

[whiskeytown]

it's possible...I know I am no longer deluding myself with my results now that I have my tracking sheet...

I can honestly say over the last 4 months I am a winning player in tournaments, averaging $16/hr for for NL and slightly less for PL/Limit - I'm up over 1200 for the yr so far.

I can also state that I am down virtually the same amount in raked games - mostly LL - from 2/4 to 6/12 - but I've also only put in a 1/3 of my time in that as opposed to over 300 hrs. in tourney play this year...

but I wouldn't know without an exact spreadsheet...it's so close right now...I think I'm about $20 down for the year...but I've pretty much given up on rake games for the last month, so I hope to see those results bounce back a bit as I focus more on my tourney game.

RB

[skp]

Well, I guess I stand corrected.

Thanks for the info.

I may have to get online and try this multiple games system.

[mike l.]

"not that I would have showed up."

yes, virginia, there IS honesty on this site!

[Ray Zee]

rb, you need to work into higher limits in good games to overcome the rake effectively.

[tiltboy]

[ QUOTE ]
I am sckepical of the posters here. Most spend an unual amount of time of trying to make $ by bumming bonuses. I have never even considered a bonus as a ligitimate effort to make $. The worse is on the "Internet" site. Those folks simply try to make cute messages. All fluff, no substance.

[/ QUOTE ]

You can be as sckepical (sic) as you like but that doesn't change the fact that I've made thousands of dollars on poker bonuses over the last 3 years and I'm nowhere near the biggest whore in the Zoo. IMO, that is some nice legitimate gravy on top of my winnings.

[whiskeytown]

the issue isn't a rake (though you're right) - the issue is losing sessions....whether because I'm thinking too much like a NL player or because I have holes in my game, I do not know...and maybe I haven't played enough hrs lately...

I know there was a time in the Open Internet Challenge where I got to 1200 in 10 days, but that type of success seems to have disappeared right now...I suspect a couple weeks on the TTH program will help iron out some holes -

but the rake don't matter when you can drop $500 in a 6/12 game in a 5 hr. session -

RB

[andyfox]

I missed this post, despite my intention to watch you like a hawk.

I would never play poker on a computer. I'm a techno-peasant and I'd never be satisfied the game wasn't rigged. Not that I haven't been in rigged B&M games in my lifetime.

I'm averaging probably 1.3 bb/hour this year. I've only played about 180 hours, maybe less. One part of me says that I couldn't play as well if I was playing to pay the bills. Another part says I'd probably play better.

I'm rarely in a game where there isn't at least one player who I know plays better than I do. But I'm also rarely in a game where there aren't several players who don't play as well as I do.

If one 40-80 table goes full time at Commerce, under the old collection scheme, they took $1,401,600 out in collections for a year. Somebody's got to be losing.

[andyfox]

Yell louder.

[andyfox]

So take the advice for what it's worth. If someone says, say, fold KQs for one raise from the big blind, consider his reasoning and accept or reject the play according to your own lights.

We're all probably better on the forum than we are in the game. But there are guys who post here who I've played with who are better than they admit to here. Or they play better than they write.

There's one prominent poster here who does claim to fold pretty big hands out of his blinds. He does. And he's been a consistent winner for many years.

I win (in large part due to what I learned from the 2+2 books and fora) and I know there are a bunch of posters on the mid-, high-stakes forum alone who play better than I do.

[ThrillFactor]

What happened to me? Well, to sum up a very long story, I discovered that playing for a living completely took the fun out of the game for me. By the end of February, it took all the willpower I could muster just to make myself sit down at the computer. In March I accepted a job managing a new nightclub at about 85% of my prior pay working about 60% of the hours. I am now back to playing for fun and to suppliment my income. That and the big news... I am enrolled in school for the summer semester - time to finish my MBA!

I stopped the updates very early on b/c there seemed to be no real interest from the forum. Most had already made up their minds that it couldn't be done, it's not like it was all that original of a topic (GO David!!!, btw, great job man - still read everything that you post), and I'm not that great a writer in the first place. So be it, no big deal. What playing for those two months did do for me was give me plenty of free time to sit back, evaluate the big picture, decide what was really important to me in life, and set a course to reach my goals. I (1) found myself steady employment and a reliable source of income, (2) got myself back into grad school, (3) organized my personal finances and outlined a plan to be debt free by the end of the year, (4) and perhaps most importantly, made a committment to my on-again, off-again grlfriend of the last six years - she stood by me 100% through this endeavour and I always had her support in whatever made me happy. "Playing online micro-limits for a living" turned out quite differently than I expected, but I must say that in hind-sight, it's probably the smartest move I've made in quite some time.

Now, on to the other issue. I am sick and tired of sooooo many posters here being sooooo quick to tell everyone what can and can't be done. Much of these BB/hr stats have to come from years of B&M experience, and in that context I'm sure they are accurate. But online is simply different. It's another world, plain and simple. My pokertracker starts for Jan-Feb 2004 at Party/Empire .5/1.00:

Sessions - 1188
Hands - 32686
$ Won - $2891.35
BB/hr - 4.64
BB/100 - 8.85
VP$IP - 21.95%

True win rate: 233.27 hours/12.40 BB per hour

This was usually 3 tables at a time with VP$IP a little high causing some relatively large swings. Also chased a little too much post-flop.

Took March and most of April off from the tables almost completely. Just starting putting in some serious hours again about 2 weeks ago. Those stats:

Party Poker .5/1 usually 4 tables

Sessions - 137
Hands - 4390
$ Won - $336.00
BB/hr - 4.51
BB/100 - 7.67
VP$IP - 19.01

True win rate: 27.67 hrs/12.17 BB per hour

Tightened up a little both pre- and post-flop, plugged a few leaks but have a few more to work on, but also haven't had any really good over-the-top winning sessions. I believe when I hit a couple of those in a row - and I will - that bb/hr figure will come up a little.

Anyway, moral of the story, I'm glad I tried it and if anyone tries to tell you that Party micro multi-tabling is only good for 4-6 BB/hr, then I suggest that they either aren't as good as they think they are, or have not allowed themselves to adjust properly to these games.

-Will

[Matty]

Wait, you were living off of less than $5 an hour?

Are any taxes taken out of that?

[ThrillFactor]

$12.40/hr. And yes, I knew it would be tight going into it. But I also knew that it would be only temporary. Either I would work my way up in levels to increase the $$$ figure, or find some other method of gainful employment.

[MMMMMM]

It's real easy to have a pretty good run and make BB or more or whatever per hour. Pretty decent (not spectacular) runs can last a pretty long time sometimes.

A few posters probably actually are expected to make what they post or claim. But I would guess that most, when they figure in the most horrid runs that have occurred--or will yet occur-- won't make anything like what they pleasantly think they are making right now. Just my 2c after playing 15 years +.

Also, the games are especially good right now. This will probably last a couple years or so, maybe even more. But it won't last forever. Regulars get better and suckers eventually quit (usually) or quit playing so much. Without new blood, games always get tougher. Opponents also pick up on your playing style and give you less money. So I suspect some of the posted amounts are not to be expected to continue. Also, realize that when winning it is fun to post or discuss your winnings. When losing it is less fun and fewer losing players post or discuss their decreased win rates, or loss rates, for this reason. So just take it all in stride, that's my best view on it all, and enjoy it while it lasts.

[Matty]

[ QUOTE ]
$12.40/hr.

[/ QUOTE ]Wait, so how do I figure out my "true win rate"?

PokerTracker says I make $2.10 an hour, but I play three tables at a time - so should I triple that number?

[ThrillFactor]

Poker Tracker, session notes page. In the middle there is a line that says "True Win Rate". The program calculates actual hours plays (whether you were 1, 2, 3, or more tables, and how that all overlapped) to give you a "True" win rate per hour playing.

You can't just multiply be 3 because you are not "always" on 3 tables (waiting on a seat, moving tables, etc.).

[J_V]

[ QUOTE ]
I agree with everything that you say. I also know that you're the best player who posts on this board who isn't named Zee.


[/ QUOTE ]


This statement is probably not true, albeit very subjective.

[Softrock]

Interestingly I have a very different response to this post.

My first thought was do people lie here anymore than they lie to themselves? Ask the players at your local room how they fare overall and most will tell you they are small winners or break even players. We know that's not true for most of them. Are they lying? I think many of them are saying what they have convinced themselves is true (by definition it's not lying if you actually believe it even if it's not really true).

This really is a poker topic - others have said it long before me. One of the biggest hindrances to being a winning poker player is the inability to level with yourself. What I believe we hear on here often is what players think they ought to be doing but many of them know they don't actually do it or do it inconsistently.

But you know what - I don't care. If the post poses a question or situation that can further enlighten me I don't care if it's a complete fabrication.

I personally have never knowingly lied on this forum or elswhere regarding poker. What I have done is talk alot more about my well-played hands and talked less about the poorly played ones (which I submit is probably backwards if one is really interested in bettering oneself).