Anyone feel like explaining this?

[Gamblor]

Nobel (http://www.almaz.com/nobel/) web site

The Global Islamic population is approximately 1,200,000,000, or 20% of the world population.

They received the following Nobel Prizes:

Literature:
1957 - Albert Camus
1988 - Najib Mahfooz

Peace:
1978 - Mohamed Anwar El-Sadat
1994 - Yaser Arafat

Physics/Chemistry:
1990 - Elias James Corey
1999 - Ahmed Zewail

Medicine:
1960 - Peter Brian Medawar
1998 - Ferid Murad

Total: 6

The Global Jewish population is approximately 14,000,000 or about 0.02% of the world population.

They received the following Nobel Prizes:

Literature:
1910 - Paul Heyse
1927 - Henri Bergson
1958 - Boris Pasternak
1966 - Shmuel Yosef Agnon
1966 - Nelly Sachs
1976 - Saul Bellow
1978 - Isaac Bashevis Singer
1981 - Elias Canetti
1987 - Joseph Brodsky
1991 - Nadine Gordimer World

Peace:
1911 - Alfred Fried
1911 - Tobias Michael Carel Asser
1968 - Rene Cassin
1973 - Henry Kissinger
1978 - Menachem Begin
1986 - Elie Wiesel
1994 - Shimon Peres
1994 - Yitzhak Rabin

Economics:
1970 - Paul Anthony Samuelson
1971 - Simon Kuznets
1972 - Kenneth Joseph Arrow
1975 - Leonid Kantorovich
1976 - Milton Friedman
1978 - Herbert A. Simon
1980 - Lawrence Robert Klein
1985 - Franco Modigliani
1987 - Robert M. Solow
1990 - Harry Markowitz
1990 - Merton Miller
1992 - Gary Becker
1993 - Robert Fogel

Medicine:
1908 - Elie Metchnikoff
1908 - Paul Erlich
1914 - Robert Barany
1922 - Otto Meyerhof
1930 - Karl Landsteiner
1931 - Otto Warburg
1936 - Otto Loewi
1944 - Joseph Erlanger
1944 - Herbert Spencer Gasser
1945 - Ernst Boris Chain
1946 - Hermann Joseph Muller
1950 - Tadeus Reichstein
1952 - Selman Abraham Waksman
1953 - Hans Krebs
1953 - Fritz Albert Lipmann
1958 - Joshua Lederberg
1959 - Arthur Kornberg
1964 - Konrad Bloch
1965 - Francois Jacob
1965 - Andre Lwoff
1967 - George Wald
1968 - Marshall W. Nirenberg
1969 - Salvador Luria
1970 - Julius Axelrod
1970 - Sir Bernard Katz
1972 - Gerald Maurice Edelman
1975 - Howard Martin Temin
1976 - Baruch S. Blumberg
1977 - Roselyn Sussman Yalow
1978 - Daniel Nathans
1980 - Baruj Benacerraf
1984 - Cesar Milstein
1985 - Michael Stuart Brown
1985 - Joseph L. Goldstein
1986 - Stanley Cohen [& Rita Levi-Montalcini]
1988 - Gertrude Elion
1989 - Harold Varmus
1991 - Erwin Neher
1991 - Bert Sakmann
1993 - Richard J. Roberts
1993 - Phillip Sharp
1994 - Alfred Gilman
1995 - Edward B. Lewis

Physics/Chemistry:
1907 - Albert Abraham Michelson
1908 - Gabriel Lippmann
1921 - Albert Einstein
1922 - Niels Bohr
1925 - Gustav Hertz
1925 - James Franck
1943 - Gustav Stern
1944 - Isidor Issac Rabi
1952 - Felix Bloch
1954 - Max Born
1958 - Igor Tamm
1959 - Emilio Segre
1960 - Donald A. Glaser
1961 - Robert Hofstadter
1962 - Lev Davidovich Landau
1965 - Julian Schwinger
1965 - Richard Phillips Feynman
1969 - Murray Gell-Mann
1971 - Dennis Gabor
1973 - Brian David Josephson
1975 - Benjamin Mottleson
1976 - Burton Richter
1978 - Arno Allan Penzias
1978 - Peter L Kapitza
1979 - Sheldon Glashow
1979 - Stephen Weinberg
1988 - Jack Steinberger
1988 - Leon Lederman
1988 - Melvin Schwartz
1990 - Jerome Friedman
1995 - Martin Perl
1905 - Adolph Von Baeyer
1906 - Henri Moissan
1910 - Otto Wallach
1915 - Richard Willstaetter
1918 - Fritz Haber
1943 - George Charles de Hevesy
1961 - Melvin Calvin
1962 - Max Ferdinand Perutz
1972 - William Howard Stein
1977 - Ilya Prigogine
1979 - Herbert Charles Brown
1980 - Paul Berg
1980 - Walter Gilbert
1981 - Roald Hoffmann
1982 - Aaron Klug
1985 - Albert A. Hauptman
1985 - Jerome Karle
1986 - Dudley R. Herschbach
1988 - Robert Huber
1989 - Sidney Altman
1990 - Elias James Corey
1992 - Rudolph Marcus
1999 - Ahmed Zewail
2000 - Alan J. Heeger

Total: 130

I think it's cause the Jews are all so rich and control the government.

[SossMan]

There are only 14 million Jews in the world?

[MMMMMM]

14 million sounds about right to me.

More evidence that some cultural ways are superior to others, IMO.

[Rushmore]

You'd never know it, watching the television machine, huh?

[Boris]

what is the point of your post. There is obviously much hatred between conservative jews such as yourself and arabs. Why do you continue to promote the ill will? Some might argue that the reason so many jews have won nobel prizes is because the US saved their collective ass and provided them with a very nice place to live, namely the US.

[Chris Alger]

Can anything be explained to someone who thinks Camus was Muslim?

Doubtful.

[daryn]

this might be the best point chris alger has ever made

[andyfox]

How can you take anything seriously which gives awards to the likes of Milton Friedman, Yassir Arafat, and Henry Kissinger?

We already know how superior you feel, as a Jew, to those backward Muslims. The fact that you keep track of which prize winners are Jewish is quite sad.

[Rushmore]

Reading your posts, I have often believed, perhaps erroneously (as it turns out), that your intentions were constructive, if not obviously biased.

I now can do nothing but assume that the word biased should read bigoted, and that your arrogance and supremacist attitude has crawled out from behind the shroud of credibility you have--to now--managed to pull around you.

I cannot imagine where all of these ugly stereotypes come from. It's such a mystery.

[adios]

Not sure but you could probably compare Jewish recipients to many ethnic or religious groups and the results would be similar methinks. For instance what's the breakdown of Chineese recipients, Japaneese recipients, Indian recipients, Catholic recipients, etc.

[MMMMMM]

%

[Cyrus]

Well, isn't this what you're driving at, isn't this what you wanna hear?

So, there you are then : Yours is the master race. Hail, Omniscient Master, the inferior races salute you and ask for clemency.

/images/graemlins/cool.gif

..By the way, I didn't know Albert Camus was a Muslim and I bet he didn't know that either. As to the divine Ilya Prigogine, I didn't think he was Jewish but it doesn't matter either way (except to you, of course).

[Gamblor]

Oh relax, you stupid goy.

/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Ultimately, we're all here together. I obviously wouldn't have continued to support my cause if I didn't think it was the best alternative to the many available - as I'm sure you have chosen for your faith. And that's okay with me, as it should be to anyone else.

But other people have whatever right they need to make decisions on how to live their own lives. If I were to demand you all submit to my cause, or be ostracized and viewed as less-than-human, or die because of your beliefs, you might have a point. But yes, I view myself and my beliefs as ipso facto superior to others' (because they are mine). As everyone should about their beliefs. Thankfully, it is also my belief that my beliefs should not infringe on others - my freedom ends where others' begin.

I came across this, and was curious as to everyone's - especially non-Jews - opinions on how such a disproportionate scorecard could be explained? Crusades? Money? Seriously.

If I am not for me, then who will be?

[Gamblor]

So, there you are then : Yours is the master race. Hail, Omniscient Master, the inferior races salute you and ask for clemency.

Granted.

By the way, I didn't know Albert Camus was a Muslim and I bet he didn't know that either.

He did. Born in Tunisia, but he eventually became virulently anti-Muslim, forming political parties that strived to halt its spread.

But at birth, aMuslim (http://www.bookrags.com/notes/str/BIO.htm).

[daryn]

it's money.

let me guess, ethiopia has never produced a nobel prize winner, right?

maybe they have who knows.. but what i'm saying is it's all about money. blacks score lower on test than whites? does that mean they are less intelligent?

does that question even need to be asked, or answered?

[daryn]

hard to believe camus was ever religious at all. i mean, say i convert to judaism tomorrow, does that make me a jew?

[Gamblor]

Most of those names aren't Americans, as well as many before 1945.

[Gamblor]

If you do it under supervision of an Orthodox rabbi (non-Orthodox conversions aren't recognized yet by the State), then you're Jewish. Why wouldn't you be?

[ThaSaltCracka]

maybe it shows an intense bias by the nobel society to give awards to Jews, and to not notice muslims.
Maybe it shows, Jews for the most part have had better societies to live in compared to muslims.

Or maybe it proves that Jews are the smartest people in the world, completely infallable, and the true pioneers of the world. God bless the Jews, for without them we would be a bunch of ignorant gentiles.

Gamblor, you should be a politician because you skew everything you read to fit your agenda.

[Rushmore]

Thank you for disarming me with the smiley-face and the semantic ontology about subjective belief systems.

I feel honored to have had my opinion marginalized by such a skilled rhetorician.

But I suppose this skill has evolved through necessity.

Oh, sorry:
/images/graemlins/grin.gif /images/graemlins/grin.gif /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Gamblor]

This is a comparison between two groups, not between all groups.

And outside the usual sarcasm, can someone answer the god damn question seriously?

[Rushmore]

So then in this context, we're talking religion, not race?

What about the next context? Or the next?

[Gamblor]

I take this to mean you didn't respect my answer as my opinion, but rather as a secret method of deflecting away from the fact that I am a racist, Jew-supremacist?

It's my opinion, asshole.

As least I took the time to marginalize your solid read. I got the Aces, Rushmore. I got em. Fold your hand. Haha, only 64o. Got ya again.

I suppose your belief system tells you that Gamblor's opinion don't matter none cause he a racist. A low-down, dirty, white-hood wearin', lynchin', cross-burning, damn' [censored]in' snake-tongued, not soliciting-opinion-of-an-email-that-happened-into-my-inbox, not serious-question-askin', Israeli racist apartheid hate-monger.

I reiterate: Outside of all that, I wouldn't follow the practices of a culture if I didn't think it was the best way to live my life. Nor should you. The difference is, that I don't judge - I ask, seeking to understand. You judge.

Hold on, here it comes... /images/graemlins/grin.gif

There ya go.

[Zeno]

Islam refers to a particular religions faith. Is 'Jew' as narrowly constrained as Islam in definition, in others words is Jew a strict 'religious definition’? I do not think so. Many of the 'Jews' on your list are certainly not 'Jewish' by a religious definition of the word. So you are comparing something with a strict definition to something with a much more ambiguous definition, IMO.

Your exercise in tallying winners of one particular award, that is itself bias, only adds to the overall silliness of your post. How many of the ‘Jewish’ winners were Americans, and how silly is it to start other lists all broke down by some national, religious, skin color, or other arbitrary factors conjured up for the boasting and chest pounding of a particular ‘Group’ or ‘Groups’.

By the way, Albert Camus, born in Algiers I believe, was probably an atheist or agnostic. His book, The Plague, is a very good read. Albert was also a good friend of Sartre, a Frenchman, I think, if I haven’t got my all so important national standings mixed up. Sartre turned down the Nobel Prize for literature. Some people have principles.

-Zeno

[Rushmore]

You fly the Israeli flag, every one of your posts is Israel-related, and you post an obstensibly-innocent question as to why Jews are recognized worldwide as superior to Muslims in every discipline and science in the world.

And you expect ANYONE, much less expert poker players (skilled in the art of reading peoples' motives), to believe that you are objective and just plain-old inquisitive.

I'm done with this thread. Don't bother trying to bait me back in.

[Gamblor]

There's no such thing as the Jewish race, just like there ain't a Christian race or a Hindu race. Or a Muslim race.

There is a Jewish nation.

Shared language (Hebrew).

Shared history for those born, shared knowledge and learning for those converted.

Shared ideals, ethics, and culture.

Shared religion.

Shared love of learning Torah, at degrees ranging from mere recognition of its importance, to total devotion.

That's all. Outside that, nothing different.

[Gamblor]

You fly the Israeli flag

Yes I do.

every one of your posts is Israel-related

Every one of my politics posts is, as I don't know much about politics outside of Israel and Canada.

I'm known in the Zoo and Mid-High Stakes forums as well. I hope I'm regarded favourably, but I can't say for sure. None of those posts are Israel-related.

and you post an obstensibly-innocent question as to why Jews are recognized worldwide as superior to Muslims in every discipline and science in the world.

I don't recall using the word superior. I asked why the numbers are disproportionate, following a post-class argument with a friend about this e-mail.

Irony of ironies, he was born in Lebanon.

I never claimed to be objective, but I don't see what this e-mail says other than a disproportionate number of Nobel prizes have been won by Jews (nearly all secular), relative to Muslims.

Whatever. Good luck.

[andyfox]

The Jewish nation is a figment. Most Jews do not speak Hebrew. Jews in the Diaspora have different histories, ideals, ethics and culture, all of them different from Jews in Israel. Only religious Jews know about Torah. And, of course, until 1948, they did not have a particular national territory.

What Jews do share is a religion.

[Gamblor]

People inevitably apply their own biases and motivations to others' actions when evaluating them.

As Stephen Covey pointed out in The 7 Habits of Highly Effective People, the lens through which we see actions is defined by our previous experiences, and as such our interpretations of others' words and actions is invariably affected by our own histories, and objectivity is only achieved when we realize this. Successful people learn how to clean the lens, so to speak.

Responses to my post have ranged from MMMMMM, who successfully understood it was a question of conflicting cultures, yet didn't answer the original question, to Rushmore and Cyrus, who sarcastically deconstructed my motives, picking me apart as a transparent, simple-minded zealot, proudly putting their insecurity on display for all (if anyone didn't notice, that was hyrocritical humour).

Daryn managed to take a stab at it, albeit sarcastically, but at least he did.

Is anyone gonna answer the god damn question?

[Gamblor]

book, The Plague, is a very good read.

If you can read French, read l'Etranger - (the Stranger? I'm sure it's been translated)

If you thought I hated Arabs (a misread on your part), wait til you read that one - 'specially the main character.

I'd absolutely love to see a Nobel list broken down proportionately by nationality, religion, skin colour, hair colour, head size... I'd find it fascinating.

Sartre turned down the Nobel Prize for literature. Some people have principles.

Am I to assume you believe one has to be unprincipled to accept a Nobel Prize? What do you really mean here?

[andyfox]

I will, if you answer why so many Jews, and so few Muslims, were involved as founders of Communism in Russia and as important member of the American Mafia?

[Gamblor]

What Jews do share is a religion.

Any Jew who shares this religion by definition shares its language, fundamental (if not detailed) ethics, and if there is a single Jew who doesn't recognize the word Torah, then in my mind, he's not a Jew.

It's what the whole thing is based on.

They absolutely had national territory until they were exiled in 576 AD. There aren't many Jewish prayers that don't speak of a return to Zion

[superleeds]

It's because Jews live in predominately wealthy states where they have access to far better education and research facilities. Something the Arab world place less highly than religion, at least in the sciences. As far as Peace and Literature are concerned it is because the Nobel Panel is predominately biased towards the west, thats where most of them live.

[andyfox]

I know tons of Jews who don't speak or understand Hebrew. I have very different ethics from, say, Denis Prager. I recognize the word "Torah," but neither I nor any of the thousands of Jews I know and do business with or socialize with have never once used the word outside of synagogue in my memory.

If you're saying the "whole thing" is based on a shared religion, I am agreeing. My son can go to Israel and become a citizen not because of his recognition of the word Torah or because of his knowledge or lack thereof of history or because of what language he speaks or anthing else other than the fact that his mother's birth certificate says she's Jewish. It lists it under "religion."

[Gamblor]

I will, if you answer why so many Jews, and so few Muslims, were involved as founders of Communism in Russia

My opinion (limited greatly by my understanding):

Jews were heavily involved among the Old Bolsheviks, until Stalin killed them off. Lenin didn't exactly embrace them, but didn't refuse their help either, from what I understand. I'm inclined to believe that their persecuted-minority, economically-underdeveloped status led them to join whatever majority movement made them part of the larger society (Galut mentality) and whatever movement would even out the economic hardships they faced.

and as important member of the American Mafia?

The only one I know of is Bugsy Seigel. And the persecuted often have to find other means of success if the traditional roads are not open to them.

Any Jew who murders for personal gain ain't a good Jew.

"Thou shalt not kill."

I'm hardly religious, but I know the rules.

Self-defence is something else entirely.

[Rushmore]

In another post, you condemn me for "judging" you.

Then, with the requisite "hyrocritical humour" reference, you judge me (and Cyrus [and, I would assume, Andy]), sarcastically indicating your disdain for our sarcasm/criticism, and then justifying it with some nonsensical disclaimer.

I'll give you credit--you've got serious balls.

[Gamblor]

Someone who took the question seriously.

It's because Jews live in predominately wealthy states where they have access to far better education and research facilities. Something the Arab world place less highly than religion, at least in the sciences.

Agreed - I think the Sciences are anathema to the Muslim (not Arab) world view.

Nobel biased towards the west?

Why? I don't think this is the case - Scandinavia is very anti-west, from what I understand, but I could be wrong.

[Gamblor]

Then, with the requisite "hyrocritical humour" reference, you judge me (and Cyrus [and, I would assume, Andy]), sarcastically indicating your disdain for our sarcasm/criticism, and then justifying it with some nonsensical disclaimer.

Wow you've got me read like a book.

I can't believe i have to spell this out for you.

I don't know if you're insecure or not. I don't know if you're overweight or not. I don't know if you smell funny, have blond hair, or hate prunes.

That's the point.

What are you trying to accomplish with this line of attack? Are you trying to simply show me how terrible a human I am (I don't see the reasoning)?

What's the point of these rants? What is the nature of the response are you expecting? An admission of guilt? A rebuttal? A justification for a post? Tell me, I aim to please.

Ya got me. I don't even know how to respond to these anymore.

[superleeds]

[ QUOTE ]
Why? I don't think this is the case - Scandinavia is very anti-west, from what I understand, but I could be wrong.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are.

[Gamblor]

You are.

Wow.

Thanks.

[elwoodblues]

I'll answer the question: No. No, I don't feel like explaining this.

[andyfox]

My point was that your initial post implied an inferiority for Muslims, as opposed to Jews, because they were under-represented in an award process that considered Arabs and Asians beyond the pale for a long time. It would be the same thing as me implying that Jews are inferior because they were so well-represented in two criminal activities.

BTW, Bugsy Siegel was a minor player compared to Meier Lansky (who was refused residence in Israel, the only Jew, to my knowledge, so treated) and Arnold Rothstein (who fixed the 1919 World Series).

[Kurn, son of Mogh]

Historically, most muslims have lived in parts of the world untouched by general literacy. Most jews have lived in the most literate parts of the world.

Some cultures embrace learning, some dissuade it. These tendencies may be a result of the availability of the means to learn.

[Kurn, son of Mogh]

I think the Sciences are anathema to the Muslim (not Arab) world view.

Science is anathema to all fundamentalist religious views.

[Kurn, son of Mogh]

I'd say because by allying themselves with the Bolsheviks, the Russian (and many other European) Jews felt they were standing for something that might be a solution for past injustices. They were wrong, but the motivation seems reasonable. Communism must sound very promising to those who've been downtrodden.

important member of the American Mafia?

I think here we're dealing with a geographic alliance. In the big cities, many jewish enclaves were in close proximity to the Sicilian (Mafia) and Napolitan Italian (Camorra) enclaves.

Again, an alliance of sorts that helped provide some security for two underclass elements of American society. Not an uncommon occurance in human history.

[Gamblor]

Science is anathema to all fundamentalist religious views.

What if a religion allows for the possibility that an all-powerful, omnipresent God to have produced a universe in a manner that allows for physical and chemical laws, as well as for randomness?

In the words of Albert Einstein, "God does not play dice."

[Gamblor]

My point was that your initial post implied an inferiority for Muslims, as opposed to Jews, because they were under-represented in an award process that considered Arabs and Asians beyond the pale for a long time.

Having seen the reactions (most notably Rushmore's and everyone's favourite misanthrope, Cyrus) of this forum I hadn't anticipated that angle.

This email came across my screen and I immediately (and obviously) felt some degree of pride. I mentioned it in passing to a friend of mine, an Lebanese Arab (although Christian), because most of our conversations centre around the Middle East and reminiscing of times at home.

His opinion was that the educational backwardness of the Arab world was the culprit, as most education there is designed to further the incumbent regime's political goals rather than actually provide knowledge and skills beyond what it takes to support the regime.

Oh well. Another opportunity to get flamed.

Az mah la'asot?

(so what to do?)

[HDPM]

The czars didn't exactly build up good will with Russian Jews, ya know. Only positive thing you can say about the commies is they knew exactly how to treat czars.

[HDPM]

What about the saga of Abe Kid Twist Reles and his cohorts? Dutch Schultz? Although I agree Lansky and Rothstein were top of the heap.

Read the book "Tough Jews" if you get a chance. The author's name escapes me right now.

[Cyrus]

"Responses to my post have ranged from MMMMMM, who successfully understood it was a question of conflicting cultures"

Yeah, right, ask me another one. As if MMMMMM could see the difference between a Jewish joke and a Jewish supremacist thug. Conflicting cultures, oh my aching sides! /images/graemlins/cool.gif

"Rushmore and Cyrus sarcastically deconstructed my motives"

You are being (unwittingly) precise. Yes, that's right, that was a deconstruction. Just step back and take a look at the thread you have created. A disaster area.

"...picking me apart as a transparent, simple-minded zealot"

I usually find sociopaths to be staggering under their guilt and secretaly craving a cathartic confession. So cry me ariver.

"..proudly putting their insecurity on display.."

What a sight, what a pathetic sight. Listen, God knows there's lots of stuff I'm insecure about, but facing down a tight-ass fascist and admirer of terrorists like you comes to me as naturally as farting before crapping. (Which you should try sometime.)

[HDPM]

Sure, but read Feynman's comments on what orthodox rabbinical students would ask him about physics.

[Cyrus]

"If you can read French, read l'Etranger. I'd absolutely love to see a Nobel list broken down proportionately by hair colour, head size... Fascinating. Do you believe one has to be unprincipled to accept a Nobel Prize?"

Let me stop you right there and explain to the audience what we have. What we have here, folks, is a Blooper Thread. Our resident supremacist Gamblor, bless 'im, tried to make a racist joke but turns out he's made a booboo and is now trying to turn the thread into garden party chit chat. His post was only about Nobels, French literature and hair colour, see.

No go, Galmbor, someone's spiked yer punch.

[MMMMMM]

That may well be the case.

Today, people are able to compare traits in both individuals and cultures, and form conclusions as to which traits are beneficial and which are not. The purpose should be to move towards improvement (rather than to bash others or play games of one-upmanship).

An objective appraisal is the first step towards personal or cultural improvement. Of course, those who refuse to engage in such critical comparisons and self-examination are the least likely to benefit from such comparisons.

The Arab culture should be asking themselves why they have contributed almost nothing to the world in recent years (other than oil, and the export of fanaticism and terrorism). Why has their culture largely stagnated for centuries? Fortunately some in the Arab world are indeed asking this--while others merely respond with blind rage and a hardening of their already failing beliefs and approaches.

I submit that if the world practiced rationalism, terrorism would scarcely exist. Too bad there are so many largely irrational humans roaming the planet today (in all countries and cultures, but especially in the Middle East). I fear it is a severe defect of the human species which just might eventually spell ruin, as the technologies to destruction keep advancing. IMO there is little more important to the survival of the species over the next hundred years or so, than a greater embracing of rationalism, and there may be nothing more dangerous to the ultimate survival of the species than the spread or even continued existence of fanatical irrationalism. Just envision what could have happened if Yassin or bin-Laden, for instance, had had it in their power to destroy themselves, Israel, the Palestinians and Washington D.C. all in one fell swoop. Technologies of greater destructive power than we currently possess are someday surely coming; if irrational fanaticism has not largely vanished from the Earth, at some point the world may be at the mercy of some true wackos who would just as soon send everyone on Earth to Paradise if they don't get their way.

[banditbdl]

Its easy, Muslims have typically lived in areas with much smaller/nonexistent university systems while Jews living in Europe and the United States have had ready access to the finest in the world (money of course is always helpful in this area as well). A Ph. D is essentially a prerequisite to winning a Nobel in any category other than Peace.

BTW 1981 Nobel Prize winner in Chemistry Roald Hoffman is the man. His chemistry videos just kill me.

[MMMMMM]

I read that Einstein may have changed his opinion about that "dice" remark in later years. He also stated that his attempt to prove (what was it exactly?) was the greatest mistake of his career, as it led him in the wrong direction and away from the theories he was working on.

[Cyrus]

Perhaps it's this bit of news, Gamblor, that's made your a little cranky?

Mordechai Vanunu who was in jail for 18 years (11 of which in solitary confinement!) was released from an Israeli prison yesterday. His crime? Vanunu, a Moroccan Jew, who subsequently turned to Christianity, worked for a time at Israel's Dimona nuclear reactor and was able to tell the world of Israel's secret nuclear program. Experts had concluded that Israel possessed at the time the world's sixth-largest nuclear arsenal with around 100 atomic weapons. Vanunu had been illegally abducted from the United Kingdom by Israeli agents in 1986 and taken to Israel.

CNN Report (http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/04/21/israel.vanunu/index.html)

[Gamblor]

Boged.

His choice to commit a crime and put national security at risk, his punishment to accept.

What else could you have done, in the government's shoes?

[Gamblor]

Let me stop you right there and explain to the audience what we have. What we have here, folks, is a Blooper Thread. Our resident supremacist Gamblor, bless 'im, tried to make a racist joke but turns out he's made a booboo and is now trying to turn the thread into garden party chit chat. His post was only about Nobels, French literature and hair colour, see.

You got me.

(Phew, glad to get that Jew off my back)

[MMMMMM]

Cyrus, you are funny. Funnier now especially that I've had a couple of glasses of Frey's Natural Red organic wine (you really must try it, no sulfites either;-)). Now: what was it that you said you would get around to telling me when I am sober?

I firmly believe that the positive aspects of every culture should be adopted by all, and the negative aspects should be dumped by the wayside (by all;-)). Zeno will know what to do with the dumpings, if nobody else does.

I hereby proclaim that I am finished, once and for all, with all political threads on this forum. I don't think I can say anything I haven't already said, in one form or another, anyway. It's been informative and good exercise. Thanks to everyone who has helped me clarify some of my own thoughts, and exposed me to others.

So here's to good wine, good swimming, good poetry, good hiking and good poker. Well, Cyrus... have at it! ;-)

[Cyrus]

"Muslims have typically lived in areas with much smaller/nonexistent university systems while Jews living in Europe and the United States have had ready access to the finest in the world."

Thanks for the succinct reply.

And now that you have posted something that should be quite obvious to anyone with half a brain and who's able to read the newspaper beyond the funny pages (and thanks again for posting it), what have we understood from this thread ? That Gamblor did not know the answer ?

Or that Gamblor insinuated some other answer ? But I already gave him that answser, as a gift, from me to him : The Jews get the Nobels because the Jews are superior as a race. Alright?

...Hey, Gamblor ? Let's do Black Nobel laureates next, that should have them rolling in the aisles. You first. /images/graemlins/cool.gif

[John Cole]

totaled 6?

[John Cole]

I had a student a couple years ago who told me he was planning to have dinner with his uncle that night, but that his uncle usually liked to keep things quiet when he visted and they went out to eat. Curious, of course, I asked why.

"Well, my uncle is Wole Soyinka, and somebody always wants to talk to him."

[Cyrus]

You just insinuated that I would call Jews to be the descendants of monkeys. What a misguided attempt at defamation.

You see, I'm an equal-opportunity materialist. In other words, and to put it crudely, I believe that all humans are descendants of monkeys. (Jews of course are descendants of superior monkeys. Hence, the Nobels.)

/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[Gamblor]

Muslims have typically lived in areas with much smaller/nonexistent university systems while Jews living in Europe and the United States have had ready access to the finest in the world."

So I finally got the answer I was looking for from the get go. Now, why don't Muslims get this access?

The Jews get the Nobels because the Jews are superior as a race.

Hey, why do Jews have such big noses? Air is free!

Let's do Black Nobel laureates next, that should have them rolling in the aisles. You first.

No no, I insist.

[ThaSaltCracka]

[ QUOTE ]
So I finally got the answer I was looking for from the get go.

[/ QUOTE ]
The answer was so obvious from the begining, it makes us wonder why you asked it in the first place. Hence all the insinuation and "defamation".
You were clearly asking a loaded question, or at the very least, one with some sort of sublime undertone to it.

[Gamblor]

That the answer is so obvious, begs the question WHY is it so obvious?

We can simply claim racial superiority, or we can examine the underlying causes in the reality of the Muslim world, which in my opinion has more to do with a theocratic system designed to perpetuate the hold of dictatorial regimes on the society.

Upon understanding those realities, we understand the root causes of situations like the quagmire in Iraq and the conflict in Israel, and how those root causes can not be found in Israel's reactionary policy, or the United States' weak attempt at statecraft.

[John Cole]

See, Gamblor, by not framing the question you would like to ask--or at least by not stating that you really do seek some sort of valid explanation--you invite the sort of replies you receive.

Do not discount Superleeds explanation of the inherent conservatism of the Nobel committee. No Nobel in Literature for Joyce, Pound, or Stevens. Yet a minor writer like Pearl Buck wins one. Ludicrous.

[MMMMMM]

[ QUOTE ]
You were clearly asking a loaded question, or at the very least, one with some sort of sublime undertone to it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, that's exactly what Gamblor is noted for on these forum...his sublime undertones.

(oh dear, almost too much wine, but the East Coast looks more pacific this way)

[Zeno]

I cannot read or understand anything in French. I read The Stranger in High School and we discussed the short story in class. That was long ago.

I have no reason to suspect that you hate Arabs. But your initial post only referred to Islam, a religion, in reference to the Noble Prize.

[ QUOTE ]
I'd absolutely love to see a Nobel list broken down proportionately by nationality, religion, skin colour, hair colour, head size... I'd find it fascinating.


[/ QUOTE ]

Well, yes, I agree. But the exercise would still be, in the main, rather silly. It would be difficult to draw any firm conclusions from such an inherently bias sample group. It would, of course, stir up the animals as Mencken would say so you can derive the satisfaction of poking sensitive people in the eye.

[ QUOTE ]
Am I to assume you believe one has to be unprincipled to accept a Nobel Prize? What do you really mean here?

[/ QUOTE ]

The giving of a Prize is nortiously political, never free of bias, and very self-serving of the group handing them out. Many very principled people have accepted a Nobel Prize or other various prizes tossed out by various groups and organizations. Many others may not have been principled at all. So the comment stands out as perhaps being silly. As silly as your initial post perhaps? Not that I don’t like silliness. I engage in it myself sometimes.

-Zeno

[jcx]

[ QUOTE ]
This is a comparison between two groups, not between all groups.

And outside the usual sarcasm, can someone answer the god damn question seriously?

[/ QUOTE ]

First let me say I am not a Jew. And second, no one here has grasped the point. The reason for the failures of the Muslim world is Islam itself. It is a cult of hatred that has brought its submissives nothing but suffering. Name one thing that a Muslim has invented or contributed to the overall betterment of man in the last 500 years (Oil does not count).

Have any of you given a thought as to WHY the Muslim nations are so poor? Couldn't have anything to do with their ridiculous religion, could it? They are always pounding their chests, screaming "God is Great!". I fail to see where Allah has rained blessings on Joe Muslim.

The ridiculous drivel about Jews succeeding because they mostly live in rich nations is a load of bull. Jews have been hated and made scapegoats (Because of their success) for the ills of society long before the Western world industrialized. Read the Merchant of Venice. Shylock the Jew and his usances were put to paper by Shakespeare back when Londoners dumped their [censored] buckets into the streets. And did you forget about a little something called the Holocaust? Billions of dollars of pre-WWII Jewish wealth was stolen during the war and laundered through countries like Switzerland. Many of those who did survive ended up in impoverished Israel completely penniless and many rebuilt their fortunes.

I'm sure I will be dismissed as a racist bigot, but it's your loss if you choose to remain blind. For anyone with an open mind and the willingness to do so, you need to read the novel Prophet of Doom by Craig Winn. The author did over 10,000 hours of research and paints a rather ugly picture of the "Religion of Peace." The book is available free online at www.prophetofdoom.net (http://www.prophetofdoom.net)

[daryn]

i just don't understand why there has to be an answer. while we're at it let's get all the other religions in there too...

which religion has the most nobel prize winners! that religion is clearly the smartest!

i'm just not sure what the point of the post is.

and being jewish cannot be a race? then who are the people with the big noses, etc.?


oh man, the plague.. my favorite book.

[daryn]

i don't know if someone mentioned it already, but einstein's "greatest blunder" as he called it was his idea of the "cosmological constant".

thing is though recently the talk in the physics world has been leaning towards "einstein was right".

[daryn]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In risposta di:</font><hr />
We can simply claim racial superiority...

[/ QUOTE ]

trust me that ain't it /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Gamblor]

i'm just not sure what the point of the post is.

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showthreaded.php?Cat=&amp;Number=646894&amp;page=0&amp;view=co llapsed&amp;sb=5&amp;o=14&amp;vc=1