Lakers/Rockets Thread!

[Aceshigh7]

Tonight begins the start of the 2004 playoffs. The mantle of supreme NBA center will be passed from Shaq to Yao and the Rockets will upset the Lakers in the 1st round. This is gonna be fun. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Dynasty]

I can never forgive the Rockets for beating the Lakers in the 1986 Western Conference Finals.

My Celtis with Bird, McHale, Parish, Ainge, Johnson, and Walton were going to rout the Lakers like never before. Instead, we had to slap around the hapless Rockets in the NBA Championship.

[DonWaade]

Just as long as someone beats the Lakers /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[andyfox]

Someone will surely beat the Lakers, but it won't be the Rockets. I like Van Gundy a lot, and Yao is all class, but the Rockets are simply undermanned.

The Lakers in five.

[banditbdl]

Its playoff time and Shaq angry about all the Yao talk, he is gonna eat Yao for dinner.

[Zeno]

The Rockets will get smashed. The Blazers (the down the stretch team anyway) could give the Lakers more trouble than the Rockets. The Lakers are lucky - they are playing one of the worse teams in the west that made the playoffs, as judge by second half playing skill and/or record.

A more interesting question is if Indiana can beat the West Champ.

-Zeno

[Michael Davis]

Indiana's lineup has some major holes with Foster and Tinsley starting. Miller is past his prime and barely warrants a starting role. Their supposedly deep bench is a joke. (I know some people like Tinsley, but Foster is obviously garbage.) They have a great coach and an unbelievably underrated player in O'Neal.

I don't think this team can beat anyone out of the West, and I think they will lose to Detroit if the Pistons make it that far.

-Michael

[banditbdl]

Whoa Whoa Whoa. Indiana's got to get by Detroit first. If they do get by Detroit I would give them little to no chance against San Antonio, Minnesota, or LA.

[Aceshigh7]

The Rockets outplayed LA and deserved to win that game.

LA got so lucky that Kobe bricked that 3 so badly that it went straight to Shaq.

Rockets played better than the Fakers but got unlucky.

I still say the Rockets will win the series.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
The Rockets will get smashed.

[/ QUOTE ]

Next time, either....

Maurice Taylor's shot won't rim out.

or

Kobe will brick it instead of airballing it right into Shaq's hands.

or

Jimmy Jackson's shot will fall.


Unfortunately, the Lakers caught the breaks at the end. If the Rockets can play like that again, take care of the ball a little better than they usually do, and catch a couple of breaks, they have a real chance.

Go Rockets.

[banditbdl]

While I would agree the Rockets outplayed LA last night, they couldn't close the deal and the fact is LA played like absolute dogshit and still won. The Rockets got the worst performance out of the Lakers they could hope for and still didn't win. No way in hell you can win a playoff series with Stevie "Let's count the Turnovers" Francis running your team. Okay, maybe a 1st round series in the East, but that doesn't count.

[andyfox]

Karl Malone was 3 for 14 and Kobe was 4 for 19. Shaq missed ten free throws. The Lakers scored nine points in the 3rd quarter. And they won.

How can the Rockets hope to win a game if they didn't win this one?

[Zeno]

[ QUOTE ]
Unfortunately, the Lakers caught the breaks at the end.

[/ QUOTE ]

As a Blazer fan I know this only too well. But I agree with Banditbdl below that the Lakers played very badly. If the Rockets were legitimate contenders they should have won by 20 pts. The Lakers are dysfunctional and playing poorly but it will not catch up with them until the second round, IMO.

I would love to see the Rockets win. It just isn’t going to happen. They could not even capitalize on a golden opportunity to take one in LA.

-Zeno

[Aceshigh7]

All you people talking about how badly the Lakers played. Maybe they played badly because of the Rocket's defense?

It's easy to say the Lakers had an off night but maybe Houston's defensive pressure had something to do with it.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
No way in hell you can win a playoff series with Stevie "Let's count the Turnovers" Francis running your team.

[/ QUOTE ]

That Stevie can f'in jump, though.

Yeah, the turnovers suck, hard. An amusing moment for me was the spin move where Stevie lost the ball, grabbed it back from right in front of George, then got fouled (but not called) by Shaq and tossed it in over his shoulder. They replayed it about 10 times. It was the Sprite Great Skillz play or whatever. Yeah, great play, but 9 times out of 10, he turns that ball over and Lakers get a fast break bucket.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
How can the Rockets hope to win a game if they didn't win this one?

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the better question is how can the Rockets hope to win the series if they can't win that one? That's true. How do they win a game? Play good defense and execute well another day when the Lakers aren't executing well and catch a couple of breaks.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
If the Rockets were legitimate contenders they should have won by 20 pts.

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't get me wrong, I agree. I just think the Rockets playing at their best can give the Lakers a fight, that's all.

Look, I just watched the Rockets lose to the Warriors twice in the last few weeks. I know how great they aren't. At least I got to see William Hung perform live, though.

[banditbdl]

I'm gonna preface this by pointing out that the Rockets are indeed one of the top 3 or 4 defensive teams along with the Spurs, Pistons, and (gasp!) Timberwolves in the league right now.

On to the rant... When it comes to bad sports commentary by announcers and halftime crews I don't think there is anything that pisses me off more than watching a basketball team brick wide open shots and make unforced turnovers for an entire half, shooting something like 35% and scoring 38 pts then hearing the announcers go on and on about how good of defense the opposition played. Sometimes the shots just aren't falling. Kind of like those nights were you are getting flushstraighted at the poker tables. The NBA announcers seem oblivious to this and believe poor shooting entirely reflects good defense. This can be true, but you can't explain a 9 pt. quarter on defense alone.

As concerns the Rockets-Lakers series LA scored only 72 points last night and won the game. Kobe might even shoot 4-18 or whatever it was last night once or twice more in this series, but he ain't gonna shoot like that 5 or 6 games in a row. The Rockets play good D and all but there is just no way they're gonna consistently hold the Lakers in the low 70s. Last night they did, and it still wasn't enough.

[banditbdl]

Yeah, Steve is an incredible, incredible physical talent. If he had half a brain he'd probably be the best point guard in the league.

[Ulysses]

OK, at the end of the game, Stevie fouls Shaq. Van Gundy looks confused and the announcers comment on it.

I can just imagine the conversation:

"Stevie, WTF was that?"

"Yo, man, Shaq can't shoot free throws."

"Look guys, we're not fouling yet. Play defense."

"Yo, don't sweat it coach. We're just gonna foul Shaq. We got it under control."

"NO! NOT YET!!"

"Don't worry, coach. I got a plan."

[andyfox]

So with the score 91-76 Lakers, Doug Collins says Steve Francis has played a nice game, he's run the team.

Wouldn't a nice game be when you've run the team to a 91-76 advantage, rather than a deficit? Francis was unable to get the ball to Yao when a 40 year old forward was guarding him.

Kobe scored a lot, and Rush shot well in the 4th quarter, but Malone controlled the game for the Lakers. He's the key to their team right now.

[Zeno]

Lakers win easy and shaq only had 7 pts and 7 boards I think. Kobe was active and played very well.

Francis does not know how to run a team, he can run himself, but has much to learn about team basketball. Lakers may take this in 4 games like they should if they want to be Contenders for the title.

-Zeno

[andyfox]

With all due respect to the Rockets fans here, they're really not much competition. We'll see what happens when the Lakers get to San Antonio.

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
We'll see what happens when the Lakers get to San Antonio.

[/ QUOTE ]

Be careful what you wish for. San Antonio in 5.

[andyfox]

They sure look good now, don't they?

Just saw Van Gundy: he was asked if Kobe shoots too much. With a straight face, he said yes, it's the root of all evil: Kobe ought to pass the ball, rather than shoot. Then, he got serious and said he doesn't understand what's written about Kobe, because it's so different from what he sees, which is an unbelievably great basketball player.

Gotta like Van Gundy, but he's trying to make chicken salad outa chicken shiit with the Rockets. He's done well to get them to this point.

[Clarkmeister]

I love Van Gundy. Not sure why, but I do.

[andyfox]

100% coach, 0% bullshit.

BTW, I saw SKP today at Commerce, spent a little time with him. I made him promise to return to us. He does have an excuse: a six-month old.

[Clarkmeister]

He is one of my favorite people. Love that guy. Tell him I said hi if you see him again before he heads home.

[Aceshigh7]

Rockets did not play as well as they did in game one. That 3rd quarter was ugly. We were playing great until then. Halftime took away all our momentum. I still think the Rocket's will win the next two at home.

[banditbdl]

You love Van Gundy for moments like at the end of the 1st half last night when Cuttino made that stupid foul and they showed him talking to Van Gundy on the replay and just the general disgust and exasperation on Van Gundy's face during the quick exchange. The man wears his true emotions (not just crazed yelling) on his sleeve more than most professional coaches.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
I love Van Gundy. Not sure why, but I do.

[/ QUOTE ]

His complete inability to control Stevie Franchise is hard to take, though.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
With all due respect to the Rockets fans here, they're really not much competition. We'll see what happens when the Lakers get to San Antonio.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, the Rockets suck. But we still have another Texas team to kick some Laker ass. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[andyfox]

Stevie is an overrated player. So is Yao. They're good players, and have made Houston a good quality .620 team. But they'll never be the core of a championship team.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
Stevie is an overrated player. So is Yao. They're good players, and have made Houston a good quality .620 team. But they'll never be the core of a championship team.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yao will dominate.

[IrishHand]

Being a frequent All-Star and "dominating" are not the same thing at all. Ewing was an All-Star, a Dream Teamer - and he didn't dominate. Shaq...Jordan...Bird...those players dominated.

Yao is a very good player and certainly a franchise center - but only time will tell if he'll decide to become a game-breaker.

And anyone who thinks that van Gundy isn't controlling Francis didn't want Francis play the past few seasons. He's infinitely more controlled and disciplined now than he was under Tomjanovich. To be fair, Rudy T. had less talent when Francis showed up and had little choice but to feature him and let him do pretty well whatever he wanted.

The Rockets will be just fine so long as Yao is there and healthy - he practically assures they'll make the playoffs for the next half-dozen seasons at least. It's what the have to surround him that'll determine how far they go. Right now, the answer is not far. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Irish

[adios]

Lakers 'D' is consistent and they have more players than the Rockets. Regarding Francis, he's a two guard and could be a very good one IMO. He's really not a point guard. Too early to tell about how good Yao will be. He's young and it's only his 2nd year in the league.

A digression. I understand why the NBA coaches emphasize defense so much. Look at the Kings-Mavs series, the Kings shot 53% from the field and in today's NBA you just can't let that happen. Therefore I'm quite sure that NBA coaches spend much more time on defense than offense. It's also true that players can hone their offensive skills in the offseason. But my word I'm astonished how many easy jump shots NBA players miss today. Although I'll admit Kobe made some spectacular shots in game 2, for the most part I think the NBA is not nearly as entertaining as it used to be and mostly because players offensive fundamentals have declined.

[Aceshigh7]

I think the Rocket's prospects down the road look very good. Certainly more positive than the Lakers. Kobe will probably be gone and Shaq, Karl, and Gary will prob be around only 1 more season, maybe 2 for Shaq.

I think this Rocket team just needs to stay together and develop chemistry. Similar to the team in the early 90's. They made the playoffs a couple of years and went out in the 2nd round. They kept the team together, and centered their offense around Hakeem, and became the most dominate team in the NBA. During those two championship years, no one else was even close. The Spur's with their MVP, the Magic with Shaq and Penny, even if we had faced Jordan and the Bulls we would have taken them down. The Rockets had the best teamwork I've ever seen during those years.

[SossMan]

[ QUOTE ]
During those two championship years, no one else was even close.

[/ QUOTE ]

They were a 6 seed one of those years, so I'm not sure how you can say "no one else was even close". They did dominate the playoffs, though.

I am a huge Lakers fan, but I agree that they have a limited window to continue to win. How can I be upset, though...we already have 3 titles, a decent shot at a fourth this year....I can't get greedy, I know that the good years don't last forever, Shaq will eventually decline, Karl will be gone if they win this year, GP wants to get paid, and Kobe wants to show the world that he could average 40 pts a night if he was "featured".

I don't mind, though....I live for the now.

[andyfox]

Now that was an impressive game by Stevie Franchise.

Is there a bigger jerk in the world than Gary Payton?

[banditbdl]

Nice win and indeed a hella game out of Francis. As much as I've ripped the Rockets chances I really would love to see them win the next game at home and make this thing interesting. God knows we need at least one interesting series in the 1st round. Also, as a T-wolves fan anything that puts more miles on the legs of the Lakers and Spurs is fine by me. I feel for the Rockets fan as I still believe the Rockets are in much the same situation as the T-wolves have been in all these years, nice team, a lot to like, but ultimately just not quite enough talent to handle the big boys out West. If they were in the East they'd give any team out there a run for their money.

[andyfox]

I think we're all underselling Indiana. 61-21 and a dynamite record against the west. And one would think they'll have an easier road to hoe than whoever survives in the west. Of course, that could be a disadvantage too.

[Zeno]

Steve was both fun and frustrating to watch. He could be so much better if he just played with more control and sense of calm and passed the damn ball a few more times, he made mistakes that in a closer game may have caused the Rockets a win. That said he made some great moves and plays in the last 2 minutes that were enjoyable. Jackson also had a good game.

The Lakers were still in the game late. Shaq's freethrow shooting was ghastly. Things will heat up for game 4 - hopefully there will be some fighting. A series isn't really a series until some punches are thrown.

-Zeno

PS - I already pointed out the Indiana 'thang'. You are behind the ball on this one. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[banditbdl]

I think Indiana is a good team and they or Detroit are both capable of putting on a strong showing should they make it to the Finals. One thing to keep in mind about Indiana's "dynamite record against the West" though is that it's largely based on dominating the lower echelon out West. Indiana is 3-5 against Minny, SA, LA, and Sacto, 6-2 against the lower four playoff teams, and an astounding 11-1 against non-playoff Western conf. teams.

I think the key for Indiana is Artest and the way he can disrupt the other team's offense. Because of this I think the Pacers would match up real well against the Wolves, a team that feeds off Spree more than many might realize. The same goes for the Lakers and Kobe. The Spurs are the worst matchup for the Pacers since so little of their offense relies on a scoring wing that Artest could shutdown... although Ginobli has been coming on for them.

[Aceshigh7]

I feel sick after today's game. The Rocket's played a hell of a game. Too bad the ref's had to call ticky tack fouls on Yao all game long. Yao can be standing perfectly still with his hands straight up in the air and if O'Neal jumps into him even a little bit, it's called a foul.
Rocket's played great but a costly turnover (which should have been called a kick ball), a nice drive and lay in by Kobe, and a screw job by the refs gave the Lakers the win.

Even if we lose the next one, I think the Rockets have sent a message to the league in this series. Watch out for them in years to come.