Ok how do you proceed here ?

[Tosh]

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (10 handed)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif. CO posts a blind of $5.
UTG folds, <font color="CC3333">UTG+1 <font color="purple">(Seemingly Solid Player)</font> raises</font>, UTG+2 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, MP3 folds, CO (poster) folds, Button folds, SB folds, <font color="CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, UTG+1 <font color="purple">(Seemingly Solid Player)</font> calls.

Flop: (7.40 SB) T/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 2/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="blue">(2 players) </font>
<font color="CC3333">Hero bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">Seemingly Solid Player raises</font>.

[BigEndian]

Stand on top of the table and shovel your chips in. When it's capped on the flop, then slow down.

- Jim

[brian0729]

3 bet then evaluate again

[MarkD]

I'm going with the consensus here. There isn't enough information on your opponent's hand yet to consider that you are beat.

But, how do I proceed?
- I 3-bet.
- If I get 4-bet I call down.
- If he smooth calls I bet the turn.
- If the turn is an ace and he raises I might fold, otherwise I probably call down.
- If I bet the turn and he just calls then I bet the river unless it's an ace and then I check/call.

[sfer]

[ QUOTE ]
Stand on top of the table and shovel your chips in. When it's capped on the flop, then slow down.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yup.

[Joe Tall]

5-bet.

Peace,
Joe Tall

[PokerBob]

Bump him back. I count 3 reasonable hands that he could have that hurt you, AA,KK,TT. Are you thinking he is a sneaky dog with AA cuz he didn't cap pre-flop? He may be, but if so, good for him. I think this is a situation where you can't fear a monster in the closet and have to assume your hand is good until he proves to you otherwise. A flop raise (IMO) says nothing about his hand. (He may very well have AK and is looking to see the river for free, a move "seemingly solid player" would try here.)
If he caps the flop, I still bet out on the turn, regardless of what hits. If he raises then I call (unless the turn is an A, K, or a /images/graemlins/heart.gif, then I may be tempted to muck)and check call the river.

[Saborion]

Raise.

[Rico Suave]

Hey Tosh:

Just to add some variety to the thread, I say fold.

--Rico

[tripdad]

[ QUOTE ]
Stand on top of the table and shovel your chips in. When it's capped on the flop, then slow down.

- Jim

[/ QUOTE ]

its party poker. if he's anything like me, he could very well be on the toilet with his laptop and a cigarette. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

but yes....raise!!

cheers!

[BigEndian]

Then stand on the toilet and shovel... never mind.

Ain't wireless grand?

- Jim

[Tosh]

Noone wants to call, then bet or check raise the turn ?

[Joe826]

Seems to me you're better off just 3-betting and getting the necessary info. If you just call the flop bet you won't know if you're likely beat or not until you've put in some BBs on the river.

[BottlesOf]

I'm not sure about this. You have to think you're ahead here. I don't think the primary reason for 3-betting this flop vs. a turn bet or c/r is to find out if we're ahead, where we stack up etc.

[Tosh]

I'm fairly confident I'm not beaten.

[BigEndian]

Not when a reasonably solid player raised in EP and raised the flop. 3-bet to see where you are. A solid player is capable of playing lot hands by raising the flop. This is a bad spot for fancy play unless you have a great read he might have a pair lower than yours.

- Jim

[MarkD]

I do not want to call and then check the turn. Not at all.

If I'm the solid guy behind you here and I have AK with one heart I'm going to raise you on the flop and then check behind you on the turn if you check to me. Now, he doesn't have to have AK here, but that's just an example of what I don't want to happen.

I don't think a solid player has a hand here that he is likely to bet with on the turn, and call a raise, that doesn't have you beat except possibly a flush draw. But if he knows you are also a very solid player than he probably just checks behind you with a flush draw (except possibly an ace high flush draw).

I'm not a fan of the stop and go in this situation either. Which leads me to the 3 bet solution on the flop. If the flop was rainbow it might change the above analysis, but then it's a totally different hand.

[tripdad]

[ QUOTE ]
Not when a reasonably solid player raised in EP and raised the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

this is the key to the whole outlook on the hand. dammit Jim(i'm a poker player, not a doctor), you nailed it!

cheers!

[brian0729]

Noone wants to call, then bet or check raise the turn ?

Yes after I three bet the flop.

[Tosh]

So the consensus is to play it fast.

His play suggests AQ/AK so I guess that makes sense to make him pay to outdraw me.

[sfer]

I don't want to give him a free river card with AK or a chance to call a bet with JJ/99 unless you know he'll autobet his AK in that spot.

[sthief09]

Why can't he have AA or KK? Are smooth calling preflop and raising the flop too contradictory for AA or KK? I feel like if he doesn't have AK or AQ, then he's probably got AA or KK and is disguising by not capping preflop heads up. I think most people cap with JJ.

If I was your opponent and held AA/KK, I'd smooth call your 3-bet on the flop, then pop you on the turn. This would cost you the maximum. What if you call his raise on the flop, and pull a stop&amp;go by betting into the turn. This would (a) encourage him to call down with overcards, which you want him to do, getting less than 7-1, and (b) cause him to not raise you with a better hand, for fear of getting 3-bet.

Anyone think calling the flop then betting into a non-A/K turn is a viable option?

[Tosh]

[ QUOTE ]
Why can't he have AA or KK? Are smooth calling preflop and raising the flop too contradictory for AA or KK? I feel like if he doesn't have AK or AQ, then he's probably got AA or KK and is disguising by not capping preflop heads up. I think most people cap with JJ.

[/ QUOTE ]

He can have aces or kings of course but I just felt he would wait to the turn to raise those. I haven't ruled them out though obviously.

[ QUOTE ]
Anyone think calling the flop then betting into a non-A/K turn is a viable option?

[/ QUOTE ]

I do in a way which is why I posted. I'm leaning back towards the 3 bet lead turn though.

[MarkD]

Yes, I think it's a very viable option. For some reason I still prefer the 3-bet though.