Four routine hands [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

kenewbie

04-16-2004, 03:17 AM

I like this idea. All hands are from the same table, it is loose and passive preflop with some moderate postflop agression and a high willingness to coldcall /images/graemlins/smile.gif The player to my left is loose as a goose and just horrible. I know none of this in the first hand though, I just sat down.

Hand #1:

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (9 handed)

Preflop: Hero is CO with J/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 6/images/graemlins/heart.gif. Hero posts a blind of $0.50.
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, MP3 folds, Hero (poster) checks, Button calls, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (7 SB) A/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 4/images/graemlins/club.gif, 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif (7 players) 
SB checks, BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 checks, MP2 checks, Hero bets, Button raises, SB folds, BB folds, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, Hero calls.

Turn: (8.50 BB) 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif (5 players) 
UTG+1 checks, MP1 checks, MP2 checks, Hero bets, Button calls, UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls, MP2 calls.

River: (12.50 BB) A/images/graemlins/spade.gif (4 players) 
MP1 checks, MP2 checks, Hero bets, Button folds, MP1 calls, MP2 folds.

Final Pot: 14.50 BB
Main Pot: 14.50 BB, between MP1 and Hero. > Pot won by Hero (14.50 BB).

Results in white below: 
MP1 shows Ad 6s (three of a kind, aces).
Hero shows Jh 6h (flush, ace high).
Outcome: Hero wins 14.50 BB. 

Hand #2:

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (10 handed)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with 6/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 6/images/graemlins/diamond.gif. MP3 posts a blind of $0.75. CO posts a blind of $0.50.
UTG calls, Hero calls, UTG+2 calls, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, MP3 (poster) checks, CO (poster) checks, Button folds, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (7.50 SB) J/images/graemlins/club.gif, 5/images/graemlins/heart.gif, K/images/graemlins/spade.gif (7 players) 
SB checks, BB checks, UTG bets, Hero folds, UTG+2 calls, MP3 calls, CO folds, SB folds, BB calls.

Turn: (5.75 BB) 3/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (4 players) 
BB checks, UTG bets, UTG+2 calls, MP3 calls, BB calls.

River: (9.75 BB) 2/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (4 players) 
BB checks, UTG bets, UTG+2 raises, MP3 calls, BB folds, UTG calls.

Final Pot: 15.75 BB
Main Pot: 15.75 BB, between UTG+2, MP3 and UTG. > Pot won by UTG+2 (15.75 BB).

Results in white below: 
UTG shows Qs Kh (one pair, kings).
UTG+2 shows 2c 5d (two pair, fives and twos).
MP3 shows Qc Qh (one pair, queens).
Outcome: UTG+2 wins 15.75 BB. 

Hand #3:

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (9 handed)

Preflop: Hero is CO with K/images/graemlins/club.gif, A/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, Hero raises, Button 3-bets, SB folds, BB folds, UTG calls, MP3 calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (13.50 SB) 6/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 8/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, A/images/graemlins/heart.gif (4 players) 
UTG checks, MP3 checks, Hero bets, Button raises, UTG calls, MP3 folds, Hero 3-bets, Button calls, UTG folds.

Turn: (10.75 BB) Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (2 players) 
Hero bets, Button folds.

Final Pot: 11.75 BB
Main Pot: 10.75 BB, won by Hero.
Pot 2: 1 BB, overbet by Hero.

Results in white below: 
No showdown. Hero wins 11.75 BB. 

Hand #4:

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (9 handed)

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with J/images/graemlins/spade.gif, T/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls, MP2 folds, Hero calls, CO calls, Button folds, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (5 SB) Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 9/images/graemlins/club.gif, 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif (5 players) 
SB checks, BB checks, MP1 checks, Hero checks, CO bets, SB calls, BB folds, MP1 calls, Hero calls.

Turn: (4.50 BB) 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif (4 players) 
SB checks, MP1 checks, Hero checks, CO bets, SB calls, MP1 calls, Hero raises, CO calls, SB calls, MP1 calls.

River: (12.50 BB) J/images/graemlins/club.gif (4 players) 
SB checks, MP1 checks, Hero bets, CO calls, SB folds, MP1 folds.

Final Pot: 14.50 BB
Main Pot: 14.50 BB, between CO and Hero. > Pot won by Hero (14.50 BB).

Results in white below: 
Hero shows Js Ts (straight, queen high).
CO shows 9s Jd (two pair, jacks and nines).
Outcome: Hero wins 14.50 BB. 

Any and all feedback appreciated. And may if find many many more tables like this in the future.

k

bisonbison

04-16-2004, 03:25 AM

Hands 1-3 look good.

In hand 4 you're playing with fire.

Bet the flop, it's a value bet if you get 2 or more callers.
Bet the turn. It's a disaster for you if this gets checked through.

An OESD is not as strong as a four-flush, but it's still a very strong draw. Unless you've got a read that says someone after you absolutely will bet this for you, it's much better to bet it yourself.

Nottom

04-16-2004, 03:32 AM

Hand 1: When you get 3 coldcallers of the button's flop raise, I would seriously consider 3-betting.

Hand 2: yup, looks about right

Hand 3: Very nice.

Hand 4: I will sometimes bet the flop, but checking is fine from that spot. Nice turn checkraise.

kenewbie

04-16-2004, 03:36 AM

[ QUOTE ]

In hand 4 you're playing with fire.

Bet the flop, it's a value bet if you get 2 or more callers.
Bet the turn. It's a disaster for you if this gets checked through.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks, I'm generally whimpy about betting for value but I'll make a mental note and pay extra attention to it for a few sessions so I get it down. The idea is that if there are more players in than my chance of winning the pot with a draw then I should bet even without a made hand, right?

(I'm not done with HPFAP yet, if it is in there I'll get to it eventually. I've been rereading the early chapters over and over to make sure I play correctly preflop and know why I make the plays).

I didnt bet the turn because I _knew_ (as much as you can know anything in poker that is) my left hand player would bet, I had an excellent read on him at that point. Ofcourse, if I had bet for value on the flop then the he might not have bet and your advice is very good.

Thank you!

k

Nottom

04-16-2004, 03:40 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Bet the turn. It's a disaster for you if this gets checked through.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the check-raise is fine. The board was fairly drawless so the CO's most likely hand is a Q and will bet again more often than not so its not a huge risk for a pretty good payoff when it works. If hero were drawing to a flush, you might need to go ahead and bet since a lot of opponents will check when the 3rd flush card comes, but straight draws like this are much better disguised.

kenewbie

04-16-2004, 03:41 AM

[ QUOTE ]

Hand 1: When you get 3 coldcallers of the button's flop raise, I would seriously consider 3-betting.

[/ QUOTE ]

Aha, that is another value bet right? I will get more money in than my chance of making my draw and thus its a profitable bet win or loose.

I need to read up on that asap. I guess in higher limits where people get thighter moves like that will be very important to your profit.

k

bisonbison

04-16-2004, 03:43 AM

The board was fairly drawless so the CO's most likely hand is a Q

I think this is true. I'd still feel better about it if the CO had not been the last to act on the flop.

Nottom

04-16-2004, 03:44 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I need to read up on that asap. I guess in higher limits where people get thighter moves like that will be very important to your profit.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually no, in tighter games you often don't have enough callers to make these plays but they are an important element to beating the loose lowlimit games.

kenewbie

04-16-2004, 03:52 AM

[qoute]
I think this is true. I'd still feel better about it if the CO had not been the last to act on the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

I must say I see what bison is saying here. With a single player behind be it might be generally be a scary thing even if your hand is hard to spot (for me anyway).

I feel confident though, if you had been watching that table for 10 hands you would be as sure as you can possibly be about him betting that turn. He was the most readable player I have ever encountered in my (albeit short) poker career.

k

kenewbie

04-16-2004, 03:58 AM

[ QUOTE ]

Actually no, in tighter games you often don't have enough callers to make these plays but they are an important element to beating the loose lowlimit games.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ahhh. Yet-Another-Thing-In-Poker-That-Is-Counter-Intuitive-Unless-You-Really-Think-About-It(tm)

I love this game.

k