2/4....good lord...

[symphonic]

So i'm not nearly bankrolled for it, but I thought, "Hey, i'm bored with .5/1, the 1/2 games are impossible to get into a good 10 person table, so lets dip our beautiful feet into 2/4"

So I sit at a table, and immediately i'm noticing atleast 70% seeing most flops. People calling down to the river with bottom pair. People calling preflop raises with junk (and beating my KK with 3-10 offsuit). Although i'm slightly down for the night, this is truly hilarious. These games are as soft as, if not softer, than the .5/1 games. Makes me wish I had a bigger bankroll so I could move up for good sooner (getting knocked down to the felt about 3/4 times at 2/4 would leave my bankroll virtually empty).

[thrillhouse]

Quiet!! Don't let anyone else know.

[umdpoker]

i thought the same thing when i moved up to 2/4, but i didnt make nearly as much as at .5/1. i saw the most ridiculous hands ever at showdown, but i somehow couldn't make much money there. perhaps it was the cards?

[symphonic]

I know how you feel. After playing about an hour at an absolutely WONDERFUL table, I ended up down 10 BB. But I mostly wasn't getting any cards, and was getting sucked out on alot.

[slavic]

In general the players will be better at each level. I think the only place I didn't see this as I moved up was on the Paradise 1/2 to 2/4 games. At the time the Paradise 1/2 game was a good bit tighter and a bit more aggressive than the 2/4. When you look at your win rates at any given level over a significant time you'll see just how much better the next level up is. It's not that there aren't bad players at the table it's just that there are fewer of them and the extra gravy is a little harder to collect.

Once you hit 5/10 and up online the difference becomes quite noticable.

[Zetack]

Hey, Hey!!! 2/4 player---Get out of our forum!!!!

/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I'm kidding...if you keep playing those tables let us know how it goes.

--Zetack

[sublime]

Please dont tempt me /images/graemlins/smile.gif

I DO have the bankroll, I just keep promising myslef to play at least 25k hands at .5/1.

LOL, am I wasting my time? /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[spamuell]

[ QUOTE ]
I DO have the bankroll, I just keep promising myslef to play at least 25k hands at .5/1.

LOL, am I wasting my time?

[/ QUOTE ]

Seriously, no. From reading your posts, it's clear you're improving and your play has advanced significantly since you first arrived. Maybe you can even beat 2/4. Maybe. It depends what you want - if you want a shot at beating 2/4, go ahead and take it. If you want to learn to play poker well, I'd suggest you stay at .5/1 for the 25k hands you set yourself and assess your play after them.

[sublime]

[ QUOTE ]
This is absolutely not how I would've played it. Roy Cooke of Cardplayer Magazine wrote once that if you have an edge, you want to increase volume and it will lead to greater profit over time.


[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks Spam

Its what I figured, after about 25k hands I am going to ask a veteran to check my stats and help me plug my leaks.

Thanks
/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[mackthefork]

Where? where? where? please tell me.

[TheRake]

symphonic,

The variance is huge at 2/4. It took me awhile to get used to the bankroll swings. I agree though, the games are alot like the .5/1 games with the exception of the aggression factor. I find many more LAGs that play at this level and it is not uncommon to see tables with average pot sizes $40-$50.

As far as getting out of this forum (which I realize was just a joke) since you are playing 2/4. I hope everyone will keep me around a bit longer. I play 1/2 and 2/4 about 30/70 respectively, but I post all my hands here cuz I kind of like you guys /images/graemlins/smile.gif, and this just feels like home for me. Maybe I'll move over to the SS forum if I move to 3/6 someday.

TheRake

[UTGunner]

The variance is huge at 2/4. It took me awhile to get used to the bankroll swings. I agree though, the games are alot like the .5/1 games with the exception of the aggression factor.

If the games were identical, the swings would be 4 times (4x) bigger (since the bets are 4 times bigger) than .5/1.
How much more variance is added by the aggression factor?
6x, 8x?

I am planning on dabbling in these limits shortly.

UT

[TheRake]

UTG,

You can still find plenty of reasonable 2/4 games (meaning passive). I tend to like playing at the tables with alot of action. As far as variance I am not sure in terms of BB what my difference is between .5/1 1/2 & 2/4. I will check Poker tracker when I get home and post back here. Guess I was speaking as to the actual $$ amounts per night. Last night was a good example, I played a 2 hour session after work I was +$178....played another short session later and was -$148. Takes a little getting used to when you are having $15 or $20 swings at .5/1.

TheRake

[Trix]

Hi
You found a good table, 7 to the flop is not avg. in 2/4, but I agree that the games are good.

They are in no way better than .5/1 though.
I have better results in both .5/1 and 1/2 than I have in 2/4 BB wise.

If you skip 1/2 you will also miss out on some of the experience, playing in tighter games. That probably wont hurt you till you hit 3/6 or 5/10 though.

[UTGunner]

[ QUOTE ]
If you skip 1/2 you will also miss out on some of the experience, playing in tighter games. That probably wont hurt you till you hit 3/6 or 5/10 though.

[/ QUOTE ]
What are the basic adjustments you have to make to profit in the tighter 1/2 games?
Premium cards only?

[JDErickson]

[ QUOTE ]
What are the basic adjustments you have to make to profit in the tighter 1/2 games?
Premium cards only

[/ QUOTE ]

First thing is you need to search for a decent table. Second, not so much limping (depending on table). Third play more aggresively. Watch your opponents. Find out whos good and whos not. Play accordingly.

Jim

[thirddan]

[ QUOTE ]
but I post all my hands here cuz I kind of like you guys , and this just feels like home for me. Maybe I'll move over to the SS forum if I move to 3/6 someday.


[/ QUOTE ]

haha, i feel the same way, im scared to go the SS forum, i don't know those guys...

[bisonbison]

haha, i feel the same way, im scared to go the SS forum, i don't know those guys...

Ditto. Plus, I think a lot of my issues are actually stuff I should have worked out playing .5/1 and 1/2.

[sfer]

C'mon Bison. You're already ON the SS forum. You guys are totally ready.

[bisonbison]

Until I get out of my April uber-sloppy play mode, I'm not on anything except for psuedo-tilt.

[Zetack]

Ya, those SS posters are just ultra-snobby micro limit guys...

/images/graemlins/smile.gif Heh heh, I'm kidding again. I'm sure they're wonderful. But Micro limits is much more fun to say. "I play micro-limits!" That's cool and exotic. "I play for small stakes..." just sounds cheap and pathetic and like you suck at poker...

Heh heh heh

--Zetack

[symphonic]

I have no intention of leaving this forum any time soon, even if i do ever make it out of the micros.

[cold_cash]

Sounds like a threat to me. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[TheRake]

I made the 5th post on this forum, so it definately feels like home to me. Wow looking back on some of my posts from just 5 or 6 months ago I have come a long way.

Check out my Am I a rock (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=micro&Number=405832&Forum= micro&Words=am%20i%20a%20rock&Match=Entire%20Phras e&Searchpage=0&Limit=25&Old=6months&Main=405832&Se arch=true#Post405832) post

TheRake

[SofaCoach]

I'd like to hear more info on the adjustment to 2/4. I started at Party .50/1.00 played there a couple months until I was very consistently winning. THen moved up to 1/2. After initial adjustment period I am now winning very consistently at 1/2 so I have been sticking my toes in the water at 2/4. But the 2/4 is strange. 1/2 is tighter than .50/1.00 but still passive. It seems like 2/4 is looser but much more aggressive. Playing TAG in 1/2 was very profitable for me. But I find myself throwing away winners at 2/4 too often because people are raising with middle pairs or worse.

I'm not sure what my adjustment needs to be.

[jacki]

I recently moved up to 2/4...permanently? We'll see.
One of the biggest adjustments I made in my game was limiting the number of tables I played.

I was playing four .50/1 tables and clearing 4-5 BBs/hour.
At the 2/4 level, I only play two -- sometimes one -- tables at a time.
There seem to be plenty of bad players at 2/4, but there is a much higher percentage of players that will make you pay for your mistakes, so paying attention becomes more important.

[UTGunner]

Thanks to all the good advice in this thread, I have been playing 2/4 tables the past several days.

They are soft as advertised, but do have the higher variance, especially when you run into the uber-aggressive players. But I think I can find a home here.

Are there are hidden surprises/tactics I should be on the watch for?

Thanks,

UT

ps - any Toads out there ready to crush the Zoo again today?

[ddubois]

I started flirting with 2/4 this weekend, going directly up from .5/1 because of this thread, and I'm in love. Up over $400 in under 400 hands. I think you have to play the player more. I am much more tricky and aggressive than I was in micro. I don't have the "I must always show down the best hand to win" mentality that I had. In the micro forums people discourage tricky things like bluffing, slow-playing and check-raising, but I think the psychology aspect of the game comes into play alot more aganist thinking opponents. That's my initial impression, take it for what it's worth.

[Chief911]

Hey,

I made the similar jump. Had been playing .5/1, and some 1/2, but jumped up to 2/4, and was amazed at how loose the tables were. I was selective, jumping out of a table that didnt have many in on each flop.

But the times I've been at it, I play pretty TAG, and find plenty of people willing to pay all the way to the river when I have monsters.

So far up around $150 in a short amount of time yesterday. My bankroll is delicate though, so if I take a big swing, will have to limp back to 1/2.

[Raiser]

Yes 2/4 is awful, but as others have warned... be ready for some swings. And if your BR can't handle it and you are willing to reload, then stay below 2/4 until then. I took a shot at 2/4 a couple of weekends ago (without the recommended BR) and just got slaughtered. Not by better players than me, but by suckout after suckout and missed draw after missed draw and 2nd best after 2nd best and... well you get the point. Not posting this to whine, it's more of a warning. I won't be playing 2/4 again until the BR is there.