blinds 10/15 - complete with anything?

[eastbay]

On PP the first blind structure is 10/15. This seems to nearly justify completing with any two cards, in hopes of flopping two-pair or better.

If you flop two-pair or better on 1/20 flops (is that right?), then you need to average getting paid off 100 chips to justify the expense. This seems plausible. Thoughts?

eastbay

[aslowjoe]

Still learning so caveat emptor. I tried to figure the ave pot on pokertracker. Besides not having 10/15 blinds I can't figure any way to calculate ave pot.(I'm I missing something) Having said that I am sure the ave pot is well over a 100 chips. Also the extra 5 chips only comes in effect later in the game when your all in and somebody calls and you win, now its 10 and so on. I am quite those 5 will make in effect in a minute% of times. Where I find it does cost you is when you flop a small two pair, now that ends costing a lot so I am very cautious when I do so.

[t_perkin]

yes so long as there is at least one other limper I would complete with anything. And if there are no other callers then I would complete with some pretty weak hands.

Tim

p.s.
odds of two pair on the flop (pairing both your cards) is 49-1
odds of two pair on the flop using one or both of your cards is 24-1

I am trying to learn all of these off by heart:
http://www.pokerupdate.com/pokerodds.htm

[PrayingMantis]

If there are a few limpers ahead of you, you are obviously getting good pot-odds to see the flop with anything, and 5T is a small amount comparing to your stack.

However, I don't think that's the right and only perspective to look at it. If there are a few limpers ahead of you, and it's an early level with low blinds, they can many times limp with all kinds of hands too, so you might find yourself hitting 2p against a set or higher 2p, or (and that happened to me too many times, so I'm very carefull), hitting a lower flush, and busting with it to a higher one.

So, I would say it is very dependant on your ability to play post-flop, and having a good feeling of whether you're ahead or behind. Otherwise, limping with bad hands can be very dangarous, no matter how cheap it is, and especially since you have the worst position possible. In other words: completing with any junk on the SB can reward you with the most unwanted and expansive present in NL: a second best hand.

Another point, is that in order to maximize your profit from implied odds by hitting something, you need opponents who'll limp preflop with, say, pretty good hands, and over-play them aggressively (or call big bets) post-flop, if they get any piece of the flop. Many times that's not the case, so you wont be making too much, even if you hit your 2p or better, especially on dangarous-looking flops like xxy, when you hold xz.

[Bozeman]

I will complete in this case with almost anything; however, I don't like medium big with small hands (e.g. q3o). Since you can lose even with two pair (usually to higher two pair, I want to have some other outs, like at least 23o. Remember, you are out of position here.

Pokertracker arranges hands by limit, not blinds, so it is non-intuitive for NL: 15/30 means 10/15 blinds.

[Prickly Pete]

As others have said, you have to tread carefully when your 83 makes bottom 2 pair or somthing like that. But, yes I'd complete with any 2.

[VarlosZ]

Again, I'd only pass if it folded around to me, and then only with very weak hands.


P.S. --> Thanks for that link, t_perkin. I've been looking for a quick reference like that online, and google has been no help at all.