beating the rake

[pokerkid88]

im 15 and have never played poker for money except with my friends, whom with the help of 5 or 6 books and wilson's turbo texas holdem i can easily crush. i play tightly and aggresively and am fairly good at reading hands. This spring break my family is going to visit the island of st. martin where i have heard the gambling laws are non-existant. I plan on trying some low limit casino holdem there, but have heard that its impossible too beat the rake in low-limit games. Any information on this?

[Warik]

It depends on a number of factors. Typically between the high rake, low hands/hr, and dealer tips it is very very very difficult.

But... remember that you are not trying to beat the rake on your vacation. You are trying to have a good time beating the 8 or 9 people sitting at the table with you who will likely underestimate you because of your age and showing off to mom & dad.

Find a loose game, pump your draws and good hands, don't tilt and you should do just fine.

[jdl22]

Do you look fifteen?

If so, and if you're good I would imagine that you can easily do this because the locals and tourists alike will be on tilt when they see a kid winning. People tilt when they see people in their early twenties winning, can't imagine midteens.

[1800GAMBLER]

Enjoy it, loose limit games either mean your variance goes from drunk for free on the night or to stuck the buy in.

[bicyclekick]

Yeah, it took me months to understand the concept cause people would always say it's nearly impossible to beat the rake at low-limit games...but nobody would explain why.

Look at it this way:

at 2/4 the average amount that gets taken away from you is 5 or 6 bucks. 10% rake up to 4 bucks + 1 for jackpot drop and 1 for dealer tip.

that is 1.5 big bets.

at 6/12 it's 5% up to 4 bucks plus 4 bucks + 1 for jackpot drop and 1 for dealer tip.


That's 1 small bet.

Think about playing a 6/12 game when you're averaging 14-18 dollar rake. Sounds close to unbeatable doesn't it.

[daryn]

i hate cardrooms with a jackpot.. why people like it, i'll never know. it's not like it's free, you're paying for it with the extra drop! it's basically the lottery.


i hate jackpots!

[Warik]

[ QUOTE ]
i hate cardrooms with a jackpot.. why people like it, i'll never know. it's not like it's free, you're paying for it with the extra drop! it's basically the lottery.


i hate jackpots!

[/ QUOTE ]

Some people play strictly for the jackpot. At my B&M the only time you'll find a "tight" table is when people are only playing suited broadway cards. It's the biggest tell in the world. "Oh, you're in a pot? Suited broadway cards for sure."

[Thats Interesting!]

BM low limit! Plan to win a bunch or loose alot!
Rake $3 avg
tip $1 avg
Jackpot $1 avg
------------------
thats $5 avg that you lose on a pot you win

Anyhow you will either have a great night if your hitting your draws. Otherwise you will rebuy over and over again.

Good drawing hands are key to very loose games. Your not going to last long with top pair top kicker with 6 players calling you down to the river with crap.

Get as much money in when your drawing!

Good luck! /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[MicroBob]

it IS somewhat lottery like....but i think it is more +EV for the good player.

if you are a tight player then you are essentially letting the loose-fish at the table build up the jackpot for you because they are contributing far more than you are.

maybe this is offset a bit by the fact that the fish are more likely to accidentally hit the jackpot when they perhaps shouldn't have been in the hand to begin with...hitting aces-full with ATo UTG or something like that, or keeping 22 against a board of AsKsQs and hitting runner-runner quads.

i am definately not 1/10 of the jackpot contribution at my table...possibly closer to 1/20.
let the fish who are shoving pots back and forth let their single-dollars drop into the jackpot hole.


by the way, i don't like jackpots either and hate the high rake at low-limit live games....but i just wanted to point out what i believe is a silver-lining to the jackpot nonsense.

[RydenStoompala]

1) You're 15 fer chrissakes. Leave the low-limit poker until you're older and head over to the beach where you can help 15-year-old girls with their tan lines.
2) yes, the rake in low-limit sucks huge chunks of your hourly win into the casino toilet zone, but given the fact you're too young to play anywhere except where there is a chance the game will be populated by local rounders, scammers, bad dealers, and other species, go ahead and knock yourself out. You'll especially like the guys with the Russian accents who play those joints. If you run out of cash, they'll help you out.

[MRBAA]

Anyone who can't beat the crap out of a 2-4 game, rake and all, isn't very good. I'd say 1-2bb an hour win rate on average is what good player should be able to take out. The big rake is more than made up for by how terrible most of the players are.

[Thats Interesting!]

What is this guy talking about? Rounders, Russians, card Shark, scams? Dude your watching too much TV. When was the last time you been out of your basement!

If poker is that bad, why do you have any interest in it? Dont mind this guy, most people you'll meet at the cardrooms are great people. Only place on earth you can go to and see the old, young, female, male, black, white play together without killing each other. And that is the truth! /images/graemlins/cool.gif

[Ralph Wiggum]

You should be able to beat the 2/4 game if you're any good. Even w/ the rake and toking the dealer, there are more than enough bad players to up for it at this level. If for some odd reason your table is tight, then get up and switch b/c then you're be eaten alive by the rake. Otherwise it's possible to beat low-limit. Play tight, be aggressive, you know what to do.