Betting into preflop raiser

[SofaCoach]

Hello, I've lurked here for awhile, this is my first post. Background; Lost my initial $100 at Party .50/1.00. Read Lee Jones LLHE and studied it and this board and began winning. I've moved up to $1/2 and am still doing well (up $1,500 over past couple months playing about 20 hours a week). Thanks for all the great advice.

The first topic I wanted to bring up is betting into the preflop raiser. There are alot of threads here about what to do when you raised with AK, AQs, KQs, etc. and missed. I want to be in a position to take advantage of them when they do miss.

So, when I catch a decent piece of the flop I usually bet into the raiser. For example, EP limps, I limp from MP with KJs, LP raises. BB,EP, and me call. Flop comes J,8,4 rainbow. At Party most players check to the raiser. But if it's checked to me I'll bet TP good kicker. If he raises, I'll likely get heads up and call. check-call turn and river if no scare cards come. If he checks the turn through I know he missed, bought a free card and my hand should be good.

Is this the right way to play this? What if I had JTs? What if the flop came Q,J,4 and I had middle pair? What if I was in the BB and have 2 players between me and raiser? In all these cases I have been betting into the raiser.

Would it be better to check-raise to see if he 3-bet, and if so fold? Or me 3-bet to see if he caps, then check-fold?

I do not yet have pokertracker, but plan on getting it.

I appreciate any thoughts/comments.

[StellarWind]

I think betting into the preflop raiser is the right idea in general. You don't want him taking an immediate free card with overcards. The larger the field, the more likely he is to check through and the more you lose when he does. Heads up or with three players a checkraise is attractive because most players will semibluff.

If you suspect a freecard raise by overcards you should consider reraising and/or betting out on the turn when a blank comes. This is especially a good idea if you are not yet heads up. The more people in the hand, the more aggressive you need to be.

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What if I had JTs?

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This doesn't make a huge difference because the only jack he is likely to have is AJ, but you need to be more careful. The king does help beat other players. Perhaps it's main advantage is that it protects you from a king overcard.

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What if the flop came Q,J,4 and I had middle pair

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Ugh. First the queen is a huge threat to have hit his hand. Let's change the example to QTs and the flop is JT5r to minimize that. Next, I don't think poker advice sufficiently emphasizes the concept of "another way to lose". When you take on the preflop raiser you run a serious risk that he will produce an overpair and stomp on your face. You also run the risk of an overcard coming and making his hand.

OK, you are willing to assume those risks to prevent him from stealing you blind with AK, AQ, KQ, 99, 88, etc. The problem with a middle pair is you have another way to lose. Some of the time you will win your battle with PF raiser only to have one of the other players produce a jack. Before the extra players won when they had a big jack. Now any jack or a big ten will do. With two other opponents maybe you lose a quarter of the pots you would otherwise have won because you don't have top pair.

You probably can't afford this. Your profit margin is too thin to accept this additional problem.

Moral: Never get so wrapped up in your opponent that you forget you have *several* opponents.