What should the numbers be in Poker Tracker?

[maxpowers21]

I was just wondering what were some good numbers to have on average for poker tracker for 5-10 holdem games at PP. There must be some interval that would yield the best results for each statistic.
Whats a good
VP$IP % Voluntarily put money into pot
W$WSF % won money when seing the flop
PFR % preflop raise
WtSD % Went to showdown when seing the flop
W$SD % won money in showdown

[Warik]

Unfortunately you're probably not going to get the kind of answer you're looking for.

Expect to get replies somewhere along the lines of: "it depends" and "Hands Played: 100,000."

[el_grande]

That's true, but you have to admit... For a program that gives you so much info, there is absolutely no roadmap!!

I don't know why. Pat or somebody should have a guide to poker stats website.

[stripsqueez]

[ QUOTE ]
That's true, but you have to admit... For a program that gives you so much info, there is absolutely no roadmap!!

[/ QUOTE ]

i think that sentiment is wrong - your the poker player not pokertracker

there arent standard numbers - if your seeing 40% of the flops you are seeing too many - but different styles make different statistics without being wrong or right given that wrong or right is the same as winning or losing

pokertracker is a tool that enables you to better consider the way you play and thereby optimise or improve how you play - its a misconception to think that it can tell you how to play without your own input

stripsqueez - chickenhawk

[el_grande]

That's why I used the word "roadmap". I'm not looking for it to tell me how to play. I'm looking for it to tell me approximately where I am. If you have no clue what PFR% constitues an aggressive player, for example, how do you know if you are one?

[stripsqueez]

[ QUOTE ]
If you have no clue what PFR% constitues an aggressive player, for example, how do you know if you are one?

[/ QUOTE ]

if you want pokertracker to tell you if your PFR% is too low then you are asking it to play poker for you

how did you judge whether you were aggressive enough pre-flop before you got pokertracker ?

i think the most valuable information from pokertracker is the relationships between the stats it provides and the comparison of stats between different players - if you have a decent data base in pokertracker you could filter your opponents down to say 200+ hands/tight pre-flop/big PRF% and see how they do - then you could do the same except look at low PFR%

you could look at the relationship of PFR% and W$WSF and come to a view about the approxiamate optimal relationship between these 2 stats based on the results of your opponents

there are a heap of other things you could do to consider this aspect of your game by manipulating and considering the vast stats that pokertracker provides - you will have to draw your own conclusions - you are the one with the brain...

stripsqueez - chickenhawk

[Jeffro]

I use it most for note taking and if you are maxpowers21 on Party have a note that says defends blind with anything called MP raise with 35o

[MicroBob]

ms sunshine posted about a month a decent guide of numbers that he considered solid poker stats. it was a good post...
probably worth digging up.
if i find it i'll post it....but i said that yesterday in a different thread and still haven't gotten around to it.

[MicroBob]

okay - i just found that i was actually intelligent enough to save that post my MSSunshine.
it was under:

drudman - 'evaluating my own plays' on 1/3/04 (i'm not ambitious enough to bother learning how to link).


here is the important part of the thread...copied from MSSunshine so i hope he doesn't mind.

save or print this stuff. if you're like me you will consider the information invaluable.
thx again ms-sunshine.....


---------------
There is so much use you can get out of www.PokerTracker.com (http://www.PokerTracker.com) that you shouldn't just "toss" the hands in. I can tell you are trying to get the most out of it by looking for problems in your game first. Trust me they are there. For all of us. I use PokerTracker primary for the notes on players. After about 5 weeks I have about a 1000 cash game players, at least 50 hands, with really good notes. There are about 1700 other players with less than 50 hands. About 500 hand manual notes. The tournament players, 1100, are judged on whatever hands are available. These leaves me with about 2700 notes in PokerTracker, but I have about 2000 more on players not seen in the last five weeks which are unlikely to be active anymore. Below is an old post.

*********************************

As to what notes I want to see when scouting a table:

Preflop starting hand range and their playing style.

For ring games:

very tight(under 15%sf)
tight(16-21%sf)
med tight(22-26%)
med loose(27-33%)
loose(34-50%)
very loose(over 50%)
nutball(with the exact% in note)

very passive(never raises preflop)
passive(<3%pfr)
med ag(3-6%)
ag(7-10%)
very ag(11-15%)
above 15% I write very ag with %

Blind steal and Defense:

No steal(0% from CO and button)
low steal(under 20%)
avg steal(which I consider to be around 30% not taking blinds tightness into account is 20-35%)
High steal(40-55%)
Always steals(you get the idea)

I consider average BB defense to be a little over 50% in $15-30 to a steal raise.

No defend(well almost none)
weak defend
some defend
low defend
avg defend(50%)
high defend
always defends

The Party bubble hint feature will show about 20 characters when you pass the cursor over the yellow box. The above is what is most important to me anything else, which also is important, like stunts they like to play too much and their general attitude post-flop gets added below the above.

************************************************

There are many interesting numbers to look at in your past hands, but 5000 hands is still too few IMO. On the General info tab:

Vol put $ in pot

For a ring game this should be in the 16-20% range. Mine is 18%

PFR %(preflop raise)

Preflop raise and blind defense and attack numbers are sensitive to YOUR game selection criteria. I'm always looking for action games trying to be seated directly behind the big LAG and in front of tight players if possible. The range for a winning player is 6-10%, ring game, with mine at 10%.

Attempt to steal blinds

25-40% range for winning players with mine at 33%. This number is the combined steal % for Button and CO.

Folded BB to steal

I use this with Folded SB to steal to judge how well blind defense is, very important in the upper limits. I defend BB 63% in 15-30 and 50% in $10-20.

Went to SD

Mines is about 30%, but the only use I get out of this is LAG's that have a number here below 20%. Loose for pre and flop bets then tight for turn and river bets. YUM.

On the position stats tab there is your Vol put $ in pot for each position. Mine run 9% for UTG to 20% for button. When you click on a position line it will bring up hands that are played from that postion and you can double click to bring HH up which has a playback feature at the top. I look for weakness in the up front plays.

The last stat, when out of wack, I look at is the cold call % for mid-table play.

If you continue to win over 2BB/100 hands than you should consider moving up in limits, with the proper BR of about 300BB.

Hope this helps.

MS Sunshine

p.s. Any upper limit winning player is welcome to point out any errors that they might see.

[wayabvpar]

Thanks microboy- I think I remember the thread, but I hadn't yet registered PT and thus largely ignored it. What a great post from MS.

[MicroBob]

he had another post too i think where he got into some more detial of what YOUR numbers should be. he touches on that some in this post....but it's obviously also geared to what numbers you should be looking at for your opponents.

at least i THOUGHT i remembered another post about this within the past few weeks. but maybe i was hallucinating again.

but you're correct...the stuff in this post is terrific imo.

[Jim Kuhn]

mssunshine stated pokertracker % in a response to one of my posts in the internet forum about 2-3 weeks ago.

[MicroBob]

cool....found it. more good stuff to ponder.


Would people tell me what range they would expect a good player to have for various categories, especially on the

general tab info. Examples are cold call pf%, vol put $ in pot from sb, preflop raise % and other important statistics. I realize people will have different % due to playing styles, skill, etc. I would just like suggested ranges.



Thank you,

Jim Kuhn
Catfish4U








Limit ring game?

PFR% 7-10%
vol$p 16-21%
attempt to steal 25-33%
went to SD 30-35%?????
Won $ at SD 55-60???
blind defense is important but very game specific with the BB the more important one. my folded to steal is 71% in $10-20(that seems high even for me) SBfts is 85%