Wimping out or smart fold?

[MagicRat]

I guess this is why I'm still a beginner (and posting to the Forum)... With the re-raise on the flop I was sure I was facing a flush draw so while I probably should have raised the turn I wimped out (and if I should have, why?). Then with a lead-out bet and overcall I gave up the ghost. So how bad (or not) was my play (and keep it clean!) /images/graemlins/grin.gif

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (10 handed)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, A/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, MP3 folds, CO calls, Hero raises, SB folds, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+2 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, CO calls.

Flop: (14.50 SB) 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 6/images/graemlins/club.gif, J/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="blue">(7 players)</font>
BB bets, UTG raises, UTG+2 calls, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, CO folds, Hero 3-bets, BB caps, UTG calls, UTG+2 calls, Hero calls.

Turn: (15.25 BB) 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
BB bets, UTG calls, UTG+2 folds, Hero calls.

River: (18.25 BB) 2/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="blue">(3 players)</font>
BB bets, UTG calls, Hero folds
Final Pot: 20.25 BB

[asdf1234]

That's an awful big pot to fold an overpair for one more bet in, especially when you've counterfeited some 2 pairs.

[k000k]

You got raised once the whole hand, what are you afraid of?? One more BB coulda got you &gt;20, and you had an overpair.. I doubt those other players stayed in for the 2's... Your hand beats 842 out of 990 possible starting hands made of the unknown 45 cards.. I think you were in pretty good shape there..

Just out of curiosity, would you have won the hand?

[bwana devil]

[ QUOTE ]

Just out of curiosity, would you have won the hand?

[/ QUOTE ]

ill take a guess. J6 or J4 for two pair?

[Yeknom58]

BOOOOOOOOO.

Raise the turn. You could easily have the best hand on the turn and if you don't you have a draw to the nut flush. If your opponent only calls I think you can value bet the river. If he 3-bets then you can MAYBE make a river fold.

[Nate tha' Great]

[umdpoker]

raise the turn? interesting idea. i certainly don't have the balls to do it. if anybody else thinks this is a good idea, please speak up! also, explain why. thanks.

[RoodyPooh]

Majorkong will have a heart attack when he reads this post. The pot is too big fold here, especially with a good chance that you have the best hand.

[Ed Miller]

Majorkong will have a heart attack when he reads this post.

My blood pressure is still a little on the high side, but I got my cholesterol down, so I SHOULD be ok for a while longer. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[GuyOnTilt]

If he 3-bets then you can MAYBE make a river fold.

That's why you shouldn't raise the turn. The hand was played fine until the river fold. Raising the turn is a bad idea, because you can't fold to a 3-bet and you have a hand that would like a SD, especially when the board pairs low like it did. Flop was fine, call the turn, call the river.

GoT

[SpaceAce]

WHAT?

Nevermind. I think raising the turn would have been the way to go and I don't fold the river. Unless you really believe the flush is out, how does raising hurt you?

Edit: Even if raising the turn is a bad idea, I think folding the river is even worse.

SpaceAce

[colgin]

Oh, you should call here. While BB may have the flush or a boat, in these games BB could have capped the flop with two pair. If that is the case then the board pairing low is great for you. I think the pot is laying you more than enough odds here to call one more BB.

[Yeknom58]

You know your opponent doesn't have the Ace of spades so what do you think he's going to 3-bet the turn with besides a flush. He might not even 3-bet a set, one of his likely holdings. You 3-bet the flop, and the BB capped. Then on the turn you raise a 3 flush board. By raising the turn you get more money from UTG or you get him to fold, both good things. Also, you likely get a free showdown from hands that beat you, assuming the 4th spade doesn't hit.

I still like raising the turn. Rather than CALL, CALL.

[iblucky4u2]

[MagicRat]

Gosh I sucked on this one, /images/graemlins/laugh.gif but this is the first time I can ever remember being in a hand quite like this. Hopefully lesson learned...

BB shows 6 /images/graemlins/heart.gif4 /images/graemlins/club.gif for 2 pair, sixes and fours
UTG shows J /images/graemlins/diamond.gifK /images/graemlins/diamond.gif for 2 pair, jacks and twos

----------------

This one will hurt for a long time...

[BugsBunny]

Opponent here is a true maniac. VPIP = 70+% PFR = 30+%. Will bet and raise all the way through with nothing.

Ultimate Bet 2/4 Hold'em (6 handed) converter (http://www.stompandcrush.com/cgi-bin/hhparser.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is MP with J/images/graemlins/spade.gif, A/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
UTG folds, Hero raises, CO calls, Button calls, SB folds, BB folds.

Flop: (7.50 SB) 2/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 3/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="blue">(3 players)</font>
Hero bets, CO raises, Button folds, Hero 3-bets, CO caps, Hero calls.

Turn: (7.75 BB) T/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
Hero bets, CO raises, Hero 3-bets, CO caps, Hero folds.

Final Pot: 14.75 BB
<font color="#990066">Main Pot: 13.75 BB, won by CO.</font>
<font color="#990066">Pot 2: 1 BB, overbet by CO.</font>

Results:
No showdown. CO wins 14.75 BB.
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Now *that* hurt. $59+ pot (of which a nice chunk was put in by me) just thrown away - because I slipped and hit the wrong button. I'm surprised that nobody heard the scream.