Woe to the internet Gambler.....

[Catch of the Day]

[Disclaimer One]: I realize that I hold little weight at two plus two and am just really a beginner in both poker and life in general; yet, I still feel compelled to speak my mind. I am not assuming that this post holds to be universally true in any way. I feel that, generally, I have very little to contribute to this forum. But for some people here, maybe a unique perspective is welcome, and that’s all I claim to give.

That being said, on to...

[Disclaimer Two]: Poker is a great game. One of my favorites, and in reading this forum from time to time, I am sure that most here would agree. Devotion to such an endeavor can be both profitable and extremely entertaining. All of the benefits of "making it" in poker seem grossly obvious to me, but I think that, in the same respect, the negative aspect in return are seem to be grossly ignored as well.

A subtle realization...

The road to becoming the perfect ABC poker players teaches a person a lot about value. You learn to calculate multiple factors and, in return, make the best decision possible. Pot odds, Implied odds, Reverse implied odds, outs?, Draws?, re-draws? etc…All things to take into account that allows a person to make the decision with the most +EV. If every decision you make is a +EV decision , then you are going to be a winning poker player and probably a damn good one.

However, It’s impossible to believe that what you do will not eventually affect who you are. Be it a hobby, job, career, whatever, poker ultimately boils down to money. Becoming a better poker player means that you just make more money, and that’s it. That’s all there is to it. As a professional player you become very good at making money, and because that’s all you become good at, I think that it’s important to compensate by investing your time into other pursuits. The lack of human interaction that the online gambler faces seems to be detrimental to life in the real world.

“Party & Affiliates: Attention youth! Employees wanted!!! Make up to 2.0+ BB an hour per table. Daily board meetings held at two plus two. Work at home, no people skills required.”

Now, more to the point of where I am trying to go with all this…

This probably doesn’t apply to a lot of people here, at least not entirely. Just shy of twenty myself, recently I have seen exceptional people make (what I think) are disappointing decisions due the pursuit of a lifestyle that has recently been seen as “easy money.” With the recent internet trends, poker has exploded. I myself and many of my friends seem to be caught up in all of it: Choosing party 2/4 over an education your parents are paying 25k a year for is just stupid. Flaking on a friend because you have to PM total strangers about the up-and-coming HULA tournament (which is going to be sweet btw, BBill tonight at 11:00, bring your A game!) is lame. A lot of unhealthy behaviors are almost promoted by this sort of lifestyle.

I see the routine that, I myself, and other ‘online players’ that I know, are getting into, and I am just curious as to whether it’s all worth it, and really to what extent. Life is a lot more complicated then poker is. Being constantly immersed in both the forum and online play can subtly condition one to both forget about the little things, and take for granted what one really has. The thirst for more in this game is strong. What once was good money at 2/4, becomes a full-time job at 5/10. Put in the study time and hours and what was once a job at 5/10 can become a lifestyle at 15/30. College Huh? Poker teaches a person little about integrity, little about relationships, and little about oneself. You gain the lessons life has to offer through interactions with people out of a card room off of your computer.

Money does not equate to happiness. When a person has a 20,000 bank-roll and a solid hourly rate, the little things don’t really seem to matter as much. Browsing the forum, multi-tabling, or both simultaneously, there is more to life than poker. (Duh right? You would be surprised…) A person can make a living, and a damn good one, playing poker; however, try to live a life of moderation. Live within your means. Don’t forget who your real friends are, (The one’s that you don’t know by a login name or avatar), The ones that might not play poker, but still want to hang out. Remember your family. Go to f*cking class. Take care of yourself. Get some sleep, shower occasionally, and maybe from time to time, see what the morning looks like.

I am starting to bitch now, so I’m out. I just wanted to encourage all the potential rounders out there to strive for more then just a kick-ass hourly rate. The fact that you killed the 20 game at commerce for 5+ BB an hour last weekend reflects little about your character or who you are as a person (just ask your friends, and family). Excellent Poker players sometimes turn out to be mediocre people. I guess it does just boil down to what you value…

In the game of life, what's the EV of Poker in relation to your priorities?

Just something to think about...

[Bubu]

A very inspiring post. Thanks !

Bubu

[ZeeJustin]

Is there any job this doesn't apply to? I don't see why any of this should be poker specific.

Instead of saying all of this, you could have just said, "Workaholics and various other shut-ins have crappy social lives."

[Catch of the Day]

"I don't see why any of this should be poker specific"

Yeah, its not, but as this is a poker forum, it still applies. And topics like this aren't usually discussed in the forums, at least I haven't seen any. The appeal Poker has, coupled with "recent internet trends" I think validates this specific post, as does my personal experience.

In rosponse to:"you could have just said 'Workaholics and various other shut-ins have crappy social lives"

Your right ZeeJustin I could have said that; however, emphaisis is gained through elaboration, and I was trying to say a lot more than that. Your an idiot if you think what you said would have been a helpfully succinct replacment.

Tell me you disagree, tell me you think I am full of [censored], but don't be hubristic in your assumptions that the contrite, antagonistic, statement you replied with, would have sufficed.

oh, and thanks for the constuctive criticism, it was well thought out and it seems obvious that you took the time to carefully read what was said...

[DanS]

FWIW, I'm 24, and I think that this is one of the best posts, and best world views from a poster >25 and especially >20 that I've ever seen on twoplustwo. Thanks.

Dan

[nykenny]

[ QUOTE ]
Is there any job this doesn't apply to? I don't see why any of this should be poker specific.

Instead of saying all of this, you could have just said, "Workaholics and various other shut-ins have crappy social lives."

[/ QUOTE ]

i am not a pro, but i couldn't agree more with ZeeJustin

kenny

----
i live a life of high ranking IT professional, part-time student at university, enthusiastic video gamer, and good son and a caring boyfriend, and a beloved friend, all aside from poker... BOY, I wish I had more time for poker!

[Catch of the Day]

Taking your sig into consideration I don't think I was talking about people like you, more in general. And the I am still confused as to the validaty of Zee justins statement. I believe that what I said had some value. At least much more so then:

"workaholics and various other shut-ins have crappy social lives."

If thats not apparent then I guess taking the time to "elaborate" is totally unecessary...

Can't blame a guy for trying to add little humanity to his posts...

[Robk]

So you're saying "Think a lot about whether poker is worth it for you!", right?

Do you see how your post implicitly assumes that we are mindless zombies who wouldn't think twice about how we spend our lives if you weren't around to impart your wisdom? And as such is condescending?

[nykenny]

[ QUOTE ]
Taking your sig into consideration I don't think I was talking about people like you, more in general. And the I am still confused as to the validaty of Zee justins statement. I believe that what I said had some value. At least much more so then:

"workaholics and various other shut-ins have crappy social lives."

If thats not apparent then I guess taking the time to "elaborate" is totally unecessary...

Can't blame a guy for trying to add little humanity to his posts...

[/ QUOTE ]
No doubt many people will benefit from your post (this particular one at least). I think what you say holds true, while ZeeJustin also made his point very clear on the topic "poker (as you described) is just like work".

your comments are very thoughtful nonetheless, and it did make me think along while reading it. thanks.

Kenny

[Franchise (TTT)]

I see you're getting a bit defensive in your replies, but I agree with the some of the others.

You've managed to put down a lot of words, but you haven't really said much. On a poker forum, we talk poker, and not about the rest of our well-rounded lives.

[Catch of the Day]

I apologize that you took it that way, but I felt that in no way I assumed that the general player at two plus two was struggling with "mindless zombyism" as you so eloquently put it. I believe that I said that this problem doesn't apply to most here.

I, in no way assume to be wise, see [Disclaimer 1]. If a persons' oppinion is percieved as "condesceding" "wisdom" given to "mindless zombies" then I wonder why you even bother to browse anyway. Do you always reply in such a "condescending" manner.

Again, I think you missed the point...

People are so quick to reply to things they didn't even bother to read closely...

[Catch of the Day]

Yeah that is true, I am bit defensive, I just kinda like to debate about stuff like this. I wasn't talking to the average player with the "well-rounded", well-adjusted poker life. I appreciate that fact that you did take the time to reply. I should realize that I am not going to like what everyone has to say regardless of the many disclaimers even though I was talking about me and my friends...

[jasonHoldEm]

Grrr...you made it tough for me to make a good reply.

I like your post, as a pro I agree there is a signficant danger in "losing yourself" in the game...especially for the kids who see the dollar signs and not the longrun work involved in getting them.

I also like Zee's point, although he might have said it better, I agree there are many people out there who get involved in whatever work they are doing and lose themselves in that just as easily. I wish you wouldn't have been so critical in your reply, I don't think he was attacking you as harshly as you think he was.

Anyways, there was a thread floating around a few months ago asking what people did in real life. It was interesting what a diverse group of people we have here...yes we do have a few professional cardplayers, but many more of the posters are just regular guys, with regular lives who play poker as a hobby. I wish I could find it, but my searches came up empty. If anyone can find it I think it would make interesing reading for everyone involved.

Peace,
jHE

[Catch of the Day]

I wrote the origianl post as a result of circumstances that arose in my own life that directly pertain to the issues that I touched on. I was a little sensative, and apologize for all the quick and harsh replies to criticism. You just spend some time on something that your venting about and in two seconds someone replies summing up what they thought you "could've" said in one sentace. Yeah I was offended by that. But I should of ignored it, replying in such a pugnacious manner probably devalues what I was trying to say.

Hope that clarifies things.

Catch-

[morgant]

missed that thread /images/graemlins/confused.gif, would like to read it!

[Bubu]

There was this very interesting thread that dealt with
lifestyle aspects of online gambling and depression.
Its very interesting. I hope the link works

Bubu

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=inet&Number=412215&fpart=1 &PHPSESSID=

[mosch]

I think I can summarize your post with one sentence: anything, done to excess, can be unhealthy.

It's hard to think of any activity that isn't destructive when it's done too much, and to the exclusion of a social life.

[LivingLegend58]

What about sex?

[daveymck]

With yourself doesnt count as social. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

Its an interesting post, but I think poker can teach you a lot of skills that if you apply to normal life could be helpful, eg studying to improve, patience, trying to get reads and body language etc etc.

Any work you are doing 40-50 hours + a week in any job will have a negative impact on both yourself and those around you whether that be poker player or whatever, I have to (I guess choose to) work away from home due to the benefits of it, there are negatives and an impact on my relationships with my daughter and partner, I hope that in these cases the benefits outweigh the negatives. This is like any job though and those who play poker for a living are doing a job you have to work to the ways that benefit your lifestyle.

Like any job those who play poker need to plan where they are taking it, how their career is going to progress and what they want to do in the future whether that is to do with college, work, travel whatever.

[jonnyv]

Great post! I found myself falling into the same trap about six months ago where I would come home from work, eat dinner with my wife and kids and hop on the computer for some online play. I was making a few extra dollars a week, but was devoting all my time to it. I started feeling guilty and it got to the point where I knew I had to stop.
I have now been off for six months and instead host a weekly game with friends and couldn't be happier. I get to include my wife in the game and though we do quite well it is more of a social event.
There is no doubt that a person can make a living online gambling and some can handle the stress that comes along with it. I just know that all the extra income did not outwieght what it was doing to my family.
I can't say that I don't miss it, but I know that if I continued down that road it would have been disasterious.
Thankyou for reminding me that I made the right choice and maybe this will be a wakeup call for others.

[mosch]

Too much sex can be a bad thing, too.

When I was in college I knew a few couples that failed out together, because they never left the bed. I knew a few other that became socially isolated because the only thing they did, other than each other, was go to class.

[NaobisDad]

Interesting post indeed. And yes, it does hold for all professions. However, you were referring to online poker in specific if I read correctly. And, for a single adult, I think playing online is more destructive than playing an equal amount of time in life games. And that is what I read when I see your post.

So, yes. Playing too much poker, or becoming addicted to poker is always destructive. But playing online might be even more destructive. I might even go so far as to say that playing for a time that would be considered healty in life play, might be destructive when playing online.

This holds for other traits as well. But it holds specifically for any trait in which you isolate yourself from others (e.g., online play vs life play).

I don't really like playing online. I think poker is a peoples game. And online play just doesn't offer that element. Your opponents might 've been computer generated personalities for all you are conserned. Unfortunately it's extremely convenient, and I will play online just to be able to play enough to get some sort of routine.

Also, it enables me to play around my wife and kid, instead of me being gone for long hours.

Negative side is that I do tend to get sucked into the computer, on things other than poker as well. Internet is addictive, and in my case I ended up spending more time behind the computer than just playing poker. And that is very dangerous. And it HAS been happening and affecting my home situation lately. That's why your post appeals so much to me. You are relatively young, and from your post I find you sound quite intelligent. (not that I'm that much older, but at your age I don't think I would have been capable of a post like this).

[Kenrick]

[ QUOTE ]

Instead of saying all of this, you could have just said, "Workaholics and various other shut-ins have crappy social lives."

[/ QUOTE ]

Pretty much all work sucks. If you can find something you enjoy doing, then you are ahead of 95% of everyone else. Playing poker for a living requires discipline that most people simply don't have. If someone can stay home every day and see their kids off to school and then play for the day, that's a life lots of people would kill for.

Having said that, anyone who gives up a college education just to play poker is a tool. Go to school.

[obex]

One thing that has not been touched upon on this thread is something at the heart of any type of gambling for a living. Most professions involve someone providing a service or product to society and being compensated for it accordingly. With pro gambling one is basically profiting off the misfortune of others. You could argue that you are providing "the service" of entertainment or providing a willing opponent to other gamblers I suppose. But as a career there is something a bit depressing about professional gambling that someone could probably articulate better than myself.

[LivingLegend58]

[ QUOTE ]
Too much sex can be a bad thing, too.

When I was in college I knew a few couples that failed out together, because they never left the bed. I knew a few other that became socially isolated because the only thing they did, other than each other, was go to class.



[/ QUOTE ]

Are you serious? Come on man,

Side not: lets schedule our match.

[Gramps]

A condescending apology for being condescending...that made me lol.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
FWIW, I'm 24, and I think that this is one of the best posts, and best world views from a poster >25 and especially >20 that I've ever seen on twoplustwo.

[/ QUOTE ]

Dan, for future reference, > = greater than and < = less than. Hope that helps.

[bisonbison]

The alligator eats the bigger number, cause the alligator is so hungry.

I love that alligator.

[ladypkrboss]

Isn't this the the truth........please. <font color="red"> </font>

[Kenrick]

[ QUOTE ]
But as a career there is something a bit depressing about professional gambling that someone could probably articulate better than myself.

[/ QUOTE ]

One of the main depressing things is that for most other jobs you can wake up in the morning and say, "I am going to accomplish something today," and then you go write a chapter of a book or close some sales or whatever. But when a professional gambler wakes up and says he is going to accomplish something today, he can play his heart out and may have a smaller bankroll to show for it.

[Catch of the Day]

This is a very valid point that me and many of my friends have, at least, attempted to touch on. It deserves more thought than I have the time to give at 3:15AM, and as I am a little inebriated at the moment, I will try to address it in the morning.

BTW LivingLegend58 couldn't hang in the festivities of late. That fool drinks like cactus...

Night all. Hope your evenings were as interesting as mine...

Catch-

[DanS]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
FWIW, I'm 24, and I think that this is one of the best posts, and best world views from a poster &gt;25 and especially &gt;20 that I've ever seen on twoplustwo.

[/ QUOTE ]

Dan, for future reference, &gt; = greater than and &lt; = less than. Hope that helps.

[/ QUOTE ]

I know, I know, I'm retarded, as evidenced by the fact that both my arrows were pointed the same way. I swear though, I really did graduate from 6th grade math.

Dan

[BBill]

Most professions involve someone providing a service or product to society and being compensated for it accordingly. With pro gambling one is basically profiting off the misfortune of others

Interesting but I don't think this is a valid statement. For instance if I play professional golf for a living I am not providing a service or product to society. I would also profit from the poor play (not misfortune)of others. Do you respect Tiger Woods as a professional ?

[LA_Price]

[ QUOTE ]
With the recent internet trends, poker has exploded. I myself and many of my friends seem to be caught up in all of it: Choosing party 2/4 over an education your parents are paying 25k a year for is just stupid

[/ QUOTE ]

Some of us pay for our own educations. I did it before working a regular job and through scholarships and now do it by playing professionally. I don't know about the rest of the student "pros" here but I'm going to graduate sometime next year debt free. Which is a more than I can say for a lot of my friends. Some of us don't have the option of taking a free ride to a 100k a year job at daddy's firm.

I happen to be a statistics major and poker goes hand in hand with my area of study. I take frequent vacations from the game and the money is enabling me to live a pretty easy life. If you find that poker is keeping you from being more social and you can just as easily place the financial burden of college on your parents then you should quit the game. Sorry if I sound a bit harsh, but that's just my take on things.

Cheers,
Luke

[MicroBob]

they would argue that Tiger and others provide entertainment to those that watch him live or on TV....and if you are not a professiobal up to Tiger's level it is possible you give lessons to amateurs as well. so, glory-be, you really ARE providing something.

but it's fairly obvious to me anyway that Tiger and others could give a darn about what service they are providing. they adore golf and adore the competition. the prize money is nice too....but almost all of them would golf virtually just as much even if they weren't good enough to make a living at it.


i still hate this whole goods-and-services argument. when i am doing something i love (poker or otherwise) i don't go in really giving a darn about what i am going to provide to the public today.

strangely, the instances where i have enjoyed my job the least are where i was selling something to somebody that definately didn't need it or providing some service to someone they would probably be better off without.
i was never able to brainwash myself into believing that what i was doing was really for their good. if they don't need what i am selling then i dont feel great for selling it to them....no matter how good at doing that i may happen to be.

i could work for some monster corporation that sells giz-bits to everyone in the universe...but my main incentive in going to work would not be 'oh wow....i provide giz-bits to everyone...this is great.'
it would be for a decent pay-check including health and 401k, etc and hopefully an enjoyable and fun work environment. if i don't have either of those then i don't really care whether or not my giz-bits reach the world.

currently employed as a BJ dealer. i have fun with my customers much of the time....and have become friends with many of the other dealers too. but, no doubt about it, i don't feel i am providing a valuable service to anyone...some are entertained and enjoy my dealing....but the reason i go into work is because if i don't i will get fired, and if i get fired i cant pay the rent. i don't make the 35-40 minute commute for little pay just for the enjoyment of the job....and certainly not for the supposed entertainment-good i am providing. i go because i pretty much have to go.

i have to miss a few days of work to attend a funeral coming up and another dealer had already scheduled a vacation. they were already short-handed on the days when we will be gone....and will be extremely short without both of us (it's a smaller casino). neither of us could give a darn aabout the fact that our home-base will not be able to provide their entertainment goods and services as efficiently as they could or should in our absence.


i enjoy poker like i enjoy a lot of things.
i also enjoy playing the piano (even though i kind of suck, am self-taught, and my piano is badly in need of tuning).....if you paid me by the hour to play the piano all alone in my apartment with no one hearing me i would be quite content with taking that job (although i would wonder why you were paying me to do that).....i could care less whether anyone else hears me and whether i am providing a good to the public or some entertainment.
only my cat would get any potential entertainment out of my piano playing (besides myself)....and she frequently leaves the room when i sit at the 88's.

lots of people have hobbies they enjoy tremendously such as golf or chess or bowling or billiards or curling (david ross, i thought of you today as i tried to understand your goofy sport on NBC), etc or stamp-collecting. if you offered them the possibility of making a decent living wage doing one of their favorite leisure activities i suspect many would jump at the chance.....especially considering most people have to actually PAY a lot for their favorite hobbies.



just my take...as always, sorry for rambling.

[Catch of the Day]

[ QUOTE ]
Some of us don't have the option of taking a free ride to a 100k a year job at daddy's firm.

[/ QUOTE ]

Being fairly presumtuous aren't we. Who exactly do you think you are talking to? I am extremely thankful that I am blessed with parents who are willing/able to pay for my education.

It's again, a question of value. The income poker provided was distracting. So much so that, something of much more value(a free education) became, at times, 2nd to it.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Choosing party 2/4 over an education your parents are paying 25k a year for is just stupid.

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

I took for granted what I have been given and am just tyring to offer some of the perspective I've gained to people who might me doing the same.

[ QUOTE ]
Some of us pay for our own educations. I did it before working a regular job and through scholarships and now do it by playing professionally. I don't know about the rest of the student "pros" here but I'm going to graduate sometime next year debt free. Which is a more than I can say for a lot of my friends.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is a noble thing. I am sure that you gained a lot insight/perspective into the value that poker can have as a means of income as a direct result of it paying for your schooling.

In case you were wondering. I was not talking to the person who had it all together. The people who are skipping class, neglecting their friends/family or unable to see what they are taking for granted as a direct result of poker might have benefited a bit more.

All that being said...

Get off that high horse of yours. It's a noble thing that your paid for your education but I am, in no way, going to apologize for the blessing that I have recived by having parents who have the ablility/means to support me. I was ranting about how one can take things (like a free education) for granted as, a result of pokering. I know that poker can be a great job that can be not only lucrative, but satisfying. I was talking about the neagtive sides that sometimes go unforeseen.

I am glad that poker has enriched your life. That same game has deprived others, in their own.

GTG though, off to Daddy's firm for an interview /images/graemlins/wink.gif I finally got him to give me the corner office with the big window. Thank god for nepotism /images/graemlins/grin.gif

Catch-

[bicyclekick]

catch - i'm very impressed with how you handle every post somebody makes and also your perspective on things. keep it up.

[mrwhippy]

yes...no...yes,definitely yes....maybe no....no....yes...no........................

[BBill]

Yes the goods-and-services argument does get rather tiresome. In reality it doesn't matter what someone does to pay the bills unless they are living up to somebody else's expectations.
Selling insurance, selling cars, providing accounting services, being CEO of a large SW development firm - these jobs all exist because the economy is good and people have money to spend. Anybody that generates cash flow by working or even gambling helps the economy.
A pro B&amp;M poker players helps keep the Casino in business, which helps keep a few hundred people employed. The casino employees paychecks buy cars, insurance, school tuition and accounting services. The Internet Pro Player keeps the ISP, The software developers, the site owners and all the consultants and support staff employed.

There must be variety in what people do to generate cash flow. The Insurance salesperson is not "better" than the Poker pro. If the selling insurance gives him satisfaction thats all that matters. If the poker pro is living up to his own expectations and likes what he is doing for a living thats all that matters. IF the poker pro-loves poker but also wants to please those people he is close to, in other words, Live up to someone else's expectations, then feeling of worthlessness might crop up.

Poker has a stigma of being deviant but it also allures people of all types. Many develope a passion for poker and might shine on a family gathering to play. So what, some people have a passion for school work and shine on a family gathering to study. As soon as someone finds out what they can do to the extreme and not feel guilty about enduging in their passion, they can experience some peice of mind.
Its all good.

[daryn]

i think you mean &lt;25 and &lt;20

edit: oops ulysses caught you already. stupid me should start reading all the way through before making an ass of myself /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[daryn]

great post, i agree 100%, especially about people blowing college. i see a lot of kids failing out of school because they're too busy playing party poker.. how sad. not only are they wasting such an opportunity to gain an education, but they are wasting the tuition money! i suspect they don't actually pay for school themselves because if they did they would realize how stupid they are being.

[daryn]

wait, you messed up again. your arrows SHOULD be in the same direction. you're trying to say less than 25 and less than 20 right? /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
wait, you messed up again. your arrows SHOULD be in the same direction. you're trying to say less than 25 and less than 20 right? /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Dammit, you beat me to this one! It's so fun making fun of Dan.

[Catch of the Day]

I liked your perspective BBill. It's too bad that poker is too often associated with "gambling" in general. I still have not yet recieved, at least initially, any positive feedback from saying that pokering is a part time job of mine.

Its only when they see the money rolling in that even my non-poker friends take it as a potential occupation. And then they become the one's who blow off class to play, or they play while in class. Sometimes a little of both...

Oh Sh*t! its all my fault... /images/graemlins/confused.gif

Catch-

[BBill]

Oh Sh*t! its all my fault... /images/graemlins/confused.gif

I'm not gonna let you claim all the credit catch... Its MY fault !! /images/graemlins/cool.gif

[J_V]

Of course it's condescending. Thank you Catch of the Day for opening our eyes. He's amazing at being condescending in a non condescending way.

[Monty Cantsin]

"There is a class of men who gather in coffee-houses and play with a desire that dieth not, and a fire that is not quenched. The passion for playing chess is one of the most unaccountable in the world. It is the most absorbing of occupations, the least satisfying of desires, an aimless excrescence upon life. It annihilates a man.

"You have, let us say, a promising politician, a rising artist that you wish to destroy. Dagger or bomb are archaic, clumsy, and unreliable -- but teach him, inoculate him with chess! Our statesmen would sit with pocket boards while the country went to the devil, and our breadwinners would forget their wives in seeking after impossible mates."

H.G. Wells in Concerning Chess, 1901

[MicroBob]

yes, i am a chessplpayer also. i think i had run across that quote before.

the chess-world sites the 'artistry' of the game as well as the benefits to the brain. chessplayers have been shown to suffer alzheimer's less supposedly due to their brain-exercise hobby. the study also proved the same trend with crossword puzzle lovers i believe.
i suggest it might coorelate to poker-players as well.

but clearly the reason chessplayers and crossword puzzle lovers indulge in their activities is NOT to avoid alzheimer's....rather it is just because it is something they enjoy doing.



"If the selling insurance gives him satisfaction thats all that matters. "

you articulated the whole 'goods and services' argument much better than me.

on the matter of the insurance-dude i am reminded of a friend of mine who sells insurance which i find to be a potentially depressing occupation. but he enjoys it....not so much because of the 'service' he is providing....but more-so for the flexibility his job affords and the income it provides.
as long as he sells enough he can live rather comfortably...and if he wants to take a day or week or month off he can do so at his own choosing.
of course, it is this type of flexibility of hours that it is such an attractive aspect for the internet-poker pro too.


when i get back to my 'regular' job i will be maxed-out on PTO hours and would have a tricky time getting off work for even a single day without raising some eye-brows from my superiors.
i am hoping to build up my bankroll in the next couple of months so i can devote more time towards making internet-poker a greater source of income....if it doesn't work then i head back to the job a couple weeks or months later with my tail between my legs. if it DOES work then there will be no looking back.

work 12 hours straight one day....and then take a couple days off....and squeeze in a couple hours late at night when in the mood. as long as one finds a way to knock down 40 hours or so a week they should be fine...and you can kill off these hours at YOUR choosing. you can even jam 60 hours into one week when you're really feeling motivated and then have a 20 or 25 hour week the next as a reward.

[NLSoldier]

Great post! I have been thinking alot about those exact ideas when I think about college next year and my future and what role i want poker to play in it.

[LivingLegend58]

"Like a cactus"
WTF??

[Catch of the Day]

Yeah it sounded better at the time... /images/graemlins/confused.gif

I think that I was going for the whole opposite of the "drinks like a fish" saying... /images/graemlins/grin.gif

No sure that I pulled it off though.

Catch-

[DanS]

[ QUOTE ]
wait, you messed up again. your arrows SHOULD be in the same direction. you're trying to say less than 25 and less than 20 right? /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Daryn, meant to say greater than 20 and less than 25. I indeed f'd up.

Dan

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]

Daryn, meant to say greater than 20 and less than 25. I indeed f'd up.

[/ QUOTE ]

From original post: "Just shy of twenty myself"

Sooner or later you'll get something right, Dan. Keep trying.