omaha tourney hand??? would you played it different

[morgant]

i was in 2nd chip position with 30 or so people left. my raises were getting a lot of respect, moreso than they should have in my opinion. please comment.......

alafan1 is at seat 0 with 3375.
morgant is at seat 1 with 16000.
NutSandwich is at seat 2 with 2035.
RAT-Killer is at seat 3 with 9495.
Germacho is at seat 4 with 17055.
drneil is at seat 5 with 4275.
Joe Tourist is at seat 7 with 7600.
Easton928 is at seat 8 with 5175.
savange is at seat 9 with 12935.
The button is at seat 1.

NutSandwich posts the small blind of 200.
RAT-Killer posts the big blind of 400.

alafan1: -- -- -- --
morgant: Kc 4s Qc Qh
NutSandwich: -- -- -- --
RAT-Killer: -- -- -- --
Germacho: -- -- -- --
drneil: -- -- -- --
Joe Tourist: -- -- -- --
Easton928: -- -- -- --
savange: -- -- -- --

Pre-flop:

Germacho folds. drneil folds. Joe Tourist folds.
Easton928 folds. savange calls. alafan1 folds.
morgant raises to 1800. NutSandwich folds.
RAT-Killer folds. savange calls.

Flop (board: Tc 6s Qs):

savange bets 4200. morgant goes all-in for 14200.
savange goes all-in for 11135. morgant is returned
3065 (uncalled).

Tournament all-in showdown -- players show:

morgant shows Kc 4s Qc Qh.
savange shows 7c Qd Jc 9h.


Turn (board: Tc 6s Qs Ks):

(no action in this round)


River (board: Tc 6s Qs Ks 5d):

(no action in this round)




Showdown:

morgant has Qc Qh Tc Qs Ks: three queens.
savange has Jc 9h Tc Qs Ks: straight, king high.


Hand #1061562-113 Summary:

No rake is taken for this hand.
savange wins 26470 with straight, king high.
----------------------------------------------------------------

[Buzz]

Morgant - Change the four into an ace, jack, or ten, and you have a decent starting hand. You must be aware that you're playing a "three legged dog." In other words, the four is a "dangler" that doesn't go with the king and the queens. As it is, I don't think you have a very good starting hand.

Savange limps into the action voluntarily and you pot it. I guess you're trying to cash in on the extra respect you feel you're getting. There always is a risk when you do that. As it turns out, Savange calls your pre-flop raise. (So much for your raises getting "a lot of respect").

But you have to like that flop! And you manage to put Savange "all in." At this point you must be elated! You're a tad better than a three to one favorite.

But then Savange catches one of his ten outs on the turn - and the board doesn't pair on the river. Well, yeah, 3 to 1 favorite means you figure to lose one time out of four - and this was that time. Too bad for you, but not at all unusual.

Would I play it differently? Not entirely. In my humble opinion, you made a great bet on the second betting round. And on the first betting round, on the basis of what you wrote about getting too much respect, I think you might have gone for a steal, had Savange not already limped. However, once Savange voluntarily limped in the first betting round, I think you were looking for too much respect.

Just my opinion.

Buzz

[chaos]

I agree with Buzz. I don't think this is a very good hand preflop. I would usually fold but might occasionally limp with good position. I think you overplayed it with the big raise.

Your play post flop was fine in my opinion.

[morgant]

thanks for the insight. i felt that 4 made the hand a bit iffy, my omaha experience is pretty juvenille at this point. my preflop raise was a bit too aggressive but i had become so used to raising and the entire table folding that it had almost become routine(dangerous). as far as omaha strategy goes, is this a good hand to get heads up with someone pre flop. or does the 4 detract that much value that it should go in the muck, what if the four paired suits with the other queen?? take into consideration my position as well. i am the second chip leader, with about 30 players top 10 get paid. that probably adds more to the in the muck line of thinking?!?

[Buzz]

"as far as omaha strategy goes, is this a good hand to get heads up with someone pre flop...."

Morgant - No. It's not a good heads-up hand. It's unplayable -except from the unraised big blind - unless perhaps you have a good chance to steal the blinds.

"...or does the 4 detract that much value that it should go in the muck,"

Yes. The four roughly cuts the value of this hand in half as compared to a hand with an ace, jack, or ten in lieu of the four. If someone else has already called, this hand should go straight into the muck. For me, folding here would be an easy, clear-cut decision.

"what if the four paired suits with the other queen?"

If the hand is double suited it is obviously better - but still not good enough to play it in this situation, in my humble opinion.

Buzz