Straightforward Laydown?

Playing in a moderately loose, very passive $3/$6 game the other night. A couple of hands came up ... this one, and one other that I'll post next.


Key to this hand are a husband and wife combo seated to my left. Wifey is immediately next to me, a mediocre player who cold-calls too much and chases without odds. The husband is seated on her left. He is an observant player, and seems to be playing in a game too small for him (there is a 15/30 going in the corner with a long waiting list). He's been quietly offering a running commentary on the other player's plays (good and bad) to his wife, and I've been overhearing bits and pieces. He seems to know what he is doing.


On the hand in question, I raise first in from middle position with JJ. Wifey cold-calls, and now hubby 3-bets. It is folded to the big blind, who debates long and hard and then folds. I just call, as does wifey.


The flop comes 9s 5s 3d. I check, with the intention of check-raising to try and blow wifey out of the pot/charge her the max to draw, and get information if I am 3-bet. Unfortunately, wifey bets and hubby raises after a long pause. Putting him on a pocket pair higher than JJ, I fold.


Any comments on the laydown at this point? (Note, both hands were shown at showdown, and both husband and wife were not colluding ... each had a reason to be there.)

The long pause means he has AK. I would threebet.


I assume wifey had something like A9?


Chris

I prefer 3-betting rather than folding to find out for sure if you're beat. It's certainly possible that the husband's got AA, KK, or QQ. But, it's also possilbe he's got AsKs, AsQs, TT, or even the longshot JJ. I would play each of those holdings the same way on the flop (However, I may not 3-bet with AKs or AQs pre-flop since it can be good to have a multi-way pot).


You also have to be concerned about what the wife is willing to bet after two other players showed so much pre-flop strength. She certainly could have flopped a set. At the very least, she's got to have a flush draw. You may be behind both players.


I still want to 3-bet to make sure my overpair is not good.

Dave,


I think the key to the hand is not the raise by hubby. But what would the wife bet into hubby with. The only situation that is good for you is

she has TT and he has AK of spades and his long hesitation is trying to decide if sleeping on the couch is worth raising her for a free card. And even that isn't so good, because he has a ton of outs.


She might have called with 99, or 55 or 33 and you are drawing slim. Did you have the J of spades, so at least both Js if you need them are clean outs?


I think that you are either behind, or have a high likelyhood of being behind in the future, its safe to fold while its relatively cheap.


good luck,

Bob T.

If hubby's raise folds you out, it's actually his pot by default, right? Reraise the Flop. 21Kid

While I would 3-bet, I also think the case for folding is pretty strong.


Husband has you beat, or has 2 overcards to beat you. Wifey most likely has a flush draw. The possibility of drawing to a 2 outer, combined with the fact that even if you are in the lead, you are likely to be outdrawn, make a fold marginally wrong at worst.


Again, I would 3-bet. But I doubt you are giving up a lot by folding.

Tough play. I wouldn't put Hubby on an overpair since most good players who 3-bet preflop would raise with just overcards. He doesn't even need a flush draw to make it a good play. I'd be more afraid of the Wife here, especially if she's usually passive, since she bet into a 3-bettor. Would she bet a flush draw here? I'd be afraid of trips.


I think I'd 3-bet to try and see where I'm out, but folding can't be very wrong. Tough hand to play out of position.


Then again, what do I know.


Rube

In this instance, the laydown turned out to be correct.


The turn was a blank, wifey checks and calls. The river was another 9, wifey checked and folded, flashing 8s6s for a gutshot straight flush draw on the flop. (I did tell you she cold-calls too much, right?)


I make a comment about hubby having a pocket pair higher than JJ, and he obligingly shows QQ, with some comment about "so you don't think we were trying to squeeze you."


At the table, I thought this was a fairly standard laydown, but after a little reflection, I wasn't as sure. (Perhaps my results-coloured glasses are getting in the way again...) The two options I considered were to 3-bet or to fold. At the time, while I thought that hubby was probably good enough to make a play with overcards in this scenario, the lengthy pause struck me as a possible "weak = strong" tell, and tipped the scales in favour of folding.

ya didnt say if ya had the J of spades or not. if ya did, i woulda 3 bet, as any J wont complete the flush. also if its capped then ya pretty much know the pair of overcards is there. another question...did wifey make it 3 bets?


from the results, it sounds like ya read it right. its a raise fold situation here. nice play...


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