AQ Late Position, 7-handed

[ShortStack]

I am so confounded how to play this hand. I need help. The more I think about it, the less I am sure how to play it. I'm fairly new to this game, so if the solution is obvious, please let me know. I'll defintely settle for a finger pointing in the right direction.

Seven-handed game, $5/$10. I'm in LP with A /images/graemlins/diamond.gif
Q /images/graemlins/spade.gif

UTG call, EP fold, MP raised, LP (me) reraised (1st mistake?), BUT reraise, SB and BB fold. LP reraised (2nd mistake?) which capped it. BUT, UTG, MP called. Not what I was hoping for.

Flop: 10 /images/graemlins/heart.gif 8 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif 8 /images/graemlins/club.gif

UTG & MP check, LP bet (3rd???.) BUT, UTG, MP called!

Turn: 6 /images/graemlins/heart.gif

UTG & MP check, LP bet (4th???) BUT, UTG, MP called.

River: 9 /images/graemlins/heart.gif

UTG check, MP bet, LP folded and so did the UTG.

The four card straight board scared me. MP shows me his A /images/graemlins/spade.gif J /images/graemlins/heart.gif.

What am I missing? Is there something in the betting pattern that I am missing?

I should point out that most pots were probably a little bit less than half this size, and in previous late positions(in a seven-handed game) I had aggressively and with modest success been isolating one or two players (BUT, SB, BB).

Perhaps my entire approach is wrong. I also might be very readable. I am very new to the game.

[BaronVonCP]

Please note that its late and I don't really know what I'm talking about.



[ QUOTE ]

UTG call, EP fold, MP raised, LP (me) reraised (1st mistake?), BUT reraise, SB and BB fold. LP reraised (2nd mistake?) which capped it. BUT, UTG, MP called. Not what I was hoping for.


[/ QUOTE ]

What were you hoping for? Everyone to fold? Unless there is something you know about the players involved, you went a lil too overboard with this preflop. Even the 3 bet is sorta questionable but not necessarily incorrect. But coming over the top again after the button raises you is insane IMO. It doesn't really accomplish anything.

[ QUOTE ]

Flop: 10 /images/graemlins/heart.gif 8 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif 8 /images/graemlins/club.gif

UTG & MP check, LP bet (3rd???.) BUT, UTG, MP called!


[/ QUOTE ]

I guess since you capped it you sorta have to bet any flop. However the chances you taking it down here are close to 0%. If I would have just called the Buttons reraise, I might have check folded this flop.


[/ QUOTE ]
Turn: 6 /images/graemlins/heart.gif

UTG & MP check, LP bet (4th???) BUT, UTG, MP called.


[/ QUOTE ]

Ok. You got no resistance on the flop, so maybe nobody has AA. I wouldn't be suprised to guess that the button has KK or QQ and is somewhat concerned about your hand considering how much action went down preflop.
That's sorta the problem with going ballistic preflop with marginal holdings. People give you too much respect and you never really get to find out where you are.
[ QUOTE ]

River: 9 /images/graemlins/heart.gif

UTG check, MP bet, LP folded and so did the UTG.


[/ QUOTE ]

There really isn't anything to say.



[/ QUOTE ]
The four card straight board scared me. MP shows me his A /images/graemlins/spade.gif J /images/graemlins/heart.gif.

What am I missing? Is there something in the betting pattern that I am missing?


[/ QUOTE ]
Well what probably happened here was you put in a ton of bets without the best hand. Then it gets to the river and this guy thinks "hey this pot is huge lemme try and win it", so he bets. And he wins. I'm sure the bettor had the worst hand out of everyone involved but whatever.

[ShortStack]

Thanks for taking your time to help me out here. This game of Hold'Em is very, very tough. I appreciate your help. Thanks.

[WillMagic]

1st off...don't abbreviate button.

Second - if you are relatively new, why are you playing 5/10?

Three-betting preflop is fine with AQo. Five-betting is not.

And, as always, preflop mistakes lead to bigger postflop mistakes.

The correct way to play this hand was to call the button's four-bet, and then check and fold the flop. Your mistake preflop cost you 2 BB's. In a single hand. If you make this kind of mistake, say, a couple times an hour....well, you are losing for a reason.

Um, don't worry about being readable, that's not why you are losing. You are losing because you are a maniac who lacks a basic grasp of how to play hold'em. So buy some books.

Will

[Bob T.]

Your big problem occurs preflop. What hands do you think that MP holds when he raises behind one EP limper? Where do you think AQ fits into MPs range of hands? What flops do you need to play confidently? Given that range of hands, which do you think is better, Reraising and probably investing at least 4 SBs in this pot, or folding?

OK, so you chose reraise, and then the button 4bets? Ask yourself the same questions about the range of hands that the button would 4bet with. You have to see the flop at this point, but you don't have to invest extra money to see the flop. Capping preflop was silly.

Good luck,
play well,

Bob T.

[Haupt_234]

[ QUOTE ]
The correct way to play this hand was to call the button's four-bet, and then check and fold the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wouldn't he have odds to try and chase an A? If his opponent isn't holding AA, he has 3 outs which comes to 7:1 odds with two cards to come. The pot odds would be 8:1, so shouldn't the hero check/call and fold if no A comes on the turn?

I am more or less reassuring myself, not ragging on you for your response? Am I right here?

[ShortStack]

"What hands do you think that MP holds when he raises behind one EP limper? Where do you think AQ fits into MPs range of hands? What flops do you need to play confidently?"

AAs thru 66s, AKs, AQs, AJs, KQs, QJs, KJs, ATs, AK, AQ, and AJ.

"Ask yourself the same questions about the range of hands that the button would 4bet with. "
AA - TT, AKs, AQs, and AK.

So far I've been called a maniac(not by you, yet,) but this game is 7-handed. Doesn't that loosen up minimum calls/raises/reraises?

Part of my pre-flop raise was to buy the button. I thought he would fold. I also thought I would have control of the pot. I kinda' had the feeling I owned this table as all attention seemed on me. The blinds were somewhat tight and I thought they would go away. Of course they did but my first raise was correct (I think) and I have to admit to appearing a little ballistic pre-flop.

I had the feeling that MP was a loose raiser. The hands I included above were hands I might raise 7-handed from MP so I would include a few hands more for him.

I had been succesful rammin' and jammin' these pots and then playing flops I liked. I also thought I was in a zone and bulletproof as many good cards had come my way and I seemed to be folding smartly. AA and KK were almost routine and flushes were coming Ace high.

I don't want to comment on the psychological factors except to say that my opposition was beginning to fear me (wrongly.) I'm more concerned with 1) How far should I go with AQ pre-flop...and I think I had some good answers here on this post, and 2} what to do with the same starting 2 cards after flopping 10 /images/graemlins/heart.gif8 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif8 /images/graemlins/club.gif. I thought with AQ and with a raggedy board I had decent outs.

Don't you normally bet 2 overcards on a flop like this? I didn't see ANY raising on the turn or river.

Thanks for the help. It is appreciated.

[ShortStack]

I am beginning to agree with you about 3-betting AQ.

I thought Haupt's reply is solid, and kinda' the thinking I was hoping was correct. You seem to disagree. I hope to learn from you both.

Who said I was losing? I played almost 7 hours and made $200. I wouldn't say that is statistically significant nor would I make any claims to being a money winner (yet,) but that's PLUS $200. Which ten books should I buy as I can afford several with $200? LOL.

Thanks for your taking your time to comment on this hand. Good Luck!

[ShortStack]

I totally agree of course but I am still trying to put a good game together. I lost a fair amount of money on this one and any hand that confounds me makes me think about the game all the more. Live and learn.

Thanks for your help.

[BaronVonCP]

If you know the Preflop raiser to have light raising standards, the 3 bet is definately resonable, if not preferred.

However the 4 bet behind you is trouble. You need to hit the flop hard to continue. 5 betting is definately not an option.

you shouldn't call the flop bet just to chase an Ace. Only 3 left, and its very likely someone has at least AK.

[Bob T.]

"What hands do you think that MP holds when he raises behind one EP limper?....

AAs thru 66s, AKs, AQs, AJs, KQs, QJs, KJs, ATs, AK, AQ, and AJ.

I think that a lot of these hands aren't in the typical range for preflop raises when someone is already in the pot.

I would guess that most players aren't raising with TT, 99, 88, 77, 66, AJs, KQs QJs KJs ATs and AJ. I don't want to discuss the merits of raising with those hands, I just believe that those hands aren't going to be raised very often.

I also think that a lot of players aren't 4 betting with TT, and maybe not JJ, QQ, AQs.

Good luck,
play well,

Bob T.

[ShortStack]

You are so right. The pot was more than twice as big as normal and I was shown more hands than I would have imagined.

MP: A /images/graemlins/spade.gifJ /images/graemlins/heart.gif
Button: A /images/graemlins/heart.gifK /images/graemlins/spade.gif
UTG: K /images/graemlins/diamond.gif9 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

I'm still seeing this one in my dreams...

[ZManODS]

[ QUOTE ]
Wouldn't he have odds to try and chase an A? If his opponent isn't holding AA, he has 3 outs which comes to 7:1 odds with two cards to come. The pot odds would be 8:1, so shouldn't the hero check/call and fold if no A comes on the turn?


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I believe you are mistaken. Yes the odds are 7:1 for catching 3 outs with 2 more cards to come, but you are not all-in. You will have to pay a BB on the turn if you miss your A, which may not even be a clean out. If you are going to fold on the turn if your Ace doesnt hit then you shouldnt care what the odds are from the flop to river. You should care about what the odds are from the flop to the turn which in this case is about 14.5:1, and given the fact that it still may not even be a clean out i would say fold on the flop.

And im sure you heard from the other posters that 5-betting with AQo is not a profitable play.

[ZManODS]

[ QUOTE ]
The four card straight board scared me.

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I dont know anyone that would play a 7 that is capped preflop and then stick around to catch a runner runner on that flop (Even as low as .50/1.00)

If you didnt think anyone had an 8 why would you think someone would have a 7?