Forward of Davidross Post

[Canada Kelly]

I am mainly a fullring player and am curious about the preflop questions david threw out but in a full ring game.

we will assume, the table is regular, no crazies, we'll say solid player on the button.

I have added a few because these are the playings that I am interested in....

UTG A8 suited
UTG 66
UTG KTs

Button after 2 limpers

ATs
A3s
A9o
QJs
KTo
77
K9s
QTs
J8s

SB to a button raise

KJo
A7o
A7s
33
JTo

[prairieboy]

UTG A8 suited - Fold
UTG 66 - Almost Always Fold
UTG KTs - Fold

Button after 2 limpers

ATs - Call/Raise
A3s - Call/Fold
A9o - Fold/Raise (usually fold)
QJs - Call
KTo - Call
77 - Call
K9s - Fold
QTs - Call
J8s - Fold

SB to a button raise

KJo - raise
A7o - call
A7s - call/raise
33 - call/raise
JTo - call

[Nottom]

Heres how I would play most of these in a normal game with some nice fishies.

UTG A8 suited - limp
UTG 66 -limp
UTG KTs - limp

Button after 2 limpers

ATs - raise
A3s - limp
A9o - fold
QJs - raise
KTo - fold to decent limpers, raise bad ones
77 - limp
K9s - limp
QTs - raise
J8s - limp

SB to a button raise

KJo - 3-bet
A7o - 3-bet
A7s - 3-bet
33 - fold or 3-bet
JTo - fold or 3-bet

[Ocho]

[ QUOTE ]

Button after 2 limpers

ATs - raise
A3s - limp
A9o - fold
QJs - raise
KTo - fold to decent limpers, raise bad ones
77 - limp
K9s - limp
QTs - raise
J8s - limp



[/ QUOTE ]

I see this an wonder if i'm not raising enough on the button. For example, with 2 limpers, I would just call w/ Q10s and QJs and i would fold J8s. I would only play the J8s with 4 or more limpers (and then only call, not raise). Can you explain your logic for these raises and the play of the j8s?

Thanks.
Ocho

[Vehn]

UTG A8 suited - fold
UTG 66 - fold but calling is fine
UTG KTs - fold

Button after 2 limpers

ATs - raise
A3s - call
A9o - fold
QJs - call but raising is fine
KTo - fold but calling is fine
77 - call
K9s - call
QTs - call but raising is fine
J8s - call

SB to a button raise (assuming 5/10 or below online or 10/20 or below live)

KJo - fold
A7o - fold
A7s - fold
33 - fold
JTo - fold

[Joe Tall]

[ QUOTE ]
UTG A8 suited - fold

[/ QUOTE ]

Passive preflop game, limp.

Peace,
Joe Tall

[Canada Kelly]

I see you like to play a lot of these given a regular game.

I notice you limp quite a bit and i think that is pretty good with some of these hands.

I recently was really struggling and raising too much preflop, not with bad cards, but with bad position.

I replaced a lot of my raising with folding and calling, and now it is like night and day, my game and my lack of losing sessions. Not saying that i don't lose, but i don't have the swings.

And I agree with a comment you made before Nottom, and that is when you mentioned that if just clicked to you and you were a winner and that is how I have felt lately.

[Ed Miller]

we will assume, the table is regular, no crazies

I'm going to pretend this is a late night 15-30 at the Bellagio. That means that players are too loose and somewhat aggressive. They are also not particularly tricky after the flop.

I'm assuming that because (1) I play that game, and (2) most responses will be geared for online low- and micro-limit games. I'm gonna mix it up a little bit. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Of course, all answers can be different depending on the SPECIFIC situation.

UTG A8 suited - limp (real marginal, doesn't matter much)
UTG 66 - limp (less marginal)
UTG KTs - limp

Button after 2 limpers

ATs - raise
A3s - limp (occasionally raise)
A9o - fold or limp depending on how weak the limpers are
QJs - raise
KTo - limp
77 - limp
K9s - limp (occasionally raise)
QTs - limp (occasionally raise)
J8s - limp

SB to a button raise (I'm assuming a button OPEN-raise)

These answers are VERY different for a lower-limit game with a different small blind structure

KJo - 3-bet
A7o - 3-bet
A7s - 3-bet
33 - 3-bet
JTo - eh.. fold

[JTG51]

Wow, I'm pretty surprised at your answers Vehn.

The poster didn't specifically say what game the questions are about, but since this is the low limit forum I think it's safe to assume we're talking aobut a typical low limit game, not a tough 30-60 game.

My answers:

UTG A8 suited - call
UTG 66 - call
UTG KTs - call

Button after 2 limpers

ATs - raise
A3s - call mostly, sometimes raise
A9o - fold
QJs - call or raise
KTo - call
77 - call
K9s - call mostly, sometimes raise
QTs - call mostly, sometimes raise
J8s - call

SB to a button raise (assuming 5/10 or below online or 10/20 or below live)

I'm assuming for simplicity that all of these are in games where the SB is half the BB.

KJo - 3-bet
A7o - 3-bet
A7s - 3-bet
33 - 3-bet or fold
JTo - fold

[Ed Miller]

[JTG51]

First of all, I said to call with a lot of the hands where you would have limped.

Second, I said I'd sometimes raise a few of the hands that you said you'd occasionally raise.


Wow, those answers really are close. I guess this preflop stuff is easy. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Vehn]

My answers are the same as your except that unless the game is extremely good I don't play king ten and ace rag up front. Oh, they're sooted? Well they're awesome then, right? /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Also there's no point in defending your small blind with marginal hands like KJ or god forbid JT when after the rake there's nothing of your blind left. I would probably defend the big blind with most of them though, and in bigger games with more "playable" blind & rake structure I would probably 3 bet with all of them other than JT.

[Joe Tall]

[ QUOTE ]
Wow, I'm pretty surprised at your answers Vehn.

[/ QUOTE ]

The major difference lies in the SB-section. Which is highly game/opponent dependant. Switch those to the BB and I'm 3-betting most.

Although I'm not limping w/KTs UTG unless I'm 100% sure there will not be a 3-bet preflop.

Peace,
Joe Tall

[Joe Tall]

[ QUOTE ]
Wow, those answers really are close. I guess this preflop stuff is easy

[/ QUOTE ]

Funny, you said that. As I saw DRs orginal post and thought, "should I be quitting my day job?".

Peace,
Joe Tall