Advice for Beginners....

[Fitz]

I don't visit the beginners board very often, but I've been here a couple of times in the last few day. I have seen a several posts that fall under the same basic heading: Bankroll.

To be a serious and successful player, you have to create and maintain a separate bankroll for poker. If you don't do this, you can never accurately track your progress, or lack there of. Also, creating and maintaining a bankroll will also help with many of the issues of self control. Many will already know, a bankroll of a minimum of 300 big bets is what is reccomended. Personally, I maintain a larger bankroll because I have seen 300 big bet swings more than once. If you maintain a solid bankroll, you will begin to understand it's importance, and you will learn to protect it. Protecting your bankroll can often lead to solid decision making that can save you from ruin. Remember, once the bankroll is the only thing between you and the rail.

Good luck,

Fitz

[Still the Spank E]

Hey.

The mathematics of the 300 big bets requirement suggests that one needs to play 2/4 until one is $1,800 up before looking at the 3/6 tables. Is this what I should be shooting for? Thanks.

[Fitz]

Yes, to play properly, you need a 300 big bet bankroll; that would mean $1800 before moving up to 3/6. That doesn't mean you can't take the occasional shot at a little bigger game, but use your head. I would suck to put in the hours to build a decent bankroll only to flush it in a tilted session at a higher level.

Good luck,

Fitz

[lunchmeat]

IMHO keeping a segregated bakroll is vastly overrated. It's probably good to have a 300 BB bankroll to play the higher limits, but for 2/4 and below you can make do with a lot less.

I know most will disagree with me on this, but as long as you are disciplined about how you spend, keeping your hands off a large sum of cash (your bankroll) is a major burden when living expenses are staring you in the face. I find this especially true now that I play for a living because I can use my bankroll to "invest" in other endeavors that can make me money like casino-whoring or buying and reselling items on online auctions. If I refused to use my poker bankroll for these types of things I would have a lot less gross $ than I do now.

For someone playing 2/4 and below I think a 300 BB minimum is too much because if you bust out a smaller bankroll its not too hard to replace that money from your regular income. Now if you're playing 15/30 and you lose a (let's say) 120 BB bankroll that's a different story, but most people could replace a 120 BB bankroll for 1/2 in a couple weeks.

I know most will disagree with this, so feel free to fire away.

[Stu Pidasso]

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IMHO keeping a segregated bakroll is vastly overrated. It's probably good to have a 300 BB bankroll to play the higher limits, but for 2/4 and below you can make do with a lot less.


[/ QUOTE ]

It's stressed on this beginners and small stakes forum because people on these forums are looking for magic formula's to improve their games.

Is a formal, structured bankroll a necessity? No, But it is an easy, safe way to manage the money you use to play poker. For the noobs, its the only thing they will find easy and safe about poker.

Stu

[Taxman]

[ QUOTE ]
I have seen 300 big bet swings more than once.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think if you play a tight, conservative and selectively agressive game as most beginners should (in my opinion anyway) then 300 BB is more than enough. You must really be a fan of pushing small edges if you have those kind of swings. I don't think I have the constitution to handle that. At the 3-6 games I've frequented 200 BB even, is probably just fine barring a truly horrible string of luck (which I've never experienced). I think I've only had a downswing greater than 50 BBs once (admittedly I am still fairly low on experience compared to many people including yourself no doubt). Of course, I also have alternate sources of income to pad my bankroll if necessary.

[Griswald79]

[/ QUOTE ]
It's stressed on this beginners and small stakes forum because people on these forums are looking for magic formula's to improve their games.

Don't bet into a royal flush

Stu

[/ QUOTE ]

The fact that this forum is called beginners should make all the more experienced players aware of what threads they will encounter. Some people actually do want real advise, not an easy way out. Anybody who has played this game knows that it is very difficult and will look for advice and critisicm where ever they can find it.

[Zetack]

Keeping a bankroll is a good idea if what you are planning on being is a disciplined winning player. And 300 BB per level is a good guideline. Certainly much less is getting a bit thin. If you start with the bankroll for your level and never play out of your pocket it helps you to know when you have the funds to move up levels and when to drop down and whether over time you are a winning player.

On the other hand, if you are playing for fun, don't mind going into your pocket, and can afford to keep going into your pocket at the level you are playing at, then bankroll is pretty much irrelevant.

Certainly at the micro limits most people can afford to blow off a few hundred big bets every few months and can go into their pockets to restock periodically. The reason we advise those people to follow the 300 BB rule is not for any kind of magic bullet reason, but because we assume what they want is to put in some amount of money and then play winning poker over time--playing just out of their bankroll and moving up in stakes as their growing bankroll allows...

--Zetack

[scotnt73]

[ QUOTE ]
Keeping a bankroll is a good idea if what you are planning on being is a disciplined winning player. And 300 BB per level is a good guideline. Certainly much less is getting a bit thin. If you start with the bankroll for your level and never play out of your pocket it helps you to know when you have the funds to move up levels and when to drop down and whether over time you are a winning player.

On the other hand, if you are playing for fun, don't mind going into your pocket, and can afford to keep going into your pocket at the level you are playing at, then bankroll is pretty much irrelevant.

Certainly at the micro limits most people can afford to blow off a few hundred big bets every few months and can go into their pockets to restock periodically. The reason we advise those people to follow the 300 BB rule is not for any kind of magic bullet reason, but because we assume what they want is to put in some amount of money and then play winning poker over time--playing just out of their bankroll and moving up in stakes as their growing bankroll allows...

--Zetack

[/ QUOTE ]

exactly. well put. 300 bb rule is to make sure you dont have to put YOUR money back in the game. 300 BB is the worse case scenario(although ive heard a few horror stories). obviously nobody has to follow this advise. when im bonus whoring i deposit 200-500$ into a sight and play 1/2 shorthanded until my bonus is cleared. then i move on. ive luckily never had to redeposit to clear a bonus and 90% of the time i make a nice little profit. but i do aim for 300 BB before i move up to the next level just so that i know im ready. i want to play 5/10 shorthanded. i need 3000$ to play there. when i hit 2,250$ last week i decided to take 250$ and take a shot at it. i got up 150$ before losing the 250$ last weekend. some bad beats some just being stupid. i think im ready but my bankroll is not. ill try again in a month or two when i have the full 3000$.

[Stu Pidasso]

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Some people actually do want real advise, not an easy way out. Anybody who has played this game knows that it is very difficult and will look for advice and critisicm where ever they can find it.


[/ QUOTE ]

Some people post asking for advice but are really looking for some sympathy.

If you're looking for advice on concerning bankroll management, I gave what I thought was some pretty good advice a couple of weeks ago in the "What are the best limits at Party?" thread.


Stu