Two hands, two questions

[Kluddeludde]

Hey everyone! Was hoping some of you could help me with two hands I played today. In none of the hands I have any information about the particular player/players I'm facing, so I assumed (when I was playing these hands) that they were typical players at party, limit 3/6.

Hand 1:
I get dealt the black kings UTG and raise. Everyone folds around to the SB who reraises. The BB call, I cap and both call. Flop comes

9 /images/graemlins/spade.gif 2 /images/graemlins/heart.gif 2 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

The SB bets out, BB call and I raise. Both call. The turn is the

A /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

It is checked to me and I bet, both call. The river is the

Q /images/graemlins/spade.gif

It is once again checked to me. Now, the question is, should I value bet the river?


Hand 2:
Once again I get dealt kings, this time they are of the reddish colour. UTG calls and everyone folds around to me on the button, I raise. Only UTG calls. Flop is

J /images/graemlins/spade.gif 5 /images/graemlins/heart.gif 2 /images/graemlins/heart.gif

UTG checks and I bet. He calls. The turn is the dreaded

A /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

UTG checks, I bet and he check-raises.

What is your move on the turn and the river?


Would appreciate any help you can give me on these hands. Results and possibly some follow-up questions will be posted shortly. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

Kludde

[Kluddeludde]

[J.R.]

Both depend on your reads, but I would be wary of betting the river in hand 1, as any big A and QQ beat you. Does SB 3-bet UTG raisers with JJ and TT here and call the turn when the A falls, and what about the BB, who has called the whole way- is the BB clueless or does he need some kinda hand to take this heat?

Turn check-raises tend to be the real deal. Did UTG have a history of getting out of hand and bluffing very aggressively in hand 2? I could lay this down against a lot of 3-6 players.

[Clarkmeister]

Hand 1 bet the river.

Hand 2 fold.

[Nate tha' Great]

Hand 1. I think a value bet is correct. Yes, it's supicious that you've got two callers hanging around on a board with no apparent draws, but it wouldn't shock me if they were both calling with a 9 and/or a lower pocket pair. If check-raised, I might consider a fold.

Hand 2. I'm trying to get to the point where I can lay down these hands. It's tough, man. He *could* be 3-betting with a heart draw. But check-raising a preflop raiser when an ace comes on the turn indicates a *lot* of strength, the pot is pretty small, and I think the best EV play is a fold.

[LetsRock]

I'd have to bet the river on hand 1. His flop bet was probably either a TT type hand or a big 9. My initial reaction was an A9, but he didn't come alive on the turn. There's a reasonable chance that he has 99 or QQ, but I think it's worth the chance without a better read.

Hand 2 - I love this game - I'd probably make the call and call him down on the river. Don't know that it's the "correct" move, but that's probably what I'd do. If I was going to do a bluff c/r, this is the spot. Need to see his cards. One option is to fire-back, but not one I'd make without a better read.

[mike_wzrd]

On the 2nd hand...
If I did the math right, assuming you have to call a bet on the river, you will have to pay 2BB for a pot of 7.5BBs. To be profitable, you'd have to win 1 out of 3 times in this situation. Easier call if you have a read on the player. Given that it's 3/6 and most people would have the ace in this situation, I would tend to fold with these kind of odds.

[Kluddeludde]

Hand 1:
I chickened out and checked behind them. SB showed JJ and my hand was good (didn't get to see BB's hand). I did this because the only hand I figured he would call with that I could beat was JJ. However, now in retrospect I figure a value bet was in order since he most likely was on a high pocket (given the action in the hand), and that he most likely didn't have aces (if he had, he played them very poorly). However (again), there was another player in the hand and I had absolutely no idea what he had, but I had to assume (apparently wrongly) that he had at least a decent hand.


Hand 2:
I called his turn check-raise and called him when he bet on the river (The river card was T /images/graemlins/diamond.gif). He showed K /images/graemlins/diamond.gifT /images/graemlins/club.gif, and my hand was good.

I was pretty sure that I was beaten in this hand, since there are very few people at these limits that can get this tricky and I basically called him down for future information. Lucky me. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

Kludde