15-30 AJ Hand

[Diplomatdcm]

ok party 15-30 game, two fish rest seem ok.
I have A /images/graemlins/club.gifJ /images/graemlins/club.gif in Mp folded to me I open raise,
Folded to CO who 3 bets(ok player0, folded back to me and I call
Flop is J /images/graemlins/spade.gif T /images/graemlins/diamond.gif 8 /images/graemlins/club.gif
I check he bets, I raise, he 3 bets, I call,
Turn is the K /images/graemlins/diamond.gif
I check call
River is a blank I check call
comments

[DiamondDave]

I think you can safely fold on the turn to anyone with reasonable three-betting standards.

If he has AA-TT, you're behind. If he had AK-AQ, you're behind.

Some three-bettors might have AT, AJ, 99-22, or less. But if the guy is a good player, it's not likely. Call down a habitual bluffer, but don't give any more action to a rock.

[gaylord focker]

I agree. You are behind to almost every legitimate 3 bet hand there is. I really doubt he is going to 3 bet the flop with nines or sevens and lead again on the turn when the K hits. I think it's an easy fold on the turn.

[Philuva]

I think you have an easy fold on the turn. I think at most you have somewhere bt/ 3 and 6 outs, with a lot of those scenarios leading to a split pot. When you didn't pick up help on the turn, in fact the K was the worse card you could hope for, I think you have an easy fold on the turn.

[Diplomatdcm]

yeah in retrospect is shold have been an easy fold on the flop even easier on the turn, I just wanted to make sure, thanks.

[ZeeJustin]

[ QUOTE ]
in retrospect is shold have been an easy fold on the flop

[/ QUOTE ]

I think folding this hand on the flop would be horrendous, although I do agree folding the turn is correct in light of the K /images/graemlins/diamond.gif.

[Diplomatdcm]

I am in front of exaclty two hands he could 3 bet preflop, and so when he 3 bet me on the flop, you think I am ahead enough of the time to call or I should call to try to spike a J or A?
Thanks

[DrSavage]

If you think you can fold on the flop why call preflop ? Jack high flop is pretty much the best you can hope for. After you get 3bet you're most likely behind , but have odds to spike trips or two pair , which may very well be good. When you don't improve on the turn and instead get the worst card ever (actually K is tied with Q for being the worst) it's an easy fold.

[Philuva]

Another J, an A or any club would allow you to continue past the turn. So you should definitely not fold to the flop 3-bet.

[Zele]

I definitely don't like the check-call. Either check-fold or, depending on what his pre-flop 3-betting standards are, bet and fold to a raise.

[Diplomatdcm]

Yeah I am not sure what I was thinking easy flop call, easy turn fold. I think the results just colored my analysis of the hand, he had AA and so I kept thinking about that when i re-evaluated the hand.
How would you proceed against an average player if the turn and river went blank blank? Still fold the turn or check call it down?

[DrSavage]

If the turn is a non-club blank, I think you can't go very wrong with check/folding against a player with reasonable 3 betting standards.

[gaylord focker]

You are in a little tougher situation if a blank falls on the turn. I think it just depends on your opponent. If you just sat down at the table with no knowledge of the player I would pay off the hand if it came blank on the turn blank and on the river. But there are plenty of players I would fold this hand agaist on the turn without worrying too much that I had laid down the winner.