laying down bottom set

[vector]

Party, $100, I am in BB with $640 and get 2/images/graemlins/heart.gif 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif.

MP, who seems pretty reasonable, with $249 min raises to $4, everyone but me folds, I call.

Flop: 4/images/graemlins/club.gif 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif 2/images/graemlins/diamond.gif

Hello bottom set.

I check, MP bets $5, I call.

Turn: 3 /images/graemlins/spade.gif [4/images/graemlins/club.gif 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif 2/images/graemlins/diamond.gif]

I check, MP pot bets $15, I make it $32, MP raises $234 to $249 putting himself all in.

I think.

He min raised so, 99 is definitely on the cards, so is AA which needs a 5 to complete a straight. 44 seems pretty unlikely given the min raise, but maybe. All the two pair combos seem unlikely too. A flush draw on its own seems unlikely, although a straight + flush draw with A5/images/graemlins/diamond.gif is a possibilty.

So, its AA, 99 or A5/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.

I fold, thinking I'm beat by 99.

We talk about the hand after and I claim I had 22, he acts like he is miffed I didn't pay him off with his 99, then much later says actually he had AA.

Had he flat called my reraise and let me bet out on the river I've no doubt he would have doubled through on me if he really had 99, so he played it pretty badly -if- thats what he had.

I think I am happy with this laydown, but interested what others think?

[crockpot]

if he really did have aces, this is a very poor way to play them, unless his goal was to get you to lay down a better hand, which i really doubt.

i think this fold is reasonable under the circumstances. i wouldn't talk with him about it later, though, unless i knew i could use that image against him in the future.

[1800GAMBLER]

Hey.

This is my biggest weakness in coldcalling with 'less than hands.'

Preflop you should only call if you know he raises top hands, not including 99, thus making your postflop very easy. (maybe not in this case sense he bet $4 with $250 but this should be a general rule).

So if the flop comes 9 high you have it easy. If the flop comes 9 high and you fold postflop then you made a mistake calling preflop.

[SomeName]

Doyle would probably say: If that man has a set of 999 then that man is probably going to win himself a nice pot.

[ML4L]

Hey vector,

Like crockpot said, DO NOT TELL OTHER PLAYERS ABOUT THESE TYPES OF LAYDOWNS!!!

You open yourself up to shots from players who generally are not tricky, but know that you can fold a good hand to big bet. I know your curiosity must have been killing you afterwards, but say you laid down A9 next time... /images/graemlins/grin.gif

As for the fold, there was absolutely no money in the pot and he moved a big stack in. Good for him. Let him have this one; next hand...

Incidentally, on Party, I make huge overbets like this all the time with my big hands, expecting to be called by all sorts of crap. And I am...

ML4L

[vector]

Thanks for the responses.

The talking about the cards afterwards is probably not a good idea, but then again given my tight play, usually I have the best hand when I am putting money in, and I'm not sure I'm unhappy if non-tricky players start thinking they can push me off better hands if they make huge re-raises.

Also if he really did have the set of 9s then I imagine he got quite flustered to realise he had blown it so badly, and he might try slow playing me next time he hits big and give me free cards.

[Flushed]

Hi Vector,

I agree with Doyle Brunson who would say that you should not lay down a set in that situation. Unless there is a blatant straight or flush board, or an obvious overset (if there is such a thing), laying down sets costs you money, especially against loose aggressive players like the ones who play on Party. Getting beat set over set is legitimate; no poker player will fault your play. You can MAYBE duck out of paying off if you make an excellent read LIVE but almost never on-line; overpairs and TPTK get overplayed all the time, especially heads-up.

Also, think of it this way: if you are laying down a set, one of the strongest hands you can hit on the flop, then why are you calling with 22? Are you hoping for quads? In general, you call those pre-flop raises to catch AA or KK or TPTK (AQ gone retarded) with your set; they don't expect a 2 or 4 on board to be a danger card, hence their stack goes in.

- Flushed