To call or not to call?

[frankm]

It is a small no-limit game ($1-$2 blinds). A tight player raises 12 pre-flop, player to his left makes it 24, the player to my right calls, I call on the button w/ks-js. The initial raiser goes all in for with 11 more to make his total bet 35, the guy who made it 24, now calls the 11 raise, and the guy to my left who called the 24 calls the extra 11 then prceeds to go in all in for another 41. Now there is 170 in the pot and I have 24 already invested. I know well enough that the only man other then me that inot all in won;t reraise me all in. He is up a few dollars and plays conservative. I know I am up against at least one other flush draw and either AK and a medium, to high pockett pair. KNowing all this, should I have called with this hand on the button or folded?

[ThaSaltCracka]

why are you calling here? get away from this hand, without putting anything in. Terrible call.

[ThaSaltCracka]

I should have included this before:
pokenum -h ks js - ad kh - ac tc
Holdem Hi: 1370754 enumerated boards
cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV
Ks Js 383939 28.01 974725 71.11 12090 0.88 0.284
Ad Kh 608717 44.41 704706 51.41 57331 4.18 0.464
Ac Tc 320767 23.40 999620 72.92 50367 3.67 0.252

I am simply using hands that you guessed they had, and what I think someone would go all in with.

[frankm]

well I figured the guy left who had money would call the rest of the all in raise, and he did making the pot 266. now the only guy left had about 600 in front of him and I had about 450. I knew if i hit he would pay me off and if i didn't he would check it down. So my implied odds from him were actually very high. He was holding jacks, basically what I put him on. By watching his play all night he was very obvious about the cards he had so i fiigured I was getting a chance to win at least 200 or so for 75 and if i hit my hand I would get paid off. I was looking at a pot that could top 1000 for 76 put in pre-flop. there was only 4 guys in the pot and two were all in and my opponent that could bet played his cards as if they were face up. plus I had position on him. I knew all i could draw to was a staright or a flush so I made the call cause of the implied odds I was getting from my one live opponent.

[frankm]

good guess, the other hand was jj. the ATs won the hand, he flopped two pair.

[Walter]

IMHO, your initial call was not justified, and once the raises get back to you, calling is not a good idea. With that much action, you have to figure that you may well be dominated and a lot of your straight cards are dead. With two guys all-in, you will not make money by bluffing the other player out of the pot with a scare card, so he can safely fold if one hits.

I find it hard to believe that a conservative player that you put on a pocket pair like TT or JJ is going to pay you off if a king comes, and for you to make a straight, an overcard will have to come, which will kill your action with that player, or they will hit a set, which will leave you in serious pain.

Walter