SERIOUS obsession with poker

[Dreamer101]

I am a regular poster on this forum under a different name, but I created this one because a few people who post here know who I am, and because this is a relatively personal post, I decided that I would rather not reveal my identity. If anyone has any way of working out who I am, either through technical means or by my writing style, which I am trying to change a little, I would appreciate it if they kept this to themselves. Now, to business...

I was wondering if anyone else here ever feels that they think about poker way too much. By this, I don't just mean idle day dreaming, I mean it seriously slips into the subconcious.

A lot of the time I am thinking about poker when I am fully awake, considering the play of hands or whatever, and I'm fine with this. To some degree, I even sacrifice the time I spend with my friends or the quality of my work because I am thinking about poker, but I don't do this all the time and I have control over this. Often if I will speak on the phone and read 2+2 (or RGP, because it doesn't require as much concentration /images/graemlins/tongue.gif )but I don't have a problem with this either, because of what I mentioned before, control.

It's when I begin to think about poker in other areas of my life that I can't stop which really worries me. Often, in bed, I will drift off to sleep while thinking about something to do with cards. I will then proceed to dream about poker - perhaps if I've had an argument with a friend that day and I realise I am sorry about something, I will dream that they completely outplayed me and were victorious in a complicated game that I didn't fully understand - I'm serious about this, I've had dreams that my ex-girlfriend took all my chips in omaha/8!

Also, I hope I can mention this on this board, I have come to think of poker during the build up to and point of orgasm. As I am in a moment of ecstasy, I will have a mental image of a jack falling on the river to complete my inside straight draw, winning me a monster pot. I find myself rating these experiences afterwards, I think "that was probably about two pair standard" or "wow, K-high straight flush!". This seriously concerns me, as it is something I have no control over.

I don't really know how I can express how serious this is. When I am sleepy, it's like I have a constant image of something in the back of my mind that I can't describe, or maybe it's hanging over me, and I know that it is a a 5 card hand, although I can't see it.

Because of this, I have stopped playing poker so frequently. I haven't been able to stop myself from reading/posting on the 2+2 board, but I haven't played for a few days now (if I consider this a significant length of time, this probably says something).

I'd just like to say that I'm seriously concerned about my mental state. I'm not a compulsive gambler - I have never played any games against the house in my life, I can't even bring myself to play NL or PL because of the risks involved and I have never played above the level my bankroll dictates.

If anyone has experienced this before, or knows enough about psychology and the human mind to help me, I would very much appreciate a reply.

Thanks

(After reading this post through, it almost seems like I'm scared of poker, so I'd like to make it clear that I really enjoy playing and discussing the game - although only playing at levels I have the bankroll for and can beat.)

[Howard Burroughs]

I can relate to a lot of what you say. I enjoy playing poker very much. Often when I'm far away from the table (watching a movie, eating at a restaurant, watching a ball game, having a drink at a topless bar, etc) my mind wanders to a poker hand recently played.


I don't know what it all means but I just can't seem to stop thinking about poker.


Good luck to you in your pursuit of balance in your life.

Best Wishes

Howard

[Dreamer101]

[Al Schoonmaker]

As many of you know, I defer to chesspain on issues like this. He is better trained to deal with them. If his comments disagree with mine, you should take his more seriously.

By definition, obsessions are unhealthy, even pathological. Since the time of the ancient Greeks, wise people have sought balance in their lives.

However, obsessions do serve a purpose. They enable afflicted people to perform at a much higher level than more balanced individuals. Let me quote from my work in progress, Business is a poker game, a chapter titled, "Winners are committed to success.".

"I'd bust my own grandmother if she was playing poker with me."

Jack Strauss, member of the Poker Hall of Fame.

From a mental health perspective, being normal and balanced is highly desirable, but the committed competitors get the chips. Jack Strauss' commitment helped him to become a great champion, but it probably caused other problems. Most poker champions have read and agree with Straus' sentiments. In fact, he is a "hero," not just for his success, but also for his ruthless commitment.

This quotation was chosen to make two points. First, most winners are not normal or balanced. Their desire to win is too intense and narrowly focused. They want to win so intensely that there is little time, interest, or energy, for anything else. They will make sacrifices that normal people would reject.

Second, for your entire life you have been told to be both ambitious and balanced, but the two are incompatible. You simply cannot be both normal and a winner, unless you play only with other normal people. Unless you are much more talented than your competition, if you are normal and play against committed competitors, you will lose.

End of quotation. I ask that readers do not copy or distribute my remarks since the book isn't out yet.

So the good news is that your obsession probably increases you success at poker. The bad news is that it messes up MUCH more important areas of your life.

I have often been asked why I play only for low stakes. The answer is quite simple. I am an obsessive personality. I used to work 100 hours a week. Now that I am semi-retired, I don't want to become obsessive about poker. If serious money were at stake, I would probably become obsessed with it.

You have taken the first and most important step: recognizing that your obsessino is unhealthy. I think you should take the next step: Consult someone better trained than I to help you to cope with it.

Regards,

Al

[chesspain]

Dreamer,

Like Dr. Al, I also have an obsessive personality, so it is possible that neither of us are the best individuals with respect to giving objective advice on this particular subject. /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

By defination, obsessions are irrational, unwanted, and intrusive thoughts. I would suggest, instead, that you have a very strong preoccupation with poker, although I am wondering why you find your recent thoughts and images so disturbing. Is it because they truly are interfering with your life? Or is it because you just assume that you must be "sick" to be thinking of poker during the hypnogogic stage right before sleep, and during sex (I can't believe you're the only 2+2er who experiences this /images/graemlins/blush.gif).

If it is the former, then you are on the right track by trying to limit the time you spend playing and thinking about poker. If it is the latter, I wouldn't be concerned about your mental state--at least not in comparison to most 2+2ers. Indeed, I normally become preoccupied with whatever hobby happens to catch my fancy, be it poker, chess, cooking, woodworking, etc. This is not to suggest that our preoccupations are healthy or even "normal"--rather, that your experiences are probably more common than you think.

Dr. chesspain

P.S. I did enjoy your orgasmic image of the Jack[off] falling into the river of an inside straight [vagina]. One doesn't need to be Freud to see the symbolic imagery in that one. But still, nothing to worry about. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[MRBAA]

Although I sympathize with the poster, I think this is the funniest thread I've ever read on two plus two.

[pretender2k]

I had a problem. I am quite public with this on these boards. I drank heavily ( a half a fifth of scotch or better a day). Poker replaced my drinking to a degree. I still drink just not into total blackouts and not while I am playing. There are many reasons I drank. I drank because I had an obsessive personality, heck if one is good 24 are better, I drank because I was not happy, are we ever what we think we should have been, and I drank just because it was better than dealing with most the things we all have to deal with. I also have a few personal reasons I don't feel comfortable revealing on here.

I have a couple suggestions if you really feel you have a problem. If you live in a small town like I do, go to AA (we had a girl walk in that was cutting herself and not only did we accept her we thought it was prretty brave to walk into a meeting like that with a totally outside problem) if you live in a bigger town find a gamblers anonymous meeting. You won't get a great reception in any other. From theese meetings you will either find people with problems as bad as yours or get a perspective on your problem. One thing you will find is there are a whole lot of people out there with problems and talking about them helps.

My last suggestion is to post what you are really feeling here because the people here may make funny comments but there will be a couple that have really been there. Most people do not understand what we do, they still think we gamble for a living. Only the people here know the difference.

PM me if you feel the need.

[smudgex68]

[ QUOTE ]
I have come to think of poker during the build up to and point of orgasm. As I am in a moment of ecstasy, I will have a mental image of a jack falling on the river to complete my inside straight draw, winning me a monster pot. I find myself rating these experiences afterwards, I think "that was probably about two pair standard" or "wow, K-high straight flush!"

[/ QUOTE ]

Hilarious, but also quite common I would think. I find thinking about my worst bad beats really helps me extend the duration of intercourse

[andyfox]

There have been times in my life when I'm seriously obsessed with poker. Especially when I've been running very goood or very bad. Because when doing either, I would usually be playing a lot and therefore thinking about playing a lot and reliving the triumphs or the tragedies.
I think it's natural to think about these things while lying in bed waiting to fall asleep, a common time to relive the day's events.

Thinking about it during sex, though, hasn't been something that I'v experienced. [I have, however, thought about sex while playing poker. But that's a whole 'nother story.]

I too have a compulsive personality. I'm superstitious too. I haven't played poker at all this year due to time-consuming other actitivities. I don't miss it. The more time that goes by that I don't play, the less I miss it. I find myself spending more time on the Other Topics Forum here than the Mid-,High Stakes Forum. The play of poker hands doesn't interest me. But I know once I get back and play 2 or 3 days in a row I'll be hopped up on poker. I'm not sure how good or bad this is.

Anyway, it seems to me that if you think you have a problem, you may well have it. I would suggest talking to a professional--you'll probably feel better about it talking about it out loud.

Good luck.

[Al Schoonmaker]

GA and AA have saved lots of lives and families. I also agree with the suggestion that you post feelings and actions here. A few people will take shots, but most of us do try to help.
Regards,
Al

[TheArtist]

I think that most poker players, especially winners, get this way at some point in their poker life. Poker is addicting. If you have an addicted personality, you will get
addicted to it. I am sure alot people on this board are addicted or obsess with poker in some way. I rather use the word obsess, because it
sounds healthier.

But have you noticed that the more obesss you are, the better player you become? If you are constantly thinking about the hands you played, and learn from them, you can become a good player very quickly. But the shitty thing is when poker consumer me too much, I neglect other things in my life and that make makes me to feel extremely guilty. For example, at the age of 25, I should be dating as much as possible but I don't because it takes too much time away from poker..haha...

The point is alot people are obsess with poker. But if you want to continue playing it then you can not feeling guilty about it, otherwise you will have to quit. So do whatever you can to keep your life balance, or poker has to go, and you don't want that.

TheArtist