Down 40BB in the last 2 1/2 hours

[SpaceAce]

PartyPoker $.50/$1 and $1/$2 (20BB each).

I've had really bad runs lasting a month or more but this is just mind-boggling. Three days ago I started to take a lot of beats but I was keeping my head above water. Yesterday I booked a win of about 80BB which is not unheard-of for me if I spend a whole day at the low limit tables. Then today things just exploded in my face.

Here are a few examples: In the last three hours I have lost SIX hands of two pair or better to a four-flush falling on the river (over the last three days, I lost with KK three times, AA once and QQ once to four-flushes none of which were in the suit of either of my cards). I flopped the nut flush (only the second time I've flopped a flush in two weeks) only to be beaten by a runner-runner board pair giving someone a full house. I made the nut straight twice only to be beaten by river flushes both times. I lost with KQc when two clubs came on the flop and someone with nothing but the Ace of clubs stayed for the river and, what a surprise, the fourth club came down and beat my the flush I had made on the turn.

I made Queens full of threes on a flop of Q33 only to have A2o catch AA on the turn and river to make Aces full of threes and beat my Queens full of Aces. 67o rivered two pair to beat my pocket Aces. Another hand, I had AA and the flop came down QK7; the turn is a 7 giving 74s trips. I flopped trips (not sets) three times today and lost every one (over the last three days, I flopped trips seven times and lost every one). I know trips are vulnerable, but come on... 0 for 7?

Twice today I lost to full houses I just never could have seen. One person playing 26o flopped 26Q and turned another 2 against my AQs (he cold-called three pre-flop with 26o). Another person playing 56s caught a 5 on the flop, a 6 on the turn and a 6 on the river to beat my flopped AK two pair.

Yes, I know, it's part of the game; we all take beats; skill prevails over luck; etc, etc, etc. Be that as it may, what I sucked up in the last 2+ hours is incredible. It all hit at once, one beating after the other. I was getting decent starting cards and even making some hands but EVERYTHING I made got beat. Sometimes I was beat right from the flop but it was always something weird like the 26 hand I mentioned above. I can think of exactly one hand where I was flat outplayed: someone came in with 54o (payed two bets cold to do it, too) and the flop was 544. I had 67s, playing from the big blind, and made my straight on the turn. I bet and got called by the boat. The river was a brick and the boat bet, I raised and got reraised. OK, I probably should have folded but I am not in the habit of folding straights to players who seemed weak all the way to the river. Still, I would have to say I got outplayed on that one. Other than that hand, I didn't get tricked or suckered I just got beat by anything anybody else decided to play.

Keep in mind that I played maybe 300 hands and saw the flop perhaps 1/4 of the time. These beatings (and many more I took notes on but didn't type out, here) happened in the space of about 75 hands where I played beyond getting my hole cards.

A month or so ago, I was in the middle of a crappy run that peaked with a night at the Excalibur. I posted about it on United Poker Forum and felt slightly better so I decided to vent again. What makes this worse is that I was just starting to feel good about my game, again. I was back to winning consistently, I was taking no more than my fair share of fish beatings and I was just generally content with the way things were going. Then, BAM, a few days ago I start to see a lot of people turning over junk like 39 for two pair, 22 for a rivered set, J3s for the weak flush that is still strong enough to beat my set and so on. Today it reaches its high point with 40BB pissed away in less than three hours. I am not feeling good.

If you don't want to reply at all, that's fine, but please don't make some condescending post about how 40BB is nothing and how we all have bad days and how this is just the way it is at the small limit online tables. I know that, I just wanted to get it out of my system. I'm mostly frustrated because I was getting pretty good cards (except for about a 45 minute stretch where no flop touched me at all) but practically nothing stood up. It's even worse since I was just recovering from a string of crappy cards and beats.

The only reason I don't move up to $3/$6 (where I do feel comfortable and which in the past I have noticed to be less volatile than $1/$2 and $.50/$1) is that I am trying to build my online poker roll from scratch. I started with $55, worked it to over $600 and was forced to dip into it, so I was back to $55 which I had worked back up to $444 over the course of the last week or so and now this has set me back considerably from my goal of $800 to move back into $2/$4.



OK, I feel a tiny bit better after bitching and whining for a while.



SpaceAce

[JDErickson]

Ace,
Sorry to hear about your streak. I can sympathize because I have been on the same streak for a couple days at Party. The fish are doubling or tripling their money and my bankroll steadily falls.

I'd like to ask how others are doing at 1/2 on party the last few days? I have seen lots of solid players slip down during this time period but it could be just the tables I have sat at.

I've just chalked it up to my luck and renewed my prayers to the poker gods.

Jim

[chesspain]

It's usually variance with a little bit of poor play mixed in for good measure. The other night, in thirty minutes, I earned 17BB playing first at 1/2 Party and then a Paradise 1/2. Then last night, I dropped 17BB in an hour playing with, as Gomez would call them, the entire McSucker clan.

One hand, I openraise with AKs, two coldcallers outside of the blinds, including the patriarch of the clan. Flop comes 55Ar. I bet, one call, patriarch raises, I 3-bet, he caps...turns out he coldcalled with K5o. Another time I had AQo to patriarchs's QTo...he coldcalled my PF raise, flop through turn were Q-high rags, he called bets all the way before raising me after hitting a T on the river...

I try to just chuckle, as these things just happen.

[DeuceKicker]

I feel for you. I've been in the same rut for the past few weeks. Bad cards, no draws hitting, second-best to someone holding ridiculous starting cards, and miracle suck-outs. For every winning session (usually 10BB) I've had two losing 20-30BB sessions, and my bankroll, too, has been crippled.

I noticed when WPT showed the episode with Gus Hansen (who was playing like a maniac) things loosened up noticeably; and again when Devilfish Ulliot played the same style. I know they've shown the reruns recently, maybe new people have been drawn to Party, and others have had their maniac gland stroked by the reruns.

Other than that, all I can say is 40BB is nothing and we all have bad days and this is just the way it is at the small limit online tables. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[SpaceAce]

[ QUOTE ]
Ace,
Sorry to hear about your streak. I can sympathize because I have been on the same streak for a couple days at Party. The fish are doubling or tripling their money and my bankroll steadily falls.

I'd like to ask how others are doing at 1/2 on party the last few days? I have seen lots of solid players slip down during this time period but it could be just the tables I have sat at.

I've just chalked it up to my luck and renewed my prayers to the poker gods.

Jim

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for the vote of sympathy /images/graemlins/smile.gif I'm sorry to hear that you've been catching it, too. I know we all have to put up with it at times but no matter how often I repeat that to myself it just doesn't make me feel better while it's happening.

I am also curious as to how others have been doing of late.

SpaceAce

[SpaceAce]

[ QUOTE ]
It's usually variance with a little bit of poor play mixed in for good measure. The other night, in thirty minutes, I earned 17BB playing first at 1/2 Party and then a Paradise 1/2. Then last night, I dropped 17BB in an hour playing with, as Gomez would call them, the entire McSucker clan.

One hand, I openraise with AKs, two coldcallers outside of the blinds, including the patriarch of the clan. Flop comes 55Ar. I bet, one call, patriarch raises, I 3-bet, he caps...turns out he coldcalled with K5o. Another time I had AQo to patriarchs's QTo...he coldcalled my PF raise, flop through turn were Q-high rags, he called bets all the way before raising me after hitting a T on the river...

I try to just chuckle, as these things just happen.



[/ QUOTE ]

You're right, they do happen and I can shrug them off or chuckle them away when they come one or two at a time. It's the sudden avalanche of bogusness that bothers me. We can all step on a single fire ant but 500,000 of them at once is more than you can handle.

SpaceAce

[SpaceAce]

[ QUOTE ]

Other than that, all I can say is 40BB is nothing and we all have bad days and this is just the way it is at the small limit online tables. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Grr, it's a good thing you smiled when you said that, mister /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Of course, the individual limit player trying to emulate Gus or Devilfish is not a danger. It's sitting at a table with eight of them that causes problems. Yes, you can outplay each one individually but if four of them are at the turn with you, you're likely to be in trouble.

I wasn't really getting chased down by groups of idiots, today. It just seemed that no matter who was in the pot with me and no matter what cards they started with, I was beaten. It's a depressing feeling to get your made hands cracked again and again. Getting poor starting cards sucks but canbe overcome with patience. There's not much you can do when you flop sets three times out of ten pocket pairs only to be beaten every time. What makes it worse is you know that in the end your cards will balance out so after your rush of good cards is through getting beat, you're probably going to have to sit through the period where you don't see AK for hundreds of hands at a time, you don't hit any sets and you don't make your open-ended straights.

SpaceAce

[Nutz&Boltz]

JD, I saw a fish win 55 BB at a 1-2 party table in an hour yesterday. During the same period I lost 25 BB. Whenever I have a streak like this I call it the perfect storm. Two things happening simultaniously. I am being drawn out on and I am missing my draws. From what I read on this sight, these kind of things happen and should be expected. Eventually, the sharks eat the guppies. I just hope there are no Japenese fishermen at the table.

[bisonbison]

You just have to repeat to yourself:

If the fish can't win, the fish won't play.
If the fish can't win, the fish won't play.

Then punch a wall and do some laundry.

[SpaceAce]

[ QUOTE ]
You just have to repeat to yourself:

If the fish can't win, the fish won't play.
If the fish can't win, the fish won't play.

Then punch a wall and do some laundry.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm looking to punch something about now. It's just getting worse and worse. I'm down almost $100 today from micro limit games. The crap that's happening to me is right out of some poker horror movie. Two pair? No good because I am going to call you down to the river and spike my third four. Or, maybe I'll pay two bets on the flop and another on the turn for my inside straight draw, which I _will_ hit. KK? Not gonna fly, I've got K10o and there WILL be two more tens on the board. QQ? Useless against the four flush I'll be getting to go with my six of clubs. AKs? Don't make me laugh. Everyone knows my J9o will destroy that garbage hand. You hit your set? Oooh, tough luck, I'm planning to get a runner-runner straight. Top pair? That's nice. I've got J2o and I'm sure not getting our after I paired my deuce on the flop. Would you look at that! A Jack on the river. Lucky me. The nut straight, you say? That's a pretty good hand but watch this backdoor flush I'm about to make.

And so on.

SpaceAce

[Homer]

Every solid poker player goes through losing streaks such as yours, and quite often at that (a loss of >=40 BB's will occur ~1/50 times you play for 2.5 hrs online). If you are going to improve you will have to learn how to take losing streaks like this in stride, without feeling the need to post about it on 2+2 to vent and/or to gain sympathy from others. You must accept the fact that all you can control is the quality of your play. You must learn to focus on making proper decisions at the table, and let the wins and losses fall where they may. If you are able to do this, you will have nothing to vent about. If you happen to have a losing session, you can hold your head high with the knowledge that you have played to the best of your abilities, and have maximized your expected win for that session (and yes, sometimes your expected win will be negative if the distribution of cards you receive is poor). However, if you continuously worry about how much you are up or down, your quality of play will be affected and you will no longer be playing at your optimal level.

I believe that many players do not truly understand the fluctuations involved in the game of poker, even though they may claim to. Yesterday, I created a post in the Small Stakes forum entitled "Streaks", with some simulation results for a winning player. I displayed charts for "BB's won versus time" for 10,000 hrs, 1000 hrs, and 100 hrs. I think it might do you some good to take a look at that thread. It may help you to more greatly understand the swings involved in the game, and to understand that this -40 BB, 2.5 hr session means almost nothing in the long run, provided you don't let it affect your play.

-- Good luck, Homer

[Homer]

Stop playing, right now. The fact that you are posting about your losses while still playing shows that you are not concentrating fully on what you should be.

-- Homer

[Webster]

Now wait a minute - 1st you say you can win 80BB in one day of play - lets say that day is 10 hours long which means you are winning WAY WAY to many hands even for an expert player.

My personal opinion?

Because you are winning SO much you are now either playing outside the box or the hands you were winning are now slapping you in the face because they were wrong in the 1st place.

Are you playing the same hands you played when you were winning? It sounds like you style of play is loose and aggressive (8BB or more per hour is certainly loose aggressive)

You are playing micro - crap like that happens - you should know that! If you are making 80BBs in a day I'm sure you had a few lucky good beats in there!

[MicroBob]

when i lost 125BB's in a week a few weeks ago i would always tend to remember my good lay-downs where i saved myself some bets or my other decent plays where i maximize my win.

there were several situations where i was probably beat and smartly laid down top pair, etc etc. obviously, there are hands that you have to call all the way down because the chances of this idiot playing an 83 for a full-house are ridiculous....but otherwise, an expert player i think will recognize some of his better plays and realize that there are many players who would have lost at least 5 BB's more in that session just by tilting or chasing losers.

heck, there are even lay-downs i've made where i would have won the hand but i pat myself on the back for not chasing a ridiculous play.

btw, homer has become my favorite poster on these forums. i am definately going to check out his streaks-post on the SS forum and everyone else should also.

thankfully youre playing micro-limit and the losses aren't THAT huge. but yes indeed, when negative SD decides to come-a-knockin' there can sometimes be no escape other than to play it out and wait for it turn back around. whatever you do, just keep playing the best poker you can.

[DrewOnTilt]

SpaceAce I feel your pain - am a newbie and learning at the PP $0.50 tables. The suckouts are a-plenty. I made a post very similar to yours a few days ago on the Internet boards. You might want to search for it and go read some of the replies. I got some good pointers from some of the replies.

At that point, I was down 150 BB. After listening to some of the advice, I have started to turn things around and am now down only 90 BB. So things are looking up.

Good luck to you, man.

DOT

[SpaceAce]

Homer,

Sorry, but I don't agree that it's a flaw to feel better by venting. If you've got ice in your veins, great. I feel a little better after bitching about it. I don't care one way or the other if anyone wants to offer sympathy but I don't mind supportive posts. If you look in the original message, I invited people not to reply. The catharsis is in the writing. I almost didn't even hit the submit button but I decided since I took the time to write it I might as well complete the action.

SpaceAce

[SpaceAce]

[ QUOTE ]
Stop playing, right now. The fact that you are posting about your losses while still playing shows that you are not concentrating fully on what you should be.

-- Homer

[/ QUOTE ]

My posts were actually made just after the end of two seperate sessions. One of the replies might have been made during play but I don't remember.

SpaceAce

[SpaceAce]

[ QUOTE ]
Now wait a minute - 1st you say you can win 80BB in one day of play - lets say that day is 10 hours long which means you are winning WAY WAY to many hands even for an expert player.

My personal opinion?

Because you are winning SO much you are now either playing outside the box or the hands you were winning are now slapping you in the face because they were wrong in the 1st place.

Are you playing the same hands you played when you were winning? It sounds like you style of play is loose and aggressive (8BB or more per hour is certainly loose aggressive)

You are playing micro - crap like that happens - you should know that! If you are making 80BBs in a day I'm sure you had a few lucky good beats in there!



[/ QUOTE ]

I anticipated a reply like this. I know that 80BB is a lot but I said it is not unheard-of, I didn't say it was the norm or that I expected to do that every day. I have played a lot of hours at PartyPoker in the last year or two (with a long hiatus in the middle) and I have a reasonable idea of what I can expect. If I spend a whole day playing two tables at PartyPoker, 40-50BB is the norm. The "8BB" that you mentioned is across two tables, I am not smashing any single table for 6-8BB/hour.

As for my being loose and aggressive, I am certainly aggressive but I do not believe I am loose by any stretch of the imagination. My starting requirements are actually a bit tighter for low limit holdem than those discussed in Winning Low Limit Hold'Em and some other publications. I have made quite a few posts since I started participating here and If you see something in them that looks loose, I'd love to hear about it because I am always interested in improving my play. Glancing at my notes, I can say that over the last couple of weeks, I have folded AA, KK and QQ more than once each (post-flop of course, I'm not quite tight enough to dump Kings without at least seeing a flop). I've also laid down four straights (two ignorant), one set and several trips. In all but two cases, my reads were correct. I'm still kicking myself over the Kings I laid down that turned out to be good.

You're right that I had a couple of good beats in winning that 80BB but they certainly didn't come as thick or fast as the bad ones.

You're also right about this crap happening at micro limits but I havenever taken such a concentrated beating. Playing two tables actually seems to keep my variance down and to have two tables go so bad for nearly two days was a killer.

I knew some people would misinterpret my post. I am not complaining that Aces never win, I am not moaning that I should start playing crap cards, etc. I don't see how people can
believe that if you squash it down and pretend you don't feel it (bullshit, bullshit) you're doing the right thing but if you type it out and post it, it must be affecting your game. That's baloney. I've only posted one other time (on another forum) about taking some hits and in that post I stated that he beats were effecting my play and that I quit playing for a while. This time I do not believe my play was effected so I kept playing until I felt that I couldn't keep playing my best game, then I quit.

It's very simple: typing it out made me feel better. There's no deeper meaning than that. Some players breathe deep, some imagine beautiful fields and some probably fantasize about setting fire to the person who put the beat on them. I typed a bitchy letter. As I noted in an earlier post, I almost didn't even hit the submit button to post it but since I had already typed it all out, I went ahead with it. I figure it won't hurt anyone /images/graemlins/smile.gif

SpaceAce

[SpaceAce]

[ QUOTE ]
when i lost 125BB's in a week a few weeks ago i would always tend to remember my good lay-downs where i saved myself some bets or my other decent plays where i maximize my win.

there were several situations where i was probably beat and smartly laid down top pair, etc etc. obviously, there are hands that you have to call all the way down because the chances of this idiot playing an 83 for a full-house are ridiculous....but otherwise, an expert player i think will recognize some of his better plays and realize that there are many players who would have lost at least 5 BB's more in that session just by tilting or chasing losers.

heck, there are even lay-downs i've made where i would have won the hand but i pat myself on the back for not chasing a ridiculous play.

btw, homer has become my favorite poster on these forums. i am definately going to check out his streaks-post on the SS forum and everyone else should also.

thankfully youre playing micro-limit and the losses aren't THAT huge. but yes indeed, when negative SD decides to come-a-knockin' there can sometimes be no escape other than to play it out and wait for it turn back around. whatever you do, just keep playing the best poker you can.

[/ QUOTE ]

I know exactly what you mean about good laydowns. I have no problem releasing almost any hand once I believe it's beat. As I mentioned in the post above, I have no problem laying down big pairs or trips or straights. In fact, just about the only time I have a real problem laying something down is when I simply cannot see the beat coming like when someone pairs a six on the flop and then hits their 9 on the river. I simply can't release top pair to something ridiculous like that because I can never see how they have me beat so more often than not I end up paying off the one bet they raise me.

Sometimes when I win a nice pot, I'll pump an arm and give an, "Alright!" I do the exact same thing when I make a big laydown that turns out to be correct. I don't feel bad when my miracle cards hits after I make a laydown. As far as I'm concerned, that laydown was still correct if I was behind and didn't have the odds to chase the card. I don't feel so good when I make a laydown that turns out to be wrong in the sense that I was ahead and likely to stay that way when I made it.

I am going to try and continue playing my best poker. I just hope the turnaround comes sooner rather than later because right now I can't hit a flop to save my life.

SpaceAce

[Dylan Wade]

I genuinely find the best way to PLAY POKEr is to root for your opponents. I play primarily B&M. I'm usually rooting for most of the players at the table except for one or two annoying people.

Of course, I still give everyone my most ruthless game. I'm not that jaded.

I look at it like we're on a team to beat the annoying players at the table. That way when I lose, it's really no big deal. The only time I start caring about those losses is if my entire bankroll is low....but I probably shouldn't be playing if that is the case.

[toby]

the best thing to do, i think Homer J said it, is to stop. When i hit a bad streak, man it just keeps going. I need to work on that(knowing when to quit). But anyway go to the gym or something, exercise off your frustration, and hit the cards tomorrow. that tends to work for me.

good luck spaceace.

-Toby

[Webster]

SpaceAce - 2 tables - sorry! I didn't consider that a person playing 2 tables would need to vent. IF you are playing 2 tables perhaps it is time to play ONE table until you get off the schnide - then go back to 2.

[Homer]

Sorry, but I don't agree that it's a flaw to feel better by venting.

In poker, it is. The fact that you need to vent after a big loss indicates that you have trouble handling losing streaks. In order to reach your full potential, you must learn to not let these streaks bother you. If you're stressing about being down then you're not concentrating on what's important, your decisions at the table.

If you've got ice in your veins, great.

When I first started playing, my stomach was in knots after every "bad beat". Now I've reached the point where not too much affects me. Hopefully, I'll eventually reach a point at which I do have ice water running through my veins, a point where nothing bothers me.

I don't care one way or the other if anyone wants to offer sympathy but I don't mind supportive posts.

I'm not sure what you're getting at. My post was intended to offer support, and I should hope you took it that way. It just wasn't support like "Oh, I've been there too, I feel bad for you, blah blah blah", which does nothing for you.

If you look in the original message, I invited people not to reply. The catharsis is in the writing. I almost didn't even hit the submit button but I decided since I took the time to write it I might as well complete the action.

It makes no sense to post something if you don't want people to reply. If that's the case, write in a journal/diary.

-- Homer

[Homer]

Playing two tables actually seems to keep my variance down and to have two tables go so bad for nearly two days was a killer.

The more tables you play, the greater your variance will be. Your EV will be higher, but so will your swings.

I don't see how people can believe that if you squash it down and pretend you don't feel it (bullshit, bullshit) you're doing the right thing but if you type it out and post it, it must be affecting your game.

Who told you to pretend you don't feel anything? What I said was that to advance your game to the next level you must train yourself not to feel anything. It's not about pretending to be calm/neutral/zen/whatever, it's about actually reaching that state of mind.

You're coming across as someone who feels that his/her game is sound and does want advice. But the fact is, it is abundantly clear to anyone reading that you are having issues with tilt. If you felt the need to vent after a rather routine losing session, it was almost certainly was affecting your play, whether you realized it or not.

-- Homer

[verndogs]

[ QUOTE ]
You just have to repeat to yourself:

If the fish can't win, the fish won't play.
If the fish can't win, the fish won't play.

Then punch a wall and do some laundry.

[/ QUOTE ]

That has to be the greatest piece of general poker advice I've ever heard

[lil']

Ah yes, the old "vent post." Every once in a while we get one. Homer is right. In time, you won't feel the need to vent anymore. You have to get used to it and not focus so much on it.

I lost 33 BB the other night. The next day I came back and won 20 of it right back. Big deal. And I'll get the rest of it back and then some soon, you can count on that.

I think that's a much better attitude to have than to complain.

Good luck to you. If you know what you are doing, you'll get it back soon.

[rayrns]

Well you weren't sitting at my table or a few others that posted here. I also dropped 25BB per table on two tables. My only hope is that the same players will return when I get ready to play again today. It has been only the second losing session at Party. And while that is good, it is just the opposite on Stars where I haven't posted a winning session at $1/2 this MONTH. It'll come back, if you don't doubt your play and are playing correct. Just make sure you are feeling good about playing before you sit down for your next session and the next etc. Good luck as long as your not at my table.

[Mike Gallo]

Homer,

Very well said.

[SpaceAce]

[ QUOTE ]
I genuinely find the best way to PLAY POKEr is to root for your opponents. I play primarily B&M. I'm usually rooting for most of the players at the table except for one or two annoying people.

Of course, I still give everyone my most ruthless game. I'm not that jaded.

I look at it like we're on a team to beat the annoying players at the table. That way when I lose, it's really no big deal. The only time I start caring about those losses is if my entire bankroll is low....but I probably shouldn't be playing if that is the case.




[/ QUOTE ]

Haha, that's a unique perspective. I like it /images/graemlins/smile.gif Pick a couple of people to hate and hammer them to mush.

SpaceAce

[SpaceAce]

[ QUOTE ]
the best thing to do, i think Homer J said it, is to stop. When i hit a bad streak, man it just keeps going. I need to work on that(knowing when to quit). But anyway go to the gym or something, exercise off your frustration, and hit the cards tomorrow. that tends to work for me.

good luck spaceace.

-Toby

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks, Toby. It's funny that you mentioned the gym because I almost wrote that I was going to go to the gym to take out some of my frustrations. Problem is, the gym at my apartment complex doesn't have any free weights and it's just not the same on a machine /images/graemlins/smile.gif I should join one of those 24 hour Fitness places I see around here.

SpaceAce

[SpaceAce]

[ QUOTE ]
SpaceAce - 2 tables - sorry! I didn't consider that a person playing 2 tables would need to vent. IF you are playing 2 tables perhaps it is time to play ONE table until you get off the schnide - then go back to 2.


[/ QUOTE ]

I have actually already gone back to one table. Playing two or more tables has always been a breeze for me and getting twice as many hands per hour tends to lessen my swings because I get a larger sample of cards. Especially over the course of a couple hundred hours.

SpaceAce

[SpaceAce]

[ QUOTE ]
In poker, it is. The fact that you need to vent after a big loss indicates that you have trouble handling losing streaks.

[/ QUOTE ]

This doesn't make any sense to me. First of all, I wouldn't call it a need. I have taken tens of thousands of crappy beats and suffered many pretty severe streaks. I've posted complained about it exactly twice, both in in the last month or so because the garbage was so concentrated. Also, how is writing about it not "handling" it but ignoring it is? That's silly. You ignore it, I write something about it. When I'm through, I get on with my playing feeling fine.


[ QUOTE ]
When I first started playing, my stomach was in knots after every "bad beat". Now I've reached the point where not too much affects me. Hopefully, I'll eventually reach a point at which I do have ice water running through my veins, a point where nothing bothers me.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't feel knots or butterflies but I am not immune to annoyance.

[ QUOTE ]
I'm not sure what you're getting at. My post was intended to offer support, and I should hope you took it that way. It just wasn't support like "Oh, I've been there too, I feel bad for you, blah blah blah", which does nothing for you.

[/ QUOTE ]

What I meant was that you were saying it was somehow a flaw to "need" to get sympathy or condolences. I am saying that I don't need them. I don't mind if no one chooses to reply but I appreciate the fact that the people who do are making an effort to lend support. There was no deeper meaning and I wasn't implying that your post should have been more coddling.

[ QUOTE ]
It makes no sense to post something if you don't want people to reply. If that's the case, write in a journal/diary.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't keep a journal or diary because I almost never bother to record anything except my poker notes. As mentioned above, this is only the second post I've ever made regarding annoying times I've suffered at the tables.

SpaceAce

[SpaceAce]

[ QUOTE ]
The more tables you play, the greater your variance will be. Your EV will be higher, but so will your swings.

[/ QUOTE ]

I am not sure I understand this. Variance is larger in short time periods. In any single day I might suffer a larger variance from two tables but in the course of 500 hours of two-table play I have seen as many hands as 1,000 hours of single-table play.

[ QUOTE ]
Who told you to pretend you don't feel anything? What I said was that to advance your game to the next level you must train yourself not to feel anything. It's not about pretending to be calm/neutral/zen/whatever, it's about actually reaching that state of mind.

[/ QUOTE ]

I won't try to argue with you on this but I believe the only people with zero emotional response are Vulcans and sociopaths.

[ QUOTE ]
You're coming across as someone who feels that his/her game is sound and does want advice. But the fact is, it is abundantly clear to anyone reading that you are having issues with tilt. If you felt the need to vent after a rather routine losing session, it was almost certainly was affecting your play, whether you realized it or not.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's not true at all. I am glad to accept advice on play. I don't think you really offered any advice on my play except to say, "stop," which I had already done. You keep using the word "need" in regards to my post but I think you are overstating my emotional response to the situation. I didn't "need" to do it, I felt likt it. It isn't something I do regularly. I don't have a "need" to eat buttered toast or watch movies, either, but I do both on occasion. I doubt you have a "need" to reply to my posts but you do so. It isn't like I was steaming and slamming money into pots and then racing to the message boards to rant about it. I was done playing and decided to share my annoyance with the outcome.


SpaceAce

[SpaceAce]

[ QUOTE ]
Good luck to you. If you know what you are doing, you'll get it back soon.

[/ QUOTE ]

I've already gotten most of it back. I never doubted I would. I am also not new to poker or competetive sports. This isn't some phase I am going through where I have to have tantrums when things don't go my way. I had just finished playing and my mind was racing back over a lot of the hands. I came here to browse and posted on a whim.

SpaceAce

[SpaceAce]

[ QUOTE ]
Well you weren't sitting at my table or a few others that posted here. I also dropped 25BB per table on two tables. My only hope is that the same players will return when I get ready to play again today. It has been only the second losing session at Party. And while that is good, it is just the opposite on Stars where I haven't posted a winning session at $1/2 this MONTH. It'll come back, if you don't doubt your play and are playing correct. Just make sure you are feeling good about playing before you sit down for your next session and the next etc. Good luck as long as your not at my table.

[/ QUOTE ]

Feeling better isn't really the problem. I don't usually feel much one way or the other until the session is over (except for an occasional "alright" when I do something right or a "grrr" when I catch myself making a blunder) and I have definitely lost. That's when annoyance sometimes sets in. Until that point, I always believe I will still come out a winner. When I totally lose my buyin on two tables, though, I generally quit unless the game seems extra juicy. With the fish-level at the tables, those games could have been pretty juicy but I decided not to play any more until later because I was afraid I would start playing too many hands if my premium starters and good made hands kept getting beaten.

SpaceAce

[tpir90036]

good post.

i know for me personally, it would have nothing to do with venting or sympathy. rather it's the fear that a losing streak could mean that i am not a winning player.

for me, still being break-even for 2,000 hands is slightly worrisome. yes, i know that 2,000 hands is not a lot...but it isn't a little either.

[Homer]

I don't think you really offered any advice on my play except to say, "stop," which I had already done.

I'd like to think I've given you more to think about than that. If I didn't, I guess I've failed.

-- Homer