Can't bluff BigEndian on the Button

[WDC]

3-6 at True Poker; typical passive table except that BIgEndian is there. I pick the seat directly to his left.

I ahve KQ or hearts in the small blind

three limpers including Big on the button; I raise; BB folds, two call; Big re-raises; I cap; everyone still in calls.

Q: Was my cap correct?

flop is 5-6-7 two diamond one heart. I bet, two callers, Big raises, I call, other two call.

Q: should I have folded right there?

turn brings an 8, i' dont rember the suit, but it was not a heart.

I check, checked to Big who bets, I check raise, only big calls.

Q: How stupid was that?

River is a blank and I have to take a stab so I bet. Big calls.

Obviously big wins but what did he have?


and how dumb was I?

Results and my though process in the following post.

[WDC]

Big's got pocket K's.

Preflop- I tyhough Big would re-raise a drawing hand here and not a big made hand. The table was so passive that I did'nt think he would fail to raise a nmade hand on the button. I wanted to represent a made hand with my cap.

My bet on the flop was supposed to figure out who was drawing. When Big raised , i was still fixated on a drawing hand that I could make him let go if the turn did'nt help.

My turn and river play was just a continuation of trying to get him to let go of what I though was AK or worse.

I got stuck on thinking that he would'nt have limped in on the button with a made hand. Sometimes I just can't seem to think past my initial reads.

Good hand Big and good read on me.

[ElSapo]

He limped on the button with Kings?

[WDC]

Yep.

[BigEndian]

I wish I could remember this hand so I might know what I was thinking limping with KK. Maybe the table was fold-o-matic for a while?

Q1: I would not have capped in your position. My limp-reraise, at best, tells you I have a small pair. Or I could have a hand that dominates yours. Or I could have made big pair. Bottom line is you know you are drawing and there are a lot of players in this hand.

Q2: I think you call and have to believe you are behind, but the pot is too large to fold.

Q3: I wouldn't say it was stupid, it was probably your only chance to win the hand. Especially since you know I'm capable of laying down a big hand. Unfortunately, this board is about as un-scary as they come for a turn check-raise from a PF raisor.

I would have checked the river. It's unlikely I bet after being check-raised. But I clearly have a hand by now and it should be obvious that it's a big pair and I'm not buying what you're selling.

- Jim

[chesspain]

While I wouldn't have put Big on KK, I assumed before I read the results that he had a highish pair, and raised in order to tie people to the pot in the event that he hit his set.

After whiffing on the flop, I would definately have let it go after Big's raise, since:

1) You have nothing on a scary flop,
2) You are out of position,
3) You can't even beat A-high.

Save your chips for another hand.

[Brian]

Hi WDC,

I would not have capped pre-Flop, especially against a 2+2'er. While limp-reraising from the Button is an extremely odd play, unless he is tilting, theres a pretty decent chance that he has you beat. Call and hope for a Straight or Flush Flop.

I have no idea why you are betting into this Flop. The board is extremely coordinated, and theres a fair chance that you may be raised. I would check and call the Flop. This is a situation where you are only takine one off because of the backdoor Flush. If you didn't have that, it would be check and fold time.

The Turn check-raise is abysmal. You can't even beat Ace high, as others have mentioned, and BigEndian obviously likes his hand.

The River bet is pretty awful too. Sure, it only has to work once every once every 16 or so times to be profitable, but I don't think BigEndian would fold even Ace high here, assuming that is what he has. If he's maniacal enough to play Ace high that way, then he's not folding the River. But odds are he has something better.

-Brian

[CrackerZack]

you shut out everyone else's money on the turn. Other than that, fine.

[CrackerZack]

Am I missing something or is everyone else? Why would he ever fold the 2nd nut flush draw before he misses on the river? As for the PF cap, I like it. As for limping with KK after 2 limpers, I don't. Bad Endian. tsk tsk. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Brian]

Hi Zack,

He has K /images/graemlins/heart.gif Q /images/graemlins/heart.gif, and the Flop was /images/graemlins/diamond.gif /images/graemlins/diamond.gif /images/graemlins/heart.gif. Turn wasn't a Heart either.

-Brian

[WDC]

I didn'y have a damm thing, I was just trying to get Big to lay down AK.

[WDC]

Big,

I gotta tell you, your limp reraising with a pair really did'nt cross my mind. You had been using your position well and I really thought that you would have raised any legitimate pair on the button. I really was sure that your limp reraise after those two cold callers was trying to put up the pot on a huge drawing hand. the problem was I couldn't put you on a pair at all.

I think you raise any pair above 10's on the button. I gotta figure that my raise out of small blind means at least big cards to you and possibly very big cards. I was really trying to rely on the fact that hardly anyone raises preflop on true without a big hand.

My problem is that I got married to my read and did not re-evaluate it during the play. I think that my course of play would have gotten you to fold AK or another non-made hand, except a diamond flush draw, on the turn.

[rkiray]

I've only read the first post in this thread. Hope I'm not redundant.

Did BE know who you were (2+2er?)

I would not cap the preflop

The pot is way too big to fold for a single bet on the flop.

I agree the cr was stupid.

[rkiray]

[ QUOTE ]
Preflop- I tyhough Big would re-raise a drawing hand here and not a big made hand

[/ QUOTE ]

Can you explain this statement. It makes no sense to me.

[CrackerZack]

You're right, and i was missing something. I'm too hungover today. I need a 4-color deck. Think the Borgata will mind if I request one?

[WDC]

It was just that I didn't think that he would limp on the button with a big pair. But once I raise and the two limpers come along it would seem wothwhile to raise a big suited connector. It doesn't, in my opinion, make sense to reraise a small or medium pair. I may have three bet AK thru QJ suited in his position.