Friggin' 2-2 in the Big Blind

[andyfox]

Three limpers, small blind calls, and I look to see my first card is a deuce. I knuckle half-blind (my favorite condition). I wanted to fold, but if not raising 3 limpers with A-Ks is a crime against humanity, folding in the big blind when there hasn't been a raise must certainly be a felony of cosmic proportions. So I agree to see the flop.

Which is 2-5-7 rainbow. Small blind checks and I bring myself to look at my second card. Another friggin' deuce. This gives me a grand total of three of them, two in my hand plus the one in the bush. I bet. Everyone calls.

Turn is a rainbow-completing 4. It doesn't feel good. My LHO leans back just slightly. I don't like it. Stubborn cuss that I am, I bet anyway. Right on cue, LHO raises. Before he can get the chips out of his hand, his LHO 3-bets. Before he can get the chips out his hand, his LHO cold-calls. Helluva turn card, that 4. Small blind, mercifully, folds.

Should I:

1) Look at my opponents and ask them, "Are you serious?"

2) Cap it and pray for the case friggin' deuce on the river?

3) Take up chess and ballroom dancing?

4) None of the above?

5) All of the above?

[rory]

You are usually the person who's posts I would be looking to to answer what should be done in this situation! In the heat of battle I would cap and hope for the case 2-- allowing myself a few minutes of thought makes me think I should throw my 2s away, then go home and go through my decks and throw all of the 2s away, then take up chess. I think this is a good spot for you to preen your poker feathers by dumping a set!

-rory

[Manzanita]

Andy,

There are a number of hands that your opponents could have considering the action so far -- a straight, a bigger set, or two-pair. At this point I would just call the 2 bets cold.

If you improve on the river then I would bet right out; otherwise, I would just passively call.

-- Manzanita

[slavic]

1) Look at my opponents and ask them, "Are you serious?"

Since I believe this response has been copy protected by a former opponent of mine, I have some new material for you.

- "Gawd your sexy."
- "I see ya eyeballing me like a pork chop."
- "Ah shucks I was just kidding, you know friendly like."
- "Can someone please help me raise here, I'm shaking too much to move?"
- "I'm Bonafide!"

[Depraved]

Don't know how bad/loose your opponents were, but if they were reasonable, I'd be worried about a slowplayed set higher than deuces. If they weren't so hot, calling sounds good - capping may be a losing play.

Filling up presents a whole other set of problems - assuming you're not up against another set, it would appears as though two pair is out there somewhere, greatly limiting your outs...

Actually, if you're up against a straight, and at least two pair, you're not even getting the right pot-odds + implied-odds to improve your hand, so folding would seem correct.

[nykenny]

wow, u got urself into some situation here! well depending how weak ur opponents are:

if the raiser and reraiser are very weak, i'd be scared and might fold.

if the raiser and reraiser are very aggressive, i'd call.

but i don't know, folding is a tough one.

Kenny

[Mackie]

Stand up in your chair and do a rain dance. Ask the raiser if he chops post flop. Ask the dealer for new cards.

I'd call.

[Ed Miller]

Sounds like it's time for a deck change.

[Gabe]

If you figure the only hands they could have are A3s, 77, 55 or 44, you have a fold. If one or both of them could have two pair or be semi-bluffing with 66, you have a drink.

[Gabe]

You can only get them once a hour on the hour. He'll have to do with a big scramble.

[andyfox]

I got a brainlock and called. LHO capped and we all called. River was a face card. I checked. LHO bet and his LHO raised. His LHO called part of the bet all-in and I folded. LHO called and both he and his LHO showed A-3s. All-in player disgustedly showed pocket 4s. So I was running out of the money in a four horse race. With one out. Nicely done.

I should have folded. With three opponents, odds are someone had a bigger set which meant I was drawing to one out. Unlikely anyone would have two pair with that board. I had bet twice into a big field, yet now somebody raised somebody who had raised me. And it would not have been unsual for someone to have slowplayed a set since I had led out on the flop and they may well have been waiting to pop it right behind my expected turn bet.

From now on, I'm folding after looking at one deuce, no exceptions. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[cero_z]

Hi andy,
[ QUOTE ]
...my first card is a deuce. I knuckle half-blind (my favorite condition).

[/ QUOTE ]
Why are you still doing this? I think the monotony has set in a little too much for you, if you can't wait for both cards to act. This lets your good opponents eliminate quite a few possible hands. Not a huge leak by any means, but just so easy to plug. I take it all back if you keep the fact that you're "half-blind" totally secret.

[SoBeDude]

or in my local game, when someone 3-bets, he'll look at you and say "its a friendly $60".

-Scott

[SoBeDude]

There are a number of hands that your opponents could have considering the action so far -- a straight, a bigger set, or two-pair. At this point I would just call the 2 bets cold.

There is no way calling here could be right.

You need to consider what hands your opponents are raising and calling with. This means you are behind and all but one of your outs are gone. You are up against a bigger set here most of the time. This means your only out is the case 2. You surely don't have pot odds to make this call.

-Scott

[andyfox]

OK, I promise to pretend to look at the 2nd card from now on before acting.

I note that in Killer Poker, the author claims you're giving away a big tell by folding without looking at your second card, notifying all observant players that you're only playing with big cards. And then he recommends only playing with big cards.

[Diplomat]

Hi cero_z,

I think the vast majority of players will not pick up on this tell. Most of them are too busy looking at their own cards and trying to figure out what to do next, not spot a pre-deal tell from some d00d. I think you would want to stay away from people who might pick up on this tell anyway.

Moreover, if it is done somewhat descretely, almost no tell to speak of exists.

-Diplomat

[mrbaseball]

[ QUOTE ]
I promise to pretend to look at the 2nd card from now on before acting

[/ QUOTE ]

I only get to play live poker a couple of times a year on my trips to LV. But I have never ever looked at one of my cards before I got both of them.

Is looking at them one at a time a standard practice or do most folks generally wait until they have them both?

[andyfox]

I agree completely.

And of course I called.

[andyfox]

I only look at one before I receive the other UTG.

But even when I look at both cards at the "same" time, I look at the front one and kind of squeeze out the next one, so I really only see one at a time anyway.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
I think the vast majority of players will not pick up on this tell.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree. Every now and then I'll play my hand w/out looking at it. You know the kind of situation I'm talking about. Only once ever has someone said (after everyone folds as expected to a turn bet) "Hey, Ulysses - did you look at your cards?"

[elysium]

hi andy
i don't like this one. the problem is that it's one of your games. each one of these opponents would possibly call a set on the flop not figuring the straight draw to be there. it looks pretty hopeless. fold the dang thing. your awful position may truly exert itself if the board pairs.

[brad]

'
4) None of the above?

5) All of the above?
'

that hand hurt you bad. go to the shop for repairs. heh

dont be a hal9000. get help.

[Zeno]

I can't stop myself - I have to wade in. You knew that you should have fold-dead; that's why you posted the hand.

You need to start bring 3 things to the poker table.

1) A magnifying glass (Sherlock homes style)
2) Binoculars
3) A 12-gauge, pump-action shotgun loaded with buckshot.

You need 1 to see your cards clearly.
You need 2 to see your opponents clearly
You need 3 to win more pots, specifically, the one were discussing now.

I sincerely hope that you take my suggestions seriously. I only want you to improve your hourly win rate.

Best regards as always,

-Zeno