1st 2/4 hand post--flame away

[Rico Suave]

I will assume this was a typical 2/4 table...it seemed a bit tighter and bit more aggressive than the 1/2 tables. My read on my opponent is that he is somewhat loose and fairly aggressive. So here is the hand in question:

Party Poker 2/4 (10 handed)
Rico has A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, A/images/graemlins/club.gif and is UTG

Rico raises, Button folds, SB folds, BB calls

Flop(4 1/2 SB): 3/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 5/images/graemlins/club.gif

BB bets, Rico calls

Turn(3 1/4 BB): 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif

BB bets, Rico calls

River(5 1/4 BB): 7/images/graemlins/club.gif

BB checks, Rico bets, BB calls

Anybody think my play was decent, or do I need to go back down to 1/2 /images/graemlins/grin.gif. BTW my being passive was not because I thought I was behind.

Any comments welcome.

--Rico

[James282]

You don't need to go anywhere based on 1 hand, but you do need to maximize your profits. If your being passive wasn't because you thought you were behind, what was it for? You have to raise this guy on the turn to get more money in the pot here. If he has something odd like KT you don't want to let him draw without charging him. He will call your bets here for sure and he may even three-bet you if he has AK. Regardless of what your intentions were, unless this guy is a habitual bluffer, the rule at 2/4 is check to the raiser unless you think you have the raiser beat, this guy likes his hand..so if you think you are ahead, you have to send this guy reeling on the turn. You miss a bet here at least.
-James

[AliasMrJones]

You played this like a passive fish, but hope is not lost.

I think you have to at least raise the flop and probably raise the turn here. The board doesn't look scary to me and his bet probably means he hit a pair of kings, which your aces beat. There is also the possibility he has a straight and/or flush draw which you should be charging him the max for. In short, this is a great flop for you, you should be happy that your opponent bet into you giving you the chance to extract more money from him.

[LetsRock]

While this is not an awful board for you, there's lots of available danger - straight and flush draws. If there was no coordination, I would have no problem with smooth calling the flop and then ramping up on the turn.

But here, I think you need to start pushing as early as possible. So what if he folds? You won. What if he limped in from BB with a K6s (calling a raise from BB is limping to me)? You just sank your own battle ship without making him pay to get lucky.

This type of play would be a mistake at any level in my estimation so I won't tell you where to go.... /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[lil']

IF the opponent is a bluffer who would fold when you play back, or if he can lay down weak pairs to a big raise, then you did OK. If he is a calling station who can't lay down a pair, or if you think he had a King, or if he is one of those players who goes too far with his hands, I think you should raise the turn.

[Rico Suave]

Hey Mr. Jones:

Quote: You played this like a passive fish,

Ouch! /images/graemlins/blush.gif

Yeah I probably should have raised somewhere, but here is what I was thinking.

In short, my table image was a bit rockish, as I had not been getting many cards (seeing 16% of flops last night) and frankly, I was afraid he would fold if I popped him on the flop or the turn. He was loose and somewhat aggressive, but not unthinking. I wanted to maximize my profit. When he bet into me on the flop, I assumed he had hit a king or had a pocket pair and was testing me, and so I decided to let him bet the hand and then raise him on the river.

I know that I risk being drawn out on, but heads up, I thought this was the best way maximize my profit. I would never play this way against multiple opponents.

I posted this because I thought my play was certainly debateable. Thanks for the input.

--Rico

[Rico Suave]

Hey Rock:

Thanks for the input. In general, I agree with you. And I certainly concede that nobody would argue that playing it as you suggest is wrong. In fact, I probably should have.

But being heads up here I looked at it differently. Even if he has a King he is drawing to 5 outs...and I am a prohibitive favorite (I know, not invincible, but quite big). And frankly, heads up, I did not give the flush draw much attention. I saw it and pretty much dismissed--probably a mistake. I was willing to take the risk in this situation, heads up, to maximize profits.

I think the real consideration here is will he fold if I raise. I was afraid he would...but I could be wrong.

This was my first session at 2/4, so I have very little experience and I am looking for any and all help.

--Rico

[Homer]

BTW my being passive was not because I thought I was behind.

What was your reason for being passive, then? You're heads-up with position with a LAG betting into you, so I can understand waiting until the turn to raise. But you just called the flop AND turn, which I don't understand. The turn is your last chance to charge him to draw and gain an extra BB.

-- Homer

[LetsRock]

Don't get me wrong - my observation is just my typical way of approaching a situation. I don't think you made a "huge" mistake. Just played it differently than I would have.

Once you slowplay this hand and let someone hang-around and catch a miracle cheaply, you'll kick yourself for an hour and understand where I'm coming from.

You asked for a flogging and I gave you my take on it. It's not gospel, just another way to look at it. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[Rico Suave]

Hey 'lil:

quote: IF the opponent is a bluffer who would fold when you play back, or if he can lay down weak pairs to a big raise, then you did OK

I did not think he was a bluffer, just loose and somewhat aggressive, although not in a maniacal way. I had seen him fold to raises, though. I really thought that with my table image, he would have folded to a raise. I was probably wrong....he probably was not paying attention /images/graemlins/tongue.gif.

Anyway I believe the consensus here is to play it more straight forward. I think I will do so in the future.

Thanks for your input.

--Rico

[Joe Tall]

You've got to raise this flop. Looks like the BB has a K or 2 /images/graemlins/diamond.gifs and is trying to put a move on you.

Peace,
JT

[kiddo]

There is another good reason to raise this on flop or turn.

This is your first session at a higher limit. If you slowplay you hope to win more $, but you will also win less hands. That is: you will get bigger swings in your bankroll if you slowplay.

Are you ready for that?

When I move up one limit I always start with playing very straightforwardly (and specially tight in early position because I dont like all the wolfs with huge bankrolls behind me, remember my first time at 5/10, everytime someone raised behind me I feelt like /images/graemlins/confused.gif ).

Also, when you are new to a level its harder to read the other players, making plays like this "waiting to raise" much trickier ("waiting to raise" is one of my favourite plays headsup against bluffers, people will get a bit scared when you do it, specially if you normally play straightforwardly aggressive)

[AliasMrJones]

I hope you took that the right way. Obviously since you're here and working on your game you're not a passive fish. (You just looked like one on this hand./images/graemlins/grin.gif)

You said he was pretty loose and aggressive. A loose aggressive player isn't going to fold to a raise. My experience on Party 2/4 is this kind of player is going to at worst check/call to the river and sometimes even re-raise you, particularly on the flop. If you raise the turn he would most likely call and check/call the river.

So, it looks to me like you missed at least one and maybe two bets.

[Bob T.]

If you were planning on raising the river, I think that this was OK. Usually, headsup I would expect that my opponnent had top pair, and would pay me off if I raised on the turn.

[slavic]

OK I like this play if the board doesn't have 2 diamonds. Since it has the two flush I think you can take control of this hand and bet it to the river.

In general however having someone bet into you with a dominated hand heads up is not a bad thing. Shame he didn't bet the river so you could raise.