Loose call or just foolish play?

[slamdunkpro]

B&M Elimination tournament – play until heads up then top two move to the next round. Three of us are left Blinds are 3000/6000 I’m short with 27,002 Second has 27,003 and CL has 45,995.

I’m in the BB with K/images/graemlins/heart.gif2/images/graemlins/heart.gif (best I’ve seen in quite some time), CL folds, SB calls, I raise 6,000 SB calls. Flop is 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif 4/images/graemlins/club.gif 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif. I check, SB goes all in. SB has not been playing all that well, but has caught some cards. I reason that my hitting the flush odds are better than his hitting trips odds, plus if I bust him he has one chip left giving me the opportunity to have one (maybe two) shots at the former chip leaders’s (if I double) stack who has been steadily losing ground since the game became short. So I call.

SB turns over Q/images/graemlins/club.gifQ/images/graemlins/diamond.gif for two pair. We all know what happens next, turn is Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif giving SB the full house and me the flush. Adding insult to injury the river is a brick/images/graemlins/heart.gif.

Oh well – I’d really like input on this as I’ve been on the fence about this all weekend. Was it a loose call? Was it an acceptable risk with just a bad draw out? /images/graemlins/confused.gif


All thoughts welcome!

[Dentist]

hmmmm....

I don't think i would've called an all-in here with a non-nut draw......

It's not a completely horrible play, I just think you could have found a better oppourtunity with all your money.

I mean, you've gotta know you're the dog here....... Your hand can't even beat a bluff.

Why get everything in on a draw....

[slamdunkpro]

[ QUOTE ]
It's not a completely horrible play, I just think you could have found a better oppourtunity with all your money.

[/ QUOTE ]

I know that's why I'm on the fence. I'm 4:1 to pull the flush and he's 11:1 to pull the boat, plus if I don't pull the flush and he misses the boat and I catch a K..... (OK OK I'm stretching!)

[Copernicus]

Without any read on the SB, I think the 6k raise is a good, aggressive play. If he has shown any tendency toward weak/tight since its become shorthanded I think it is too aggressive.

Once the flop misses you I think the call of the all in is borderline if the next round is into significantly better money than this round. If the next round is still out of the money or not much better money, then its a good gamble.

You may have more outs to the flush, but I think its pretty clear that you are already behind to a set or two pair, (hell, you are even behind to a weak A) and need the flush. Your pot odds are fairly close to whats needed, but tournament odds are more important.

I would estimate your probability of moving on from this table to be about 25% after a fold (with stacks of 15, 40 and 45), and obviously 100% after a win, 0% after a loss. If surviving to the next level is extremely valuable you are getting 3/1, and calling is still borderline. If just getting there isnt that big a deal, and you need to get there with a good stack to have a chance of making it to meaningful money, then its time to gamble.

[slamdunkpro]

[ QUOTE ]
Once the flop misses you I think the call of the all in is borderline if the next round is into significantly better money than this round. If the next round is still out of the money or not much better money, then its a good gamble.

[/ QUOTE ]

There was no money until the final table on the second day. Advancing on the frist day just allowed you to continue to play on the second against a field of 40.

The other thing that I left out that you brought up was that you carry your chip total forward.The worst second day situation (OK other than being knocked out the first day) was to move on with 8-10k and have to start very short. I'd almost rather be out than have to start the second day 4:1 short.

[Copernicus]

I agree...at that point and under those circumstances you may as well go for it.

[LetsRock]

Personally, I don't like being "told" to go all-in. To do so on a draw is very risky. Then again, I'm of the "chip and a chair" school that it's better to move on short stacked than to not move on at all.

But I do know the emotions of tourney play and sometimes ya gotta do what ya gotta do. It sounds like you did the right thing for your play preferences.