I have no idea how I got into this......

[Gomez22]

Party .50/1.00 table..... unbelievably loose..... 6+ players EVERY flop... been there 2 hours, down 20BB (fish are sucking... shoulda known....... First hand I sat, got pocket Aces in BB, raised, some guy 3-bet, I capped, 3-better won when he runner-rivered quad 2's... I DID flop a set of aces) /images/graemlins/confused.gif

Anyways.. about the REAL HAND HERE....

I'm in SB with 10 /images/graemlins/heart.gif 9 /images/graemlins/club.gif

UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, MP4 calls, CO folds, button calls, I call, BB checks.

FLOP: 10 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif 10 /images/graemlins/spade.gif 5 /images/graemlins/club.gif

I decide to slowplay, and it gets checked arounf to button, who bets, I call, BB calls, MP1 calls, MP3 folds, MP4 calls, CO folds.

TURN: Q /images/graemlins/club.gif

I bet out, BB folds, MP1 calls, MP4 calls, button calls.

RIVER: 8 /images/graemlins/heart.gif

I bet out, MP1 calls, MP4 raises, button folds, I 3-bet, MP1 calls, MP4 caps, I call, MP1 overcalls.

Anyone guess what the results were?

[Gomez22]

Well.... this table busted me out when I got QQ in the BB, raised and UTG rivered a flush with 105s....... AAAAAUUUUUUGGGGGGHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!

Anyways, something has been creeping into my mind, and I'm wondering if there's any sense to this.....

I always feel that I do best at a table with 1-3 loose players.... when I'm at a table like the one above, I seem to constantly get drawn out on. I know it doesn't help to be against 6+ players every hand, because of the "more outs" against you.

Does anyone else feel this way? Should I start sitting at a table and letting an orbit go by before posting the BB to get some possible "reads" on some players?

A table full of fish can bust me in no time, but a couple of fish at a table seems to turn into payday for me.......

Just thought I'd ask if there's any reason/logic to this.......

Thanks in advance

[TazQ]

I know it's frustrating, but you just gotta realize that if you could play at a table with 60% seeing the flop every day for the rest of your life at any limit that you'd be a millionaire in no time.

Ya, you'll get drawn out on. The only thing is that when you do win a pot it's going to be big. Variance is going to be higher obviously, you just need to stick with it. When you win two pots in a row you'll be back to even money or better.

[Gomez22]

Thanks, TazQ... I just wnat to make one thing absolutely clear... I am in no way whining here..... just wondering if it's better for me NOT to be at a table full of fish...... they all seem to stick together and call, and, call, and call, and call, and call, and call, and, call, and call, and call, and call, and call, and, call, and call, and call, and call, and call, and, call, and call, and call, and call, and call, and, call, and call, and call, and call, and call, and, call, and call, and call, and call, and call, and, call, and call, and call, and call, and call, and, call, and call, and call, and call, and call, and, call, and call, and call, and call, and call, and, call, and call, and call, and call, and call, and, call, and call, and call, and call, and call, and, call, and call, and call, and call, and call, and, call, and call, and call, and call, and call, and, call, and call, and call, and call, and call, and, call, and call, and call, and call, and call........

[NoTalent]

Believe me--it will pay you off.

Be patient, and try not to rip your hair out when you get your rockets cracked with 92o... /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[WillMagic]

Well, in regard to the play of the hand, I think your three-bet on the river was awful...call it down. It's very easy for a boat to be out there.

Normally, I don't like slowplaying. I'd rather bet out. You'll probably get some callers and maybe even a raise, so you can reraise it.

Will

[Alobar]

you are totally whining, but your whining for each and everyone of us who gets drawn out on by crap, so preech on! /images/graemlins/smile.gif

I like to play more Ax suited Kx suited and even hands like J7s Q8s when im at a table full of cold calling idiots. most of the time you can get in for a bet pre flop, ditch it if you dont flop a draw, and when you do hit, your dragging in a pile of chips. I know everyone says that if you find a table full of fish like this, your supposed to be happy when they all cold call your pre flop raise with AA, but I wanna see some actual math/statistics on that before I believe it /images/graemlins/smile.gif Just change around some of the hands you play, tighten up your top hands and loosen up your drawing hands a bit. My 2 cents anyway

[Gomez22]

So you find that playing more fishy when you're with a lot of fish sorta cancels out the fishiness of the whole fish-suck-out thingy?

/images/graemlins/blush.gif

[Alobar]

lol, well when you put it that way.... /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[tpir90036]

this one is tough for me to figure out for some reason.

on one hand, your hand might be good:
your slow play might have your opponents thinking you don't have a 10...i would love to hear that MP4 was waiting for an 8 with 85o or some other piece of garbage and raised the river when he hit. in any event, i don't see the point of three betting the river. plus he capped which probably means you are beat....

so on the other hand, your hand might not be good:
a boat and straight are possible, but i find it hard to believe that someone with a 10 or pocket 5's would have checked it through...then again, you checked your 10, so who knows....maybe they were slowplaying your slowplay /images/graemlins/wink.gif

conclusion:
the runner-runner J9 straight, playing 55 weakly and hanging around with pocket 8's are my current finalists. put me down for the backdoor straight because it is the most annoying....

[bunky9590]

Hey Gomez! I actually love those tables. You need to play the drawing hands more and loosen up a bit on the ddraws Q9s J9s 97s etc. If you miss the flop be done with it and be prepared to get the big pairs cracked like 50-60% of the time. Like I said last night, patience.

[Gomez22]

MP4 showed 10 /images/graemlins/club.gif 5 /images/graemlins/heart.gif

Outplayed by my own outplay........ Ah, the experiences of LL poker... adn I just had told myself last week that it was ABC poker only for me.....

Oh, well.... gues I was too slick for my own good.

[rkiray]

I don't understand slowplaying on the flop and then beting out on the turn. If you slowplay this I think you should checkraise the turn.

In general in this type of game suited connectors, small pairs and medium pairs go way up in value and unsuited high cards go way down in value. Axs and Kxs also go up. Play your big draws aggressively. You will lose many more pots than you win, but if played correctly the pots you win should be large to huge and more than make up for it. Also remember to dump these hands on the flop unless it hits you hard. One pair is fairly unless in these games unless you have a good draw to go with it.

[Mike Gallo]

Anyone guess what the results were?

Some live one had J9 and beat you runner runner. Someone else probably had A 10 or J 10.

[Gomez22]

[Nottom]

[ QUOTE ]
FLOP: 10 10 5

I decide to slowplay, and it gets checked arounf to button, who bets, I call, BB calls, MP1 calls, MP3 folds, MP4 calls, CO folds.

TURN: Q

I bet out, BB folds, MP1 calls, MP4 calls, button calls.

[/ QUOTE ]

Whats the point of slowplaying if you aren't going to checkraise the turn? If you are going to bet out, you need to checkraise the flop.

[Gomez22]

Yeah... guess looking back I was a greedy bastard, there...... wanted to bite off alot off of the fish at the table, but had no idea another was a "pirahna"......... Shoulda taken what I could for this and let it lie, but wouldn't really have known what to do when MP3 raised...........

[BaronVonCP]

Don't become fishy, just adjust your play. Play more hands that play well mulitway.

[scotnt73]

over the weekend i read Winning Low Limit Holdem after someone on this board suggested it. I actually am about to finish reading it for the second time. It is the best book ive ever read on how to beat a table full of fish.

[ResidentParanoid]

If you are losing at a really loose table (5 or 6 loosies), then you are not playing optimally at that table. These are the easiest tables to make money at. But you have to make adjustments (like at all tables /images/graemlins/smile.gif) For example: top pair, top kicker is not worth that much when 3 or 4 people routinely see the river. So don't get crazy when TPTK gets knocked out for the 5th time in a row. Your variance will be large. Because of this, it takes much longer to reach the long-run. But your rate per hand (in BB) can be quite high.