Am I a Rock? [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

TheRake

11-13-2003, 03:41 PM

All .5/1 and 1/2 at various poker sites
Poker Tracker stats...

<font color="red">Vol. put $ in pot % = 16.70
Pre-flop raise % = 2.87 </font>

This is over my last 6500 hands (I know it's not much, but all I have /images/graemlins/frown.gif).

My win rate is 1.51bb/Hr over this time so maybe I don't need to worry about it, but could be I am missing some EV.

Any comments are welcome

Thanks,
TheRake

JTG51

11-13-2003, 03:53 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Vol. put $ in pot % = 16.70
Pre-flop raise % = 2.87

[/ QUOTE ]

My numbers are 14.9% and 8.55%. I've suspected for a while that I played tigher and more aggressively before the flop than most here, I've never posted the numbers though. Now I'm interested to see how many players here are lower on the first one or higher on the second one than me.

Anyway, you certainly should be raising more. It sounds like you are only raising big pairs and AK, which means you aren't getting full value out of a lot of hands.

[ QUOTE ]
My win rate is 1.51bb/Hr over this time so maybe I don't need to worry about it, but could be I am missing some EV.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ugh, don't say that! 1.51 BB/Hr is very good, and you should be proud, it's definitely possible to do better though.

rkiray

11-13-2003, 04:02 PM

My numbers are 17.56 and 7.03. I agree that he definitely needs to raise more. I actually think my number for raising needs to go up 1 or 2 %. His sample size is fine for these numbers but a little short for win rate (but it's getting there).

J.R.

11-13-2003, 04:06 PM

At full table 2-4 I have about 17% VIP and about 5% raise, at full table 3-6 my VIP is about 12% with about 7% raise.

AliasMrJones

11-13-2003, 05:00 PM

At $.50/$1 I'm 18.74% and 3.39%
At $2/$4 I'm 20.66% and 5.55%

And I thought I was a tighty lol. I've actually been thinking about loosening up a bit in late position and playing things like J9s, Q9s, T8s that I don't play now.

JTG51

11-13-2003, 05:10 PM

...at full table 3-6 my VIP is about 12%...

Good lord, do you keep a feather duster handy to clean off your chips when you decide to play a hand? /images/graemlins/smile.gif

scotnt73

11-13-2003, 05:15 PM

i think you should loosen up and play at least KK

TheRake

11-13-2003, 05:17 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I've actually been thinking about loosening up a bit in late position and playing things like J9s, Q9s, T8s...

[/ QUOTE ]

I play all these hands on the button in an unraised pot..hmmmm

I am definately more selective about the hands I will play from early position. I just don't feel my game is strong enough yet to play marginal hands from EP well, so I just pass on them. I think maybe if my raise % was higher it may help play some of these hands better.

TheRake

GuyOnTilt

11-13-2003, 05:17 PM

Since I started playing poker, my numbers are 18.4% and 7.7%. However, in the past 2 months since I've started playing much more, my numbers are 14.2% and 10.3%, so I beat you in both. /images/graemlins/grin.gif Whether that's a good thing or not, I'm not sure. I have been playing in tougher games as of late though, so I've become even more tight/aggressive than I would be in most games preflop.

Vehn

11-13-2003, 05:26 PM

16% is too tight for limits below $5/$10 and probably even then. I haven't used tracking software in a long time but if I remember right (rkiray can say since he has all my hands also) I was around 16%/7% back when I played $1/$2 on Paradise and I'd like to think I've improved since then /images/graemlins/wink.gif. Optimal VIP for the normal, say, $2/$4 on Party is probably 17-19%. Paradise $20/$40 "legend" Angelina once stated her VIP in those super tight, super aggressive games is around 16%. Don't get into the tighter than thou mindset that goes around here especially in the mid/high limit forum.

rkiray

11-13-2003, 05:31 PM

Well vehn, I show you at 16.19 and 8.98.

Vehn

11-13-2003, 05:36 PM

I was probably too tight back then. /images/graemlins/wink.gif That was also almost two years ago and I probably didn't win much either. I dunno - I had a computer crash a while back and lost my (stagnant) pokerstat stuff. Would be kinda fun to take a look at those hands and see how much I've changed my thought processes on that sort of thing.

rkiray

11-13-2003, 05:41 PM

If you really want them, I think I still have the files you e-mailed me. Let me know. I haven't traded files with anyone in a long time. It was great to get my database started but it became a pain in the butt after a while.

MaxPower

11-13-2003, 06:59 PM

You don't have that many hands yet, but I would look at these numbers by position.

I think you could probably play a few more hands in late position.

I think your raising percentage should be much higher. You have a good win rate, but I'm sure it would be higher if you raised more.

Look at your numbers this way. There are 1326 starting holdem hands. To get this percentage, you are probably raising with 38 of them. You could get your percentage by only raising with AA, KK, QQ, AK, AKs, and a couple of others. That's not very aggressive.

cold_cash

11-13-2003, 08:35 PM

I laughed out loud when I read this....lol /images/graemlins/smile.gif

JTG51

11-13-2003, 08:40 PM

I think you are probably right, I've thought for a long time that I probably play too tight online. When I'm playing the low limits (which is most of the time) I'm always playing 3 tables at once, so I've stayed away from adding too many marginal hands. I don't have stats to back it up, but I think I play somewhat looser in live games.

JTG51

11-13-2003, 08:51 PM

...my numbers are 14.2% and 10.3%, so I beat you in both.

Oh man, now I'm pissed! I've got about 42K hands, so I'm going to have to raise the next 1000 in a row to reach 10.4%. I don't think that'll be good for my bankroll, but it'll be fun! /images/graemlins/smile.gif

MaxPower

11-13-2003, 09:25 PM

I've got 22,000 hands logged at 3/6 on party and my VP$IP is 19.49. I've tighted up a little over time so it is around 18% for the last 10,000 hands. My PFR% has stayed constant and it is at 7.66%.

I think vehn's estimate is about right, but I firmly believe that your win rate is more affected by the % of time that you raise pre-flop than by how many flops you see.

I think someone who plays a little too loose but aggressive will do better than someone who plays a little too tight but passive.

JTG51

11-13-2003, 09:29 PM

I think someone who plays a little too loose but aggressive will do better than someone who plays a little too tight but passive.

I agree 100% as long as the emphasis is on "a little" loose. It's just impossible to make up all of the bets that passive players miss.

Barry

11-13-2003, 09:43 PM

I'm almost afraid to disclose these, but excluding my pre-2+2 days (when my VIP$ was about 25%) my VIP$ is right around 20% and my PFR% is about 7.5%. My win rate is just about 2BB/100 hands. This is with about 32K hands in my database. Online now I am playing almost exclusively 5/10, usually 2 tables at a time.

Also, my VIP$ is a little higher, my PFR% a little lower and my win rate is higher at 3/6 vs. 5/10.

GuyOnTilt

11-13-2003, 10:05 PM

I'm curious...What limits do you play? I know you're an excellent poster, and I'm assuming you have the play to match. It must be at least 10/20 if you're VP$IP is that low...

BTW, the 14.2% and 10.3% are from my last 37k limit hands.

JTG51

11-13-2003, 10:16 PM

Thank you, but it's actually a mix of 2/4, 3/6, and 5/10.

Like I said below, I definitely fold some hands when I'm playing 3 tables that I wouldn't if I was playing one. That's a concession I'm willing to make to be able to play 180 hands an hour.

alekhine8

11-15-2003, 01:25 AM

Ive played about 2500 hands at 3/6 that I have in PokerTracker and am at 11% / 4.8%. Winning about 3 BB per 100 hands.

The 11% doesnt concern me, but I think I need to raise more.

Ponks

04-18-2004, 02:56 PM

My VIP is 14% and PFR is 5.25% Yikes maybe I should start playing a few more hands. Mostly 2/4 and some 1/2

Ponks

Kenrick

04-19-2004, 05:36 AM

[ QUOTE ]
And I thought I was a tighty lol. I've actually been thinking about loosening up a bit in late position and playing things like J9s, Q9s, T8s that I don't play now.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're not missing much if you don't. It's harder to play too tight than it is to play too loose. T8s sucks ass anyway.

MicroBob

04-19-2004, 06:07 AM

most-recent 5.5k hds: 17.7 and 8.4, +4.4BB/100.

my first 17k hds: 21.5 and 6.6, +2.0BB/100

(hands with 8-10 players)

so i actually did the opposite of what many of you are suggesting.

i sugges that if you're going to add extra hands that you do it gradually. just focus on one or two hands you think you should add and focus on them.
if you're only raisin 3% of the time then you are really doing yourself a disservice. AQs, AQo, AJs, KQs, QQ-TT all need to be considered.

TheRake

04-19-2004, 11:56 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Vol. put $ in pot % = 16.70
Pre-flop raise % = 2.87

[/ QUOTE ]

Well since someone saw fit to bump this old piece of $hit guess I'll post my new and improved numbers. Over my last ~6500 hands

VP$IP = 15.79%
PFR% = 7.84%

Still tight but much much more aggressive.

Quite an improvement from my weak tight days just 5 months ago.

TheRake