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View Full Version : I flopped good, but am I best?


rtucker5
11-05-2003, 05:29 PM
This hand was played in a $30 pot limit SNG at Party. The blinds are still T10/T15 and I have T775. I limp UTG with AdJd. Folded to the CO with T760 who makes it T60. The button with about T3000 calls. The button has already busted 3 players by taking the worst hand and outdrawing them. I call as well.

The flop comes down Jh7d6d. I have flopped TPTK and the nut flush draw. I check, CO bets T150, button makes it T300. Based on previous hands the button could have anything. She raised the flop with bottom pair and called a players all in when he had AA and she rivered 2 pair. I felt I had her beat, but wasn't sure about the CO. I moved in and got called in both places. Does anyone just call the flop or fold? My other option would be to bet out on the flop. What is the best play?

Copernicus
11-05-2003, 07:54 PM
I would have bet out on the flop. You are probably ahead of both at this point, and should want to take the pot down. If you do get calls, betting out will help disguise your flush draw if another diamond hits, since they will have expected more passive play. Betting also gives you a better read on the CO, who could have a lot of hands for his PF raise, but a call vs a reraise here will narrow them down and you can decide if you are on a draw or ahead.

As it turned out, though, checking may have induced a better result, because the CO got committed to the pot with his bet and you are either ahead or better than 50/50 to draw a probable winner, and probably getting 2/1 odds on your raise. I think moving in here is mandatory this early. The chances of taking a commanding chip lead are too good.

CrisBrown
11-06-2003, 12:25 AM
Hi rtucker,

I'm not worried about the Button; she seems to be Jill the Jackal so her reraise could mean A7, A6, KJ, QJ, JT, T9, 87, 76 (which you're behind), 56 ... heck, who knows. She has some piece of something, but you're probably ahead of her.

As for the CO, that's a tougher read. He bet the pot pre-flop, and bet out for a third of his chips at the flop, and did so knowing that Jill the Jackal is sitting right behind him. I don't think that's a bluff. (If so it's a mistake; Jill the Jackal is going to call.)

The range of possible hands I'd include for the CO is: an overpair, a set, two pair (67s), or KQ or T9, especially KQ or T9 diamonds.

Is the CO the kind of player who would raise pre-flop on 67s, KQ or T9, with a limper already in and a Jackal on his left? These aren't awful plays -- Jackals give good implied odds even heads-up -- but is CO the kind of player who'd know that, or who would make this decent play out of sheer ignorance? If so, you may not only be ahead now, but have half of CO's outs. If not, you're probably behind at the flop.

But with both TPTK and the nut flush draw, even if you're behind right now, you're not in awful position. Any A, J, or diamond probably gives you the winner -- unless CO has AA or catches a boat -- and that's 15 outs with two cards to come, almost 1:2 to draw out at over 3:1 pot odds.

I'd call the all-in here.

Cris

rtucker5
11-06-2003, 10:09 AM
I moved in and both players called me. It turns out they had both flopped sets. CO had 77 and button had 66. Luckily I hit a diamond and tripled up. After the hand I questioned my play. I really think I should have lead at the flop. In this case it didn't matter because of the hands.

AliasMrJones
11-06-2003, 12:58 PM
I would have played this about the exact opposite of how you did. I would have raised pre-flop with AJs and definitely bet out on the flop. With 2 sets out there, it sounds like things would have turned out the same playing it either way.

Guy McSucker
11-06-2003, 04:05 PM
You have an absolute monster. With two cards to come, you are only an underdog to a set or J7, J6, which are unlikely.

As Copernicus says, though, it's always nice to win it early. So bet out, but don't fold to a raise unless you are very sure it's trips and you're getting less than 3:1. Usually move in if raised, I think.

Guy.