5 QQ hands, looking for leaks

[Guido]

The tablelimits of these hands at are 0.5/1 or 1/2. I think I should fold earlier but would like to know what your play is.

<font color="blue"> Hand 1 </font>
Q /images/graemlins/heart.gif Q /images/graemlins/diamond.gif in MP. UTG + 2 open raises, I 3-bet, BB calls.

Flop: T /images/graemlins/spade.gif 9 /images/graemlins/spade.gif 4 /images/graemlins/spade.gif

I bet, BB check-raises, UTG + 2 folds, I call. (3-bet?)

Turn: T /images/graemlins/heart.gif

BB bets, I call. (fold?)

River: J /images/graemlins/heart.gif

BB bets, I call.

BB had 4 /images/graemlins/heart.gif 4 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

<font color="blue"> Hand 2 </font>
Q /images/graemlins/spade.gif Q /images/graemlins/diamond.gif in MP2. UTG + 2 and MP1 limp, I raise, rest folds, UTG + 2 and MP1 call.

Flop: 6 /images/graemlins/heart.gif 9 /images/graemlins/club.gif 7 /images/graemlins/heart.gif

MP1 bets out, I raise, both call.

Turn: T /images/graemlins/heart.gif

MP1 bets out, I call (fold/call/raise?), UTG + 2 calls.

River: 2 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

MP1 bets out, I call (fold/call?), UTG + 2 calls.

UTG + 2 had J /images/graemlins/heart.gif J /images/graemlins/spade.gif
MP2 had 8 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif 8 /images/graemlins/heart.gif

<font color="blue"> Hand 3 </font>
Q /images/graemlins/diamond.gif Q /images/graemlins/spade.gif in CO. UTG limps, MP raises, I 3-bet, UTG calls, MP caps, I and UTG call.

Flop: K /images/graemlins/spade.gif 5 /images/graemlins/heart.gif 6 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

MP bets out, I raise, UTG calls, MP 3-bets (0.25 cents) all-in, I call (cap right?), UTG calls.

Turn: 6 /images/graemlins/heart.gif

I bet, UTG calls.

River: 2 /images/graemlins/heart.gif

Check, check.

UTG had J /images/graemlins/spade.gif K /images/graemlins/club.gif
MP had A /images/graemlins/spade.gif A /images/graemlins/club.gif

<font color="blue"> Hand 4 </font>
Q /images/graemlins/spade.gif Q /images/graemlins/heart.gif in BB. UTG and UTG + 2 limp, CO poster checks, SB limps, I raise.

Flop: 7 /images/graemlins/spade.gif 8 /images/graemlins/spade.gif 6 /images/graemlins/club.gif

I bet out, all call.

Turn: A /images/graemlins/spade.gif

I bet out, UTG folds, other 2 call.

River: 3 /images/graemlins/club.gif

I bet, both call.

SB had A /images/graemlins/club.gif 9 /images/graemlins/heart.gif
CO had A /images/graemlins/diamond.gif 5 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

<font color="blue"> Hand 5 </font>
Q /images/graemlins/diamond.gif Q /images/graemlins/spade.gif in MP1. UTG + 2 limps, I raise, MP2 3-bets, UTG + 2 calls, I cap, both call.

Flop: K /images/graemlins/club.gif K /images/graemlins/spade.gif 2 /images/graemlins/spade.gif

I bet out, MP2 calls, UTG + 2 check-raises, I 3-bet(fold/call/3-bet?), MP2 caps, we both call.

Turn: A /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

MP2 bets out, UTG + 2 calls all-in, I call (fold right?)

River: 7 /images/graemlins/heart.gif

I check-fold.

UTG + 2 had 2 /images/graemlins/heart.gif 2 /images/graemlins/club.gif
MP2 had A /images/graemlins/club.gif K /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

I think I stick to long with my queens. I think my preflop and flop play is pretty good but I should let go more often on the turn. What do you think?

[crockpot]

hand 1: i'm going to get flamed as weak-tight for this, but you should fold the flop against typical players. except for the remote possibility of A /images/graemlins/spade.gif T, which he might not even check raise with, you are well behind with too few outs to consider playing. the Q /images/graemlins/spade.gif is anything but a clean out, and you can easily be drawing dead to a runner runner.

needless to say, you are not likely to run into a check-raise bluff after three bets preflop at these limits.

hand 2: good play up until the turn. i would definitely fold the turn. the odds that the bettor has completed a straight or flush are very high, or he might be betting a turned two pair or set. either way, with the Q /images/graemlins/heart.gif not counting as an out, you are drawing very thin, if you have outs at all.

hand 3: i like your flop raise given that the bettor is nearly all in and may be playing crazily in an attempt to get there, but once UTG calls two cold on the flop, he has you beat and you should stop betting. a draw is very unlikely on that flop when the player has called four bets preflop.

hand 4: good play up until the river, where your bet is questionable. betting and folding to a raise is fine, as is checking and hoping to catch a bluff.

hand 5: this 3-bet is ridiculous. no one is going to check-raise on that board with a hand you can beat. this is a fold (because a queen still may not win for you), and if you do call it should be with the intent of folding the turn if you do not hit a queen.

[BigEndian]

I've revised my QQ play to treat them more like JJ and TT than KK. Which means, I play them hot and heavy early and fold them out to a lot of company and action on the turn and river if they don't improve or have a worth-while draw.

Hand 1: Personally, I sometimes check-raise if I have the A/images/graemlins/spade.gif here. So there are sensible winning scenarios. But, depending on the competition, I would have folded this I think. Shocking, I know.

Hand 2: All players played this fine I think.

Hand 3: I wouldn't cap the flop. Played fine I think.

Hand 4: This is one I would check-fold the turn.

Hand 5: Fold the flop - especially if you know MP2 only raises AA, KK, QQ or AK as is most common at that limit. Definitely fold the turn if you made it to this point. UTG+2 limper rightfully got their ass handed to them on this pot.

- Groove

[Guido]

Hand 4: This is one I would check-fold the turn.

Would you also do this if the A wasn't a spade?

[BigEndian]

If it wasn't a spade, I would check and see what the action is back to me. With one bet and two players to me, I'll probably call it down if the action doesn't come alive on the river. But fold to 2-bets or a Mongolian Horde of callers.

- Groove

[rkiray]

I'm not sure, maybe he has changed, but a couple of weeks ago Guido posted several 99 hands. He basically plays 99 the way I play JJ. So suggesting to him to play QQ like JJ may not be exactly what you want. /images/graemlins/cool.gif

[Guido]

/images/graemlins/smile.gif good one! The 99 problem has been solved. Just had to flop some sets /images/graemlins/grin.gif. Still have a problem with flopping sets with 22, 33, 44, 55, 66 and QQ. With 33 for example: I have had them 33 times and never flopped a set /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[rharless]

I will give you my opinions. I find all of these hands to be difficult (which is why I think you don't have very many replies), so take my thoughts with a grain of salt. /images/graemlins/smile.gif At least maybe this will bump the thread up to get you some more responses!

Hand 1:
I would 3-bet the flop. If he caps the flop, I call, and then fold when he again bets that turn unless I pick up a turned Q. If he caps and then checks the turn, I check behind. If just calls my 3-bet, I bet again on the turn, folding if he c/raises me again.

Mainly the idea behind 3-betting the flop is to make my turn/river decisions easier.

Hand 2:
I think the absolute worst possible turn cards for you are Th, 9h, or 5h, especially with the UTG+2 cold caller. (I would never have been able to put him on JJ.) I fold the turn.

I posted a similar hand once where Clarkmeister told me that "bet the flop, call a raise, then again bet when the flush card falls on the turn is almost never a flush." He said he usually raises again on the turn in this situation and the opponents often fold. I have experimented with this and found it successful, but I think it's much harder to do in this 3-way pot with a cold-caller.

Hand 3:
Pretty difficult. If MP is sane, there's not many hands that I can put MP on that I beat, and if UTG is happy to be in when MP and I were both so strong preflop, then that makes me even less confident of my hand.

Given that MP is almost all-in, I like your play. An all-in player could be capping with anything. When LP calls two cold on a board with very few draws, however, for you to think of capping the flop is silly.

At mini-limits with a multi-way capped preflop hand, unpaired overcards are not good for QQ.

Hand 4:
Check the river. While I can think of several worse hands that might call, I don't think you can beat both of the players who called the turn. It's harder to beat two players than one.

Hand 5:
MP2's 3-bet preflop and flop-smooth-call could be a complete miss on the flop, and could be a monster. Although this flop has overcards like Hand 3, this flop is much better (two Ks on board are better than a single K), and with the flush draw on the board you can include many draws as possible hands for the other players. I do like your 3-bet because I do think there's a reasonable chance you hold the best hand and this helps you to define the other hands.

Given a capped flop, plus a bet-call leading into you on the turn ... fold. It's clear that you need a Q. You are getting 14:1 but you need 22:1, and you don't even know if you are drawing live.

[Guido]

Hi rharless,

Thanks for your response.

I like your play in hand 1. Some said they would fold the flop after a check-raise. I wouldn't do that because of the flush possibility. There are aren't that many hands worth calling my 3-bet preflop that make a flush. Off course there is the possibility of a set. I called because I thought it was a bluff (should have 3-bet like you said). I should have folded the turn because I only had 2 outs. I defenately should have folded the river. I learned something here, thanks.

Hand 2: Again should have folded on the turn. Raising is an interesting idea but perhaps not in this situation. If you get called, do you bet again on the river if you don't improve?

Hand 3: I guess I didn't do that much wrong, perhaps checking behind on the turn and check-fold the river is best.

Hand 4: I agree that I should have checked the river. I don't think it is right to check the turn like some said.

Hand 5: Again I agree, I should have folded the turn.

[rharless]

Hand 1, it is either a semi-bluff, or a valid hand that has you beat, or a valid hand that does not have you beat (JT, e.g.). The presence of a 3rd player in that pot with that type of board is why you 3-bet. If it is a semi-bluff, and the 3rd player is drawing live to beat you, then you leverage the semi-bluff with the 3-bet to get out player #3 and improve your chances of winning. If it is not a semi-bluff, you can at least define player #1's hand by his reaction to your 3-bet, and then play the turn accordingly.

Hand 2, the river bet is quite player dependent. In most cases I will bet again, because in most cases if the player has a flush, they will 3-bet the turn, or at least lead the river.