flat-calling with AK

Lately, I've been smooth-calling a pre-flop raise with AK, as opposed to 3-betting. Almost regardless of position, looseness of the raiser, # of limpers, # of players behind, etc.


Advantages seem to be:


> It's easier to get away from the hand when the flop misses.


> you can get paid off huge on the nut straight, as players will seldom put you on AK, QQ, JJ, etc.


> On a scary ace-high or king-high flop, you can use the pre-flop raiser's likely bet to force the field to pay two bets to chase draws.


> You might not scare away AJ, KQ, who you probably want in the hand.


> You can represent some lesser hands, especially from the blinds.


A couple days ago, I flat-called a late raise from the SB with AKo. The flop came 7-7-J (two spades). Early position player bet, pre-flop raiser raised, and I cold-called. The turn was a rag third spade. I bet out, and they both folded.


Of course, there is some downside. You're less likely to get headsup, which means it's almost impossible to win a showdown with out at least a pair. You will get beat by the blinds with some hands that you could have driven out. If the flop misses everyone, players will be unlikely to make a move on a pre-flop 3-bettor. Less money in the pot when you probably have the best hand. And others that we all know. Personally, I don't like playing AK headsup anyway. I'd rather see the flop cheaper, and use position to punish an AQ.


I'm curious if anyone else likes to make this play with big slick.

seems like I just recently read, perhaps in Card Player, that odds against connecting (with AK) are about 2 to 1. that's a vote for not raising.


since it is so very common to raise, then not raising becomes somewhat of a deceptive play....which is primary reason I have adopted this (most often) in the P/L games which I play.

Well AKo suit plays great heads up so you should learn to like it. While you do gain some deceptive advantages by playing it like you describe, you probably gain less then you would by simply getting more money in the pot and reducing your field of opposition. The equity in doing this is probably worth much more then the deceptive equity. Also, when you get the hand heads up you don't necessarily have to hit the flop to still win. Making plays like this occaisionally are good but if you start smooth calling all the time, then perceptive opponents will now start to realize that you are playing AK that way and now not only will your preflop equity dissappear but your deceptive equity will disappear too. Now that sounds like a bad situation to be in. Its important to mix up play, and 3betting too much or calling too much can be a problem, it's best to find that happy medium.

I don't think that you can make a very strong argument in smooth calling unless you are a game where raising will not thin the field. If raising with AK will not get anyone to fold, then a call would be in order. You are going to constantly get the money with AK if you limit the players you will face on the flop. If most of the players will see the flop no matter what, you know that if you didn't hit the flop - somebody did. You can fold knowing you played it right. If you smooth call and and ace does fall on the flop, you are up against many opponents who you can count on sucking out on you more often than not. RAISE, unless you will not limit the field. Comments welcome as I am just learning this game.


G.

You make a good point in that you don't want a large field with AK. And I'm certainly not advocating limping with AK, as I think that's a terrible play. But for the most part, the maniacs that will call two bets with all sorts of junk will often call 3. And if it keeps in a weaker ace or KJ, then I'll gladly take their money and let them try to hit a 3-outer vs. me.


If someone cold-calls 2 with A7 that would have folded for 3 bets, and the flop comes A-7-3, that is gonna suck. But many more times, I'm going to get paid off all the way by his weaker ace.


Goat is right that it is important to mix up your play. And he is right that AK plays well headsup (even though it's an underdog to 22). But if you don't know your opponent, it can be very tough to play. Suppose the flop comes J-T-7 and your opponent check-raises you. Do you call? You basically have to call him down to the river if you do, and you've probably let him know you don't have an overpair. Even rags aren't safe.


I just think that you end up paying off a lot of hands, and your opponent pays off very few. It's tough to tell when you're best if an A or K doesn't hit. Versus a weak-tight, you'll take it home with a rag flop but won't make any money doing it. Whereas if you smooth-call with AK, and the flop comes rags, your opponent might give you action with his AJ.


Again, it's just a play that I prefer to make. Sometimes, not all the time.

I agree with most of the previous poster's comments. A couple of other things to keep in mind:


3-betting becomes more successful when there is: (1) No caller between you and the raiser (2) No limpers in front of the raiser(3) You are in late position (4) The raiser has demonstrated previous pot opening raises with questionable hands (5) The raiser routinely raises with any Ace or King-Face.


Smooth calling becomes a better option when fewer of the above situations are present.

AKo is only a great hand if you hit the flop. Every straight will be an inside straight and you have only 1 card to make a flush draw. If you are holding AK and are check-raised, seems to me like you could put the player on a big pair (maybe QQ-JJ) or big suited cards. I haven't noticed too many people who would make it 3 bets with KQo. So if someone bets back into you, drawing to an inside straight head-to-head or a thin field against a player who might have trip J's or has more outs than your straight already, might be a bad play. Mixing your play up is a very good idea, but getting into a habit of limping and not raising with AKo more often than not seems bad to me. If you are check raised, you do not have to call to the river. This is what is so beautiful about the check raise, trapping players into making a poor decision to chase when the odds are against them. Raise - reduce the field if you can, hit the flop clean or get out. Raise 1 time and if reraisred see the flop and then if check raised you have seen too much already. Let the fish chase those long shots and let them pay you of instead.


G.

Just because you are a 2-1 dog to hit the flop doesn't mean that you shouldn't raise. This is not at all any kind of valid argument to not play the hand agressively. Besides you actually aren't a full 2-1 when you take into account the times you flop a gut draw or flush draw, but who cares that's irrelevant. There are plenty of times when raising with longer odds then that are correct. One example would be to raise with a small pair before the flop after the whole field has limped- well you are almost 8-1 to hit a set but if you are getting something like 9-1 on your raise it is a good time to do so (actually you don't even need odds that high since the main reason to do this is to increase your implied odds by sucking people into a big pot when you get a good flop, also when you miss you now can take a free card if everybody checks to you and have another small chance at winning the pot).

You say you don't raise with it in P/L games, well I don't know too much about P/L but I am sure that limpimg constantly w/AK cannot be a proper strategy.

well said, Goat...You are right...please note that in my original message I said that I OFTEN do not raise with AK, not NEVER. That's where the deception comes in--sometime you do and sometime you don't. Being able to "put a player on a hand", that is to correctly guess what he has, is valuable in all poker---thus making it more difficult for them to put you on a hand has value. and, yes, it may be more important in P/L, but it is allways good.