Ahh money

[ThingDo]

While I hate to add to all the crap that goes on here... a certain person who frequents this forum owes me money and will not pay... I agreed to join up with Eugenell and his rake back program with Empire Poker. I made an account and he/she agreed to pay me % of the rake that he gets. While he did give me some money he didn't give it all to me. And now he's telling me he doesn't owe me any more and that he gave my tracker to someone else at Empire because I'm no longer playing. Sure he gave me SOME money, but he didn't give all of it to me.. I'm the kind of guy that doesn't settle for something than less than he deserves. So I am posting here to ruin your little "operation" so that you don't do to others what you did to me.

[Inthacup]

How much is the difference?

[ThingDo]

Not a large ammount, but enough to piss me off /images/graemlins/laugh.gif $64.50. Really has nothing to do with the money ammount, just the fact that he didn't follow up on what he agreed to do.

[Inthacup]

The reason why I ask is because if it was close enough, it could be written off to the way the rake is tracked by Empire vs. Pokertracker. Pokertracker shows you just the amount you generate. Empire takes an equal cut of each pot based on how many players are at the table. So, if you're a loose player, you would actually be getting less back from Empire than you would actually generate.

That being said, $64.50 seems to be too big of a difference. Eugene, did someone hijack your affiliate program and pay people incorrect amounts? Just curious.


Cup

[eugeneel]

I sent you the message. You have made me a total of 124.76 in 2 and a half weeks.

I sent you half of that as that is the deal.

I do not owe you the other half as that is MY share (that is my inscentive for doing this with you.)

I let another player sign up under your tracker because you told me you will definitly not be playing on empire any more.

You are
1) either trying to blackmail me for 64.00 or
2) you made a mistake about how this deal worked. Go back and read the first message I sent you which sais I give you half of what I make on you. (therefore 10-15% of your rakes back because the sites pay me 20-30% of the rake for the players I send them)

Either way I don't want to deal with you any further and am not obligated to as you have clearely told me you will not be playing on empire any longer.

best of luck,
-Eugene

[ThingDo]

Whatever you say good buddy, I'm sure it was fun for you while it lasted. /images/graemlins/wink.gif GL With yours.

[Jim Kuhn]

Couldn't this have been resolved in the same manner via email? Just wondering...............

[ThingDo]

I tryed that. Not e-mail, but PM's over 2+2. I'm not posting here so I can get the money he owes me... I'm posting here so he can't take anyone elses money. I don't want him to benefit off of anyone else if he isn't going to follow up on his side of the agreement... it was more of a warning/venting session than anything else. Didn't mean to spam... oh well

[Homer]

Can you make it more clear what part of the agreement eugeneel has broken? For example:

- Where are you getting the numbers for the amount of rake you have paid? Poker Tracker?

- What is the total rake you believe you have paid?

- How much have you been paid by eugeenel?

-- Thanks, Homer

[ThingDo]

I told Eugenell that I would be cashing out of Empire to get back on to Party Poker. So, I would not be under his program anymore and asked for the money to be transfered to my party poker account. Eugenell told me he owed me $129. He told me he would pay me half now and half the following week. He did in fact pay me the first 64.50, but never payed me the other half. Thus owing me $64.50. I didn't track anything thru pokertracker, as I had no reason not to believe his figures. The amount I thought I was owed was the figure that Eugenell said he owed me ( 129.00 ). That amount was the amount that he owed ME after his "cut".

[Homer]

Okay, thanks. If you have the e-mail / PM in which this was stated I think you should post it here (others might disagree, however).

-- Homer

[ThingDo]

I wish I could ( and this is going to make it sound like I don't have it obviously ) but I deleted it thinking it wasn't importent at the time. That'll teach me to trust someone with money. Oh well, as far as people disagreeing ..all I have to say about that is: just think before you trust someone regardless of how long you've known the person. Just because they sound friendly online doesnt mean they will help you in anyway.

[eugeneel]

The reason you won't post the PM is because on October 15th I clearly said that you have MADE ME 128.00 in rake and I said I will pay you what I owed you now (which was 54 dollars ahead of the time when I usually pay everyone so to establish a sense of trust) and pay you whatever I owed you at the end of the month. when I wrote you this message you have MADE ME $128, I did not OWE YOU $128. I pay you HALF of what I make from you... not the full amount and I everyone I offer this deal to knows this including you. I make 20-30% on the players I refer and I give half of it back to the players not the full amount.

Anyway on the same day you have told me that you were finished with empirepoker.com and you have not played since. Is there anything else you disagree with or not understand?

You made an extra 64 dollars from me in 2 weeks because you generated $640 in profits for Empirepoker.com. If you cleared 100 in the deposit bonus during this time for example then the profits for empire have gone down by 100

That is all my deal promises for empire (10% of what you make the casino back to my players) and that is all I paid you.

If anyone is still confused let me know. I have no reason to cheat my players and will defend myself on this issue.

I guess you were confused when I said you made me $128 and you automatically thought that I owe you $128 when according to the deal I owe you half of what I make.

[ThingDo]

Right Eugenell... we both know what you said. You can keep lying to yourself and others to keep me off your back and the people under your program happy. It will come back to you in the long run. I didn't post this here to get anything I didn't deserve out of you. I didn't post this epxecting to get the money that you owed me. Why should you give me something you don't owe me after all? lol. What a joke. I am not a complete moron. I know what you said. You gave me a figure and you told me you would pay me that amount... thats all I needed to know so I didn't ask any other questions. Maybe you typed it wrong. Or maybe you are just a scum bag con artist that will get whats coming to him in the long run. Good luck with what you have going now... I'm sure you've made enough money that you can do whatever you want /images/graemlins/wink.gif



SRMJR.

[eugeneel]

u seriosly think I would want to ruin my image here on 2+2 in order to save 64.00 dollars???

Yoy played for 2 and a half weeks... Thank of how much you would have needed to play in order to be raked $1280 in that much time If you really got raked 1280.00 dollars then you would diserve 128 in rake rebate for me.
Ask your self if you played that much and then tell me I ripped you off in any way.

[DougBrennan]

I used to wonder how telephone pitches stayed in business. Who could fall for that kind of garbage? Now I think I know where their clients come from.

[ThingDo]

Yes, I'm a moron. I'm not going to prove or disprove anything else. I think I got my point across. Which was basically... if you are a moron like me its easy for people to take you.

[jek187]

[ QUOTE ]
u seriosly think I would want to ruin my image here on 2+2 in order to save 64.00 dollars???


[/ QUOTE ]

Honestly Eugueneel, what kind of image do you think you have here?

[ZeeJustin]

This all seems pretty clear to me. ThingDo is obviously at fault here.
1) His posts are very unclear as to what happenned, and they do not offer any details.
2) He has no proof what so ever.
3) There is enough confusion in his posts to think that he never understood Eugene's very standard deal.
4) He is bitching over an amount that is only a very very small percent of Eugene's income.
5) He obviously didn't take much caution in reading the "fine print" if he doesn't know if Eugene is a man or woman (read the first post again).

For the record, I did not know Eugene at all before I started posting here. I took him up on his rake offer, and after the first month I asked him about working out payment. I told him how much money I thought I had earned (based on poker tracker), and he told me that I really earned almost double that due to the way Party calculates rake. So far he has paid me the money he's owed me in a very timely fashion, as well as offered me a lot of advice on game selection and shorthanded play. I have found Eugeneel to be a very honost person.

ThingDo, if you *really* are not to blame here, put up some numbers. How many hands did you play at what stakes w/ how many players? We can use that to estimate the approximate rake that you have payed. Obviously this isn't as cut and dry as a PM would be, but you have to give us something to work with if you want us to believe you.

[MicroBob]

indeed, i am not very familiar with either party involved here but it seems obvious to me that eugene has very little to gain by scamming thing.

when thing responds along the lines of "whatever!! you know what you said to me" i am inclined to think there was nothing more than a misunderstanding taken out of proportion.

i had previously been considering taking eugene up on his offer and this little situation has done little to disaude me. if eugene was really ripping people off i suspect we wold have read about it before now.

[CrackerZack]

Either way its not a very good deal. 50% for you for doing nothing.

[eugeneel]

Good deal or not it's still extra money going into your pocket at the beginning of every month.
If you can find someone that will definitely pay you, track how much you make to the penny and give you a higher percent then by all means go with them.

[Inthacup]

hmmm, pokerfunn registered today and has made 2 posts, both defending Eugene. I'm just wondering if this is Eugene himself or if it's a friend of his that he asked to make these posts for him.


One thing I'm still curious about is why Eugene only gets 20% of the rake back from Empire. The standard deal is 25%.

[eugeneel]

Yeah I don't know what to tell you about that. I know that's exactly what you would think here too, but wouldn't it be too obvious if I did do that?

It's probobly someone that knows me from the tables, but I don't know who he is right now.

Pokerfun who are you exactly?