does depositing $9900 to my check account seem fishy to the bank+gov?

[NLfool]

I had cashed out a decent portion of my bankroll and usually everything is done through neteller for under 2k. Everything larger I want a check sent to me and after a couple of weeks my $9900 cashout check arrives. Now does such a deposit look too weird to the bank. I was going to cashout my entire roll of 12k at party since I've been taking 2 and 3 outer beats every other hand I've played but I figured with a 10k+ deposit my bank is required to report it to the gov. Does $9900 peak their interest more or do they not care unless it is over 10k.

[LondonBroil]

It shouldn't matter, as long as you pay taxes on it.

[Frozen]

I highly doubt the bank reports this amount to the government. Your real risk isn't the bank telling the goverment, but if you get selected for a random audit, you'll have to explain the deposit. Endorsing the check to someone you trust with very low audit risk, to deposit to their account may be your best bet. Playing & cashing out under the name of someone who lives overseas is even better...

The USA was founded on tax rebellion.

[Cyndie]

There is a $3000 threshold on cash transactions, but the reporting requirements are not as strict.

[J.R.]

What about merely cashing the check? I pay my taxes, but am baffled at why this isn't a suggested answer to these questions, which leads me to believe there is some method by which the checks one cashes would be easily idetified in the case of an audit.

[Graham]

Endorsing the check to someone you trust with very low audit risk, to deposit to their account may be your best bet. Playing & cashing out under the name of someone who lives overseas is even better...


You can trust me with your $9900... /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[Wake up CALL]

The $10,000 reporting requirement has additional caveats. If the institution cashing/depositing the check has a resaon to believe the money has either been obtained through illegal means, it may be part of a money laundring scheme or it is in an amount intended to circumvent the required report they are then required to report the transaction. Most institutions will err on the side of caution (particularly these days) and report any transaction (no matter the amount) which falls into any gray area whatsoever. IMHO your $9900 check will likely fall into this "gray area" at most institutons.

A question, why give up the 10% interest at Party? Or was your account established too late to take advantage of this offer?

[doormat]

Reporting requirements are for cash, or cash "instruments" like traveller's checks or cashiers checks. Depositing a personal check does not trigger a report, regardless of amount. Cashing a check for 9900 is indeed suspicious and may be reported at the discretion of the bank. Any cash transactions over a certain amount (which I believe is either 2500 or 3000) is supposed to require the bank to keep an internal record in case you make several such transactions to avoid the 10000 rule. Banks vary in their enforcement of this. I believe the worst crime you can commit with regard to money laundering is "structuring", which is intentionally disguising your transactions to avoid reporting. You are better off just generating a report - there are millions of these reported every year and as long as you claim the money it is no big deal.

doormat

[hehateme]

[ QUOTE ]
Reporting requirements are for cash, or cash "instruments" like traveller's checks or cashiers checks. Depositing a personal check does not trigger a report, regardless of amount. Cashing a check for 9900 is indeed suspicious and may be reported at the discretion of the bank. Any cash transactions over a certain amount (which I believe is either 2500 or 3000) is supposed to require the bank to keep an internal record in case you make several such transactions to avoid the 10000 rule. Banks vary in their enforcement of this. I believe the worst crime you can commit with regard to money laundering is "structuring", which is intentionally disguising your transactions to avoid reporting. You are better off just generating a report - there are millions of these reported every year and as long as you claim the money it is no big deal.

doormat

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not quite sure what you mean by "generating a report". Do you mean just don't worry about it and don't file? Or just pay up like you're suppposed to?

Say he were to get audited and they say he owes taxes on those moneys. If there was no sign of evasion, like structuring, would he just pay up and move on? Or would there be strict financial penalties/criminal punishment for messing up the first time? Thanks for your post, I think this is a good issue for winning players to discuss, and still can't seem to get a solid answer out of anyone.

[NLfool]

It's a one time thing but all the culmulative neteller deposits for 1k, 500 etc might raise some eyebrows. Neteller is a canadian company so they won't say anything. Hopefully my bank won't care

[doormat]

The reports are called CTR (cash transaction reports) and they go to the criminal investigation division of the IRS. Sounds ominous, but as I said there are millions of these filed every year. It isn't against the law (yet) to have cash, so as long as you pay your taxes on money that is reported you will have no problem. The actual filing of the report does not classify you as a criminal, it just lets the IRS know to expect to see it on your return. I know many blackjack players that have to deal with these reports on a regular basis. Their problem is that they may have to fill out reports on hundreds of thousands of dollars of 10K transactions, making it look like they have earned that much, when in actuality most of it is the same money declared over and over again buying in at various casinos. If you are in this kind of situation you better have good records.

doormat

[MicroBob]

i dont think it looks particuarly fishy.
seems to me you're probably a pretty good player.....not fishy in the least.
Har Har Har Har Har!!!!!!!!
sorry, couldn't resist.

otherwise, informative thread guys.

[eugeneel]

I only read the first post.

As far as what I have been told by the bank manager at fleet. Only CASH deposits over 10k are investigated by the gov't. I deposited a 9k check before and have not had any questions asked.

[skaboomizzy]

I work as a bank teller... the posters here are right on the button. The $10,000 CTR report is for CASH or cash-like items (money orders, cashier checks, etc). A personal check made out to you is solid.

If you walked in with a duffel bag full of $9500 in cash five straight days, they'd have some questions for you. But you're perfectly fine in this situation.

[lefty rosen]

These deposits won't be suspicious if you routinely deposit amounts like this in there, but if you have been deposting pay cheque or small netteller cheques then you could be red flagged. I remember a guy who I knew who played roulette at the local casino in my city telling me because he was young and black and won large a few times that whenever he went to his bank with these winnings he had to explain to the teller why he had a few 1000 dollar bills(they were discontinued 2 years back because of potential money laundering).

[Frozen]

[ QUOTE ]
These deposits won't be suspicious if you routinely deposit amounts like this in there, but if you have been deposting pay cheque or small netteller cheques then you could be red flagged. I remember a guy who I knew who played roulette at the local casino in my city telling me because he was young and black and won large a few times that whenever he went to his bank with these winnings he had to explain to the teller why he had a few 1000 dollar bills(they were discontinued 2 years back because of potential money laundering).

[/ QUOTE ]

Lefty, I think your friend was just bullsh*ting you.
The government stopped printing $1,000 bills back in the Great Depression. Buying one as a collector's item will cost $1,200 at minimum. No way a 'local casino' paid him in G notes.

[Frozen]

...also, he may not have won as much money as is commonly believed. I think the media has been very desirous that a black roulette player do well.

(In order to help make this post flame resistant, I should point out that I'm kidding, and do not agree with Rush Limbaugh's idiotic statement.)

[NLfool]

I guess I'll go direct deposit EFT with neteller if there is a next time. /images/graemlins/smile.gif GL at the tables.

[lefty rosen]

I am Canadian, and I remember the day they announced the stop of the printing of the bills and I have seen guys getting paid them, and they always had sad looks in their faces like they were stuck........

[goodguy_1]

Biggest ,
Instead of making one or two large cashouts every quarter say.I always EFT my monthly nut for living expenses to my Wachovia checking account.For me that's about 2K per month.Once or twice a month if I'm running real good I will EFT 1K-3K also back to my checking account.Always trying to keep ~ 2K in Neteller for flexibilty.I filed in 1994/1995/1996 as a professional poker player.Last year I filed my first online winnings but I traded equities more last year than I played poker.This year I will again file as a pro.
Pay your fuggin taxes and use all the deductions you can.Cindy is very knowledgable on this.Eugene and Frozen cut the disingenuis bullcrap PAY UP or get the fock outta the country.

[Cyndie]

Thank you, have been self-employed for most of thirty years. Have learned that the key to doing your own taxes is to look things up...IRS has actually made it easy to read instructions on all their forms online.

The other key is to have multiple business opportunities, because that allows more things to be legitimate business deductions. There are guidelines for what portions of things are deductible, but most travel for a poker player is legitimately deductible if you just do what comes naturally....stop by a casino when you see one...find the ATM...mark on it what game you played...If you really feel zealous, get a floor man to initial it. Just tell him you want his autograph...

The limitations for food are somewhat complicated, but most of us get comps anyway...or should, just be friendly, and be sure to ask what the policy is when you first walk in the door. Really aggravating to play for five hours and then find that all the comps were just given away...and you are too late!

If you have a newer car...actual costs may be higher than the mileage allowance, but if you have an older car, and maintain it very very well, you can find that you will make a lot of money driving to the regional casinos...For long trips, rent a car; it will be very easy to deduct those costs totally. Of course hotel and tips and parking and all the things that are needed for an extended trip to the casino...Fanny pack, mints, gum, everything that you use exclusively for a trip to the casino...specialized clothing that you only wear to play poker...vest with pockets, walking shoes that you need to traipse those long walks from the parking lots...Everything.

Do your taxes two ways, the first way is to deduct everything you possibly can, cable to your home...every kind of office supply, fax machine for those nasty driver's license faxes, newspaper, most of your phone, all your long distance calls, and your cell phone "If in doubt, Deduct!"

Then go back and deduct only the sure-fire minimum...if you have w-2 income, do it the 1040 and Schedule A method...then when you see how much Uncle Sam might want, start an IRA, and a SEP or a KEOGH, or whatever the acronym is for a savings plan that is non taxable if you make a lot, but be sure to check out the ROTH IRA's if you get your income down to a very little amount...this might happen if you drive a lot or buy a lot of computer equipement, or spemd some money doing a professional website. The ROTH IRA is one where you pay taxes on it now, and then you don't have to later. This can be wonderful if you are in your twenties and leave money to accumulate for 40 years and then have no tax liability on it.

Be absolutely certain to pay some social security taxes. The very best investment there is is to have 40 quarters of the lower end of the social security retirement plan. It is definitely subsidized by the corporate wonks who pay through the nose for their great careers. They easily pay $4,000 per year, and they only pay half of the bill for social security. If you get your taxes down to the $15,000 range, and have kids, you can easily get an earned income credit that pays your social security, with room left over. It is not hard to live a fine life on $15,000 taxable income per year, if your home is paid for and your car is paid for. I know, I have done it.

There is so much more to deduct...Web Cameras, digital cameras, camcorders, all sorts of equipment that can be used to make fine web pages. Television to watch the WPT, but remember you can only deduct the percentage of time that the equipment is used for business.

Make sure you have two computers...one for your family and one exclusively for poker. IRS used to be quite fussy about exclusive use of computers for business. However, the deductibility of your main piece of equipment that really needs updating regularly to take advantage of multiple screens and great video and tons of ram, will never be disallowed.

Adde was exactly right when he said...save the questionable amount so that you are not caught short if Uncle Sam audits you. And Please, Buy a home and fix it up and sell it every couple years and pocket the profit totally tax free!

[Your Mom]

Banks keep internal records of cash transactions over $3000. Banks must file a Currency Transaction Report (CTR) for cash transactions over $10,000. If a customer conducts cash transactions just under $10,000, this is called structuring. Banks will usually choose to file a Suspicious Activity Report (SAR) with the government if they suspect structuring. If you are depositing checks, banks may catch on and file a SAR, but if it is not very often, then I doubt your bank will notice. Reports aren't normally filed for deposited checks.

P.S. I work for one of the country's largest banks so I have some idea of what I am talking about.

[goodguy_1]

How about EFT's on a regular basis in smaller increments like $1K-$3K...how do banks treat these?

[Cyndie]

I have heard that there are red flags that get put on your tax returns if you have an offsore bank account...I believe you have to check a box somewhere and that supposedly makes you more likely for an audit...is this true?

Thank you for confirmation on the $3,000 threshold too

[soooted]

Open an online checking account with Netbank or E-Trade. These types of checking accounts have a lot more EFT's on a regular basis. For example, if I want to deposit $ to one of these accounts, instead of mailing in a check (which takes time to get there), I deposit it in my local bank and perform an online EFT xfer from my local bank to my 'net bank.

The online banks encourage use of EFT's so my theory is frequent EFT's from poker sites are more likely to go unnoticed.

[Your Mom]

I don't really know how banks handle EFT's. I'm only a teller so that sort of thing is done at a level higher than your local branch at a bigger bank like ours. I'll do some investigating.

[Wake up CALL]

[ QUOTE ]
Banks keep internal records of cash transactions over $3000. Banks must file a Currency Transaction Report (CTR) for cash transactions over $10,000. If a customer conducts cash transactions just under $10,000, this is called structuring. Banks will usually choose to file a Suspicious Activity Report (SAR) with the government if they suspect structuring. If you are depositing checks, banks may catch on and file a SAR, but if it is not very often, then I doubt your bank will notice. Reports aren't normally filed for deposited checks.

P.S. I work for one of the country's largest banks so I have some idea of what I am talking about.

[/ QUOTE ]

Below is a link to the FDIC regulations requiring a Suspicious Activity Report to be generated:

SAR (http://www.fdic.gov/regulations/laws/rules/8000-1500.html)

IRS and Money Laundering (http://www.irs.gov/irs/article/0,,id=112224,00.html)

IRS Gambling Income and Expenses (http://www.irs.gov/newsroom/article/0,,id=108277,00.html)

These links combined with the links contained within the IRS documents will answer any gambling related income/expense questions.